It's all downhill for RV builders!

pierre smith · #1 03-05-2010, 06:57 AM

Early this morning, over a cup of coffee and the new Sport Aviation magazine, I realized just what an incredibly steep, uphill climb it is for some experimental builders.

A gentleman in the San Francisco Bay area built a Spencer Air car, 4 place amphibious pusher airplane from plans, in a 300 sq. foot back yard and an 800' apartment!!

He had no kits, no factory support and no forums and he'd never built an airplane either. He didn't know how to weld, which he had to learn, nor had he done any fiberglass work or aircraft woodwork, where he had to make every rib, spaced 1 foot apart, by routing each one.

Ten years later, he flew it to Oshkosh, after sewing his own interior, learning to paint, learn to wire the systems, doing even that himself, and we wonder if we can build an RV!!

For us, it's all downhill from day 1. For him, it was all uphill from day 1.
The things we have to do to get flying is oh-so-much simpler. Look at the article and feel blessed, since you'll easily see how easy we really have it.

Best,

Steve A · #2 03-05-2010, 08:06 AM

Pierre,
I agree with everything you said about how amazing some of the builders are and what they do to finally complete their planes. I think living in SF, you don't have the room to really spread the project out. I had a very large garage, one reason living in Louisiana, the land is cheap and therefore a large garage is not uncommon. One thing about working in a small space, you have to be organized. With a large space, I could let one project sit on a work table while I went to work on something else. I keep stuff all over because I had the room.

Subscribing to Sport Aviation is great as you see how difficult it is for most builders. One statistic I heard was RV builders have a much higher completion rate. The general completion rate of a homebuilt project is about 10%. RV builders are much higher completion rate but part of that is once one builder gives up, there are others who take over the project and finish it. Also as you allude to, having a resource like Van's technical support, this forum, and the espirit des corps of the RV fraternity all make the process easier.

Like I tell my kids, if it was harder I would not have done it and if it was easier, I would have got bored and quit.

Pierre, I have 100 hours on my plane and I have you in my head every landing, as a result of transition training. Is there any way to get that voice out? Just kidding, it is a good thing.

S S Anderson
RV 7A Flying
Lafayette, La.

JDRhodes · #3 03-05-2010, 08:35 AM

Dad built a Long EZ from 1980 - 1985. I was a kid at the time. The plans were considered revolutionary at the time because they were more than simple blueprints. They were laid out in a logical step by step order.

Beyond that, though, the airplane was completely built by hand. Metal fixtures were cut out with a hacksaw and the airframe was built with blue or green styrofoam, fiberglass cloth and epoxy. It took more than 4 years of steady work.

The RV was much easier.

Jim P · #4 03-05-2010, 08:49 AM

Doug Palmer's Aircar in this issue is simply amazing, both from a craftsmanship and complexity perspective. I was at Half Moon Bay when that project was in progress and his workmanship is purely outstanding (Doug was also a finish carpenter by trade as well as photographer), especially when considering the poor quality of plans and a very limited builder community. An RV is really a set of tinker-toys when compared to the work that had to go into Doug's amphib! I'm disappointed that EAA put a Husky on skis on the cover instead of the the Spencer; there were a hundred air-to-air photos taken, most of which would have been suitable for cover material. It's really a testiment to what a builder can do when they put the effort into learning the skills and doing their best and the Spencer is really what EAA is all about.

rocketbob · #5 03-05-2010, 09:02 AM

Can anyone tell me why that airplane was not on the cover of Sport Aviation, but a factory-built was (a sweepstakes airplane no less)...?

I think there should be a rule we should all petition the EAA for....only experimentals on the SA cover.

aerhed · #6 03-05-2010, 09:10 AM

I'm with goofy Bob on this one. The Husky on the cover just shows that the fix is in. Of course if you've seen the factory, you'd know that a Husky is just a homebuilt with a bunch of people working on it.

Auburntsts · #7 03-05-2010, 09:20 AM

I don't have any issue with the Husky on the front cover mainly because it is the EAA sweepstakes plane. Otherwise I'm in sort of agreement in that it shouldn't be a current production aircraft unless it's an LSA. Limiting it to only an E-AB flies in the face of what EAA is trying to do with SA's new format (which I love). My only gripe is I wish they would have posted at least twice as many pics of the Spencer in the article. I really wanted to see more of this outstanding example of such a rare bird.

Christopher Murphy · #8 03-05-2010, 09:20 AM

I am glad there are kit planes out there to build but I really appreaciate the guy who scratch builds an airplane. If you look at and read the regulations that your RV is licenced under you will understand why the FAA keeps reviewing the 51% rule. I am glad Sport Aviation magazine is finally starting to focus on the builders of airplanes instead of featuring a 400k Glasair 3 that somebody hired out to be built. Building experimental airplanes is about learning skills and using them to build an airplane.
Chris M

aerhed · #9 03-05-2010, 09:42 AM

"I don't have any issue with the Husky on the front cover mainly because it is the EAA sweepstakes plane. Otherwise I'm in sort of agreement in that it shouldn't be a current production aircraft unless it's an LSA. Limiting it to only an E-AB flies in the face of what EAA is trying to do with SA's new format (which I love). "

OK, I'll give you that that one.

jchang10 · #10 03-05-2010, 11:42 AM

Absolutely mind blowing and more so in person! The attention to detail is astounding. Every time I look at it, i see something new that blows my mind away, because i know how much effort was involved. He had to fabricate EVERYTHING himself from stock materials and figure it out from some crappy blueprints. It still blows my mind away. Here are some other details i know of:

- after forming the main windshield, the optics had become distorited. Thus, he went thru several rounds of sanding and smoothing to get it back to optically clear again. look at how much glass there is.

- hand stitched leather adorning interior items. stitching is clearly visible and aesthetic.

- remember, it's a retractable seaplane, above and beyond our Van's models.

- this is his FIRST build!!! in fact, he didn't get his Private until a year or so before first flight.

- hand made mahogany interior panels, stained, clear finished. i don't have any furniture as fine as this. here's another photo that shows that wood detail

- buying a leather sewing machine, so he could make his own upholstery.

- this could be a really really long list.

When I first met Doug, i thought, holy ****, you've been working on this beast for 10 years?! At the time, I thought I might finish my -10 in 3 or 4 years, like others had.

Now, 5 years into my build and who knows how many more to go, I am thinking, how the heck did it ONLY take him 10 years? Now that I know more about what is involved, finishing in that short a time is astounding to me. My biggest challenge with a new part, was opening up a cardboard box and peeling off the blue plastic!