Considering buying this RV-6A project - how much time to finish?

ionstram · #1 07-25-2010, 01:20 PM

I wasn't looking at building a plane - was looking to buy a finished RV-6, but then I came across this project for sale locally to me, in which the builder claims it is "95% finished up to the firewall." It seems ideal because I can put an engine of my choice in it, choose my own paint job, and get exactly the avionics I would like. He is a 75 year old gentleman who unfortunately lost his medical and has decided to sell the project. He claims to have over 1000 hours already invested in building it. There is a Chevy engine installed, but he is not including this and is going to remove it before selling the project. I would put a Lycoming in it. I've attached photos he e-mailed me. Thanks in advance for any feedback - this would be my first build. My building experience so far is limited to Estes model rockets when I was a kid, and a couple of kit-build R/C cars.

I know any time estimate is really, really rough. Is there at least a range people could point me to? As for avionics I'd probably go with a dual screen G3X system or a Dynon skyview, planning later to add a WAAS capable GPS like a Garmin 430 when finances allow.

Here is his e-mailed description of the progress so far:

"I am selling this project because I am 75 years old and can?t get my medical back after a heart attack a few years ago.
Wings are finished with finished tips with all lights including strobes and landing lights. Wings have the
Nav-aid device installed, see details below. Ailerons and Flaps are done. Flaps are electric. Fuel Tanks
are finished.
Horizontal Stabilizer has tips finished and has electric trim. Vertical Stabilizer also has tips top and
bottom finished.
Gear and brakes are installed and brake lines installed. Gear legs have fairings. The flaps are electric.
All cockpit panels have been fitted and installed. This includes the seats. (No upholstery) At this time they are not in place so as to get to all wiring. I have a wireing diagram but the wiring is not yet in final looms. For final proving purposes.
The instrument panel is upgraded to a fiberglass panel with two sub panels tilted toward pilot. No
upholstery yet. Instruments are the standard ones plus, Navaid device (see below), Apollo GX65 (see below), Lift Reserve indicator (see below), Military style flood lite adjustable to spot or flood, white or red. Military style stick grip with switches, Wig-wag for landing lights.
About 1,000 or more hours invested in assembly.
The engine is an alternative one which will be removed at the time the aircraft is sold, as it balances the aircraft so it can be moved on its wheels. Each wing is mounted separately on a 4 wheel dolly for easy transportation."

Photos at the link below:

http://s826.photobucket.com/albums/z...-6A%20Project/

Thanks!

hydroguy2 · #2 07-25-2010, 01:39 PM

3 yrs or more for a first time builder would be my guess, depending on skills and commitment.

ionstram · #3 07-25-2010, 01:43 PM

3 years????

Well thanks for the dose of reality! I was hoping more like 3 weeks.

Seriously, I would make this a full time job and plan on putting in 50 hour weeks til finished, probably with the help of an experienced builder or at least my uncle (private pilot who taught wood and metal shop for many years - he's good with building stuff).

Maybe I should just go back to the original plan of getting a flying plane and then putting in a glass panel down the road.

hydroguy2 · #4 07-25-2010, 01:48 PM

Full time job with no distraction or waiting for parts along with a qualified builder assist you could cut down the time considerably....But there is some serious work ahead on that plane.

Kyle Boatright · #5 07-25-2010, 02:00 PM

Depends on how much you work on it and how crazy you get with your panel. If you spend 10-20 hours a week, it could easily be done inside a year.

I figure you have;

100 hours - Canopy
100 hours - Firewall forward.
200 hours - Fiberglass - cowling, wheel pants, gear leg fairings.
50 - 250 hours - panel and electrical work.
0-150 hours - Paint (are you painting it or hiring it done?).
Final Assembly - 50 hours.

Total: 500 - 850 hours.

If you take this challenge, take a couple of experienced RV builders to give the project an in-depth inspection before you buy it. Also, find a building buddy or two who'll come by from time to time so you can bounce questions off of 'em. Feedback on these forums is great, but in-person feedback is much more valuable.

Again, get some experienced builders to look at the project before you make a committment. It's easy to overlook things that would be obvious to an experienced builder.

Sam Buchanan · #6 07-25-2010, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ionstram

3 years????

Well thanks for the dose of reality! I was hoping more like 3 weeks.

Seriously, I would make this a full time job and plan on putting in 50 hour weeks til finished, probably with the help of an experienced builder or at least my uncle (private pilot who taught wood and metal shop for many years - he's good with building stuff).

Maybe I should just go back to the original plan of getting a flying plane and then putting in a glass panel down the road.

You are probably going to have at least as many hours invested in research and education as actual construction. The learning curve for a novice builder jumping into an advanced project will be very, very steep.

If you want to build for the next year or so, this may be a good project. If you want to fly, best to pass on this one and purchase a complete plane.

jcaplins · #7 07-25-2010, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kyle Boatright

100 hours - Canopy
100 hours - Firewall forward.
200 hours - Fiberglass - cowling, wheel pants, gear leg fairings.
50 - 250 hours - panel and electrical work.
0-150 hours - Paint (are you painting it or hiring it done?). (later)
Final Assembly - 50 hours.

Total: 500 - 850 hours. (?)

(subtract the things in red)

My opinion may not matter, since I havn't finished one. (BUT).....

3 years seems too long of an estimate. A novice builder could finish one from scratch in that time. Your time to complete the project would be a matter of your motivation, diligence and budget.
You may spend a long time just waiting for an engine or avionics.

Do a through inventory of what needs to be done and make an estimate based on your experience dealing with those elements (engine work, fiberglass, etc.)

Danny7 · #8 07-25-2010, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcaplins

(subtract the things in red)

My opinion may not matter, since I havn't finished one. (BUT).....

3 years seems too long of an estimate. A novice builder could finish one from scratch in that time. Your time to complete the project would be a matter of your motivation, diligence and budget.
You may spend a long time just waiting for an engine or avionics.

Do a through inventory of what needs to be done and make an estimate based on your experience dealing with those elements (engine work, fiberglass, etc.)

he doesn't have any experience.

hydroguy2 · #9 07-25-2010, 03:34 PM

Jeff, why would you subtract those hours? finished airplanes have canopies, fairings and paint.

And I agree a novice builder MAY be able to complete one in 3yrs, but it is not the norm. Also as Sam noted, the learning curve is steep at this point and the instructions vague. A novice doesn't know, what he doesn't know.

I see a novice needing 500+hrs to FINISH that plane. Even if he has decent skills, knows exactly what to do next, no questions to ask and sticks to his 50hr work week, he'll need 3 months....no delays on parts. no taking a day off for family. But then IF he gets some really quality consistent help, those numbers could fall. But he'll still be looking at months and lots of money to speed things up.

YMMV, Mine is not finished either, but heck I've had to wait on my seats for 2 months, engine took 6 months, prop 9 months. So he needs to make all those decisions the day he buys the project and get that stuff heading to his shop. Anyway sorry potentially gloomy outlook, but building your 1st RV is no place to rush things. Plus you can buy one cheaper than you can build it these days

ionstram · #10 07-25-2010, 03:38 PM

Thank you all very much for the replies and the insight - I really appreciate it.

I think this seals my decision - something that looks like it could stretch to 1000 hours is not my idea of a good time, when I could be spending that time flying, working on additional ratings, etc.

My initial impressions were maybe 200-300 hours, which I see as do-able for me.

But there is just something really appealing about "rolling my own" so to speak.

Thanks for the replies! I'm gonna pass on this, but for those of you who may find this project appealing, the owner has it up on Barnstormers and is asking $20K for it, which includes everything in the photos except for the engine.