Traffic Alerting Systems

[jbDC9]

Originally Posted by Walt

I didn't want any more boxes sitting on my glareshield, no more panel room and no extra antennas to install.

Ditto. I'd love to have a Zaon XRX, but it's so freakin' big I don't want it up on my glareshield right in my line of sight. On a side by side ship it'd be okay I'm sure, you could offset it a bit out of the way, but on an -8, it's right in the middle, in the way. I know the MRX doesn't have the azimuth info, but it's small, unobtrusive, and better than nothing at all. As long as it gets your attention and gets you looking outside... I'm thinking I might have to get one.

[Brantel]

Originally Posted by az_gila

If one is saying a target within a 45 degree sector, and the other is saying a direct bearing but with a +/- 22.5 degree accuracy...

Well I thought about that but Zaon's normal built in screen can do 45? and they claim higher resolution when using an external screen so they must be claiming better than +-22.5?, more like +-11.25? which Dynon says is not possible using the Garmin TIS protocol so ????????

[Brantel]

You know you guys may be onto how I might have misunderstood what Dynon was talking about.

They may have been referring to target heading limitations and not target bearing. Zaon does not output target heading at all so this must be my mistake.

Here is what they said on their forum:

"As an FYI, the Garmin TIS protocol stinks. It only allows resolution of 45 degrees on targets, even if the device knows them down to a degree. Because of this, things like the Zaon and our Transponder don't use the Garmin TIS protocol when talking to SkyView. "

I do not know if they are right or wrong so please do not think I am supporting Dynon on their statement above.

Question is, does the Garmin TIS implementation follow the TIS standard quoted below? If so, Dynon must be incorrect or they are talking about target heading not bearing to target data.

Originally Posted by az_gila

If one is saying a target within a 45 degree sector, and the other is saying a direct bearing but with a +/- 22.5 degree accuracy...

Originally Posted by mburch

Not quite sure this is true... Mode S TIS traffic data contains somewhat coarse resolution on target heading, but the resolution supported for target bearing is higher than what any passive traffic detector I can think of can output. But as a practical matter, the Zaon products don't output target heading data at all, so this doesn't really matter anyway.

cheers,
mcb

Originally Posted by az_gila

...that this is the maximum accuracy that can be obtained. It's also updated with a possible 6 or 12 second delay...

TIS, through the Mode S ground sensor, provides the following data on each intruder aircraft:

· Relative bearing information in 6-degree increments.

· Relative range information in 1/8-NM to 1‑NM increments (depending on range).

· Relative altitude in 100-foot increments (within 1,000 feet) or 500-foot increments (from 1,000-3,500 feet) if the intruder aircraft has operating altitude reporting capability.

· Estimated intruder ground track in 45-degree increments.

· Altitude trend data (level within 500 fpm or climbing/descending >500 fpm) if the intruder aircraft has operating altitude reporting capability.

· Intruder priority as either a "traffic advisory" or "proximate" intruder.

From here -

http://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/publi...tbarc/03-2.htm

So it's only the ground track of the "intruder" that is in 45 degree increments... and no display can be better than the transmitted data above...

[L.Adamson]

Originally Posted by jbDC9

Ditto. I'd love to have a Zaon XRX, but it's so freakin' big I don't want it up on my glareshield right in my line of sight. On a side by side ship it'd be okay I'm sure, you could offset it a bit out of the way, but on an -8, it's right in the middle, in the way. I know the MRX doesn't have the azimuth info, but it's small, unobtrusive, and better than nothing at all. As long as it gets your attention and gets you looking outside... I'm thinking I might have to get one.

I have the smaller MRX, and it's much better than nothing at all.

L.Adamson --- RV6A

[turbo]

zaon. does all i need in a small, not to expensive, portable, headset audio warning, device. enough info to help keep you alive. love that thing.

[Scrabo]

Is anyone using the XRX with either version of BK's AV8OR units ?

From what I read in the manual, it sounds like once you connect it to any third party unit, the LCD on the XRX unit no longer displays traffic information - is this true ?

[airguy]

Same subject - slightly different tack - what are my options for an existing aircraft adding traffic? I've got a KLN-94, KMD-550 display and KT73 Mode S transponder. As noted above (somewhere) TIS only works in the heavy traffic areas and I spend a lot of time away from those. Getting traffic via another method would be great until ADS-B is a reality.

[mikerkba]

I am satisfied with my panel mounted (single antenna) MRX, though I think it performed as well or better when used as a portable. It was worth the price for the "heads up, start looking harder" sort of warnings it provides.

It does not perform as well as I expected though. The consistent problem is getting ground level "targets" reported when I am < 1500 or 2000 feet AGL. E.g. At 2000 MSL, 1300 AGL, say 4 or 5 miles out from an airport, I'll get targets noted as 1200 or 1300 feet below me, with no change of altitude noted. I don't know if this is signal confusion off my own antenna, reception of some non-aviation signal, or what. Seems to me to happen only over populated areas, so I think it is a ground signal (traffic camera? Microwaves? Paul Story's music systems radiating non-standard signals back to Stein in Minnesota?) But, this means a lack of utility when approaching an airport and in the pattern -- a particularly desirable time to have traffic sensing going on.

FYI: If you permanently install, do the belly antenna installation per the manual. I tried a glareshield mount thinking that if the unit worked in portable form on the glareshield, then it ought to work with the permanent antenna mounted there. I did not. Results were completely unreliable. The manual that comes with the install kit repeatedly states: NO GLARESHIELD MOUNT, but I thought I knew better. Moving the antenna to the belly (near wing root/forward of fuel tank vent) improved results a bunch -- achieving the resulte reported in the paragraphs above.

I will get ADSB once protocol are established and the hardware market is stable. But, I think the MRX is an adequate interim tool and, knowing what I know now, I would use it as a portable.

Mike C.

[Scrabo]

I just purchased the XRX unit yesterday and when it arrives, I will be putting my 9 month old MRX unit up for sale, probably on here and the red board.

Is the XRX Bluelink the only RS232/Bluetooth adapter that will work with the XRX or could any off the shelf adapter work, like from IOGEAR ?

[mv031161]

Between that ZAON....choose the XRX.....the MRX will drive you absolutelly nuts looking out!!!!!!!! with the XRX, at least you can concentrate on one quadrant and if you have it linked to your GPS even better.! I have mine portable and linked to my AVMAP IV and to my 496 depending which aircraft I am flying.... yes is big and I wish it had a USB port instead of a serial, but for the price, you can't beat what it does!

TIS not worth for me at all....TAS Yes but a lot more $$$$