Control Tower Confusion

tinman · #1 02-22-2010, 05:45 AM

Recently, I flew my -8 into a class C airport in order to refresh my radio and procedure skills. It had been 18 years since my last controlled airspace encounter, so I was working hard to get it right. The inbound leg was uneventful. I taxied over to the GA area and shut down long enough to gather my wits and to prepare for the departure process. After talking with Clearance Delivery and Ground, I was taxied to an intersection and instructed to hold short of the runway. There was a LONG line of arrivals and after almost 15 minutes of holding, I was asked by Tower if I could execute an expedited departure. I replied that I could?and just sat there waiting on the magic words which never came. Finally, I asked Tower if they actually wanted me to go, and they said yes. I am still waiting on the magic words?nothing?
I then ask Tower ?Is 451BZ cleared for takeoff on runway xx??. Tower came back with the magic words- ?451BZ cleared for takeoff on xx.? which I read back, then took the runway and scooted on out of there.
The point of the post is to remind everyone, if in doubt, ask. I didn?t think that I had been given permission to enter the runway and it took two questions from me to get what I wanted to hear from Tower before I felt that I was actually cleared onto the runway. It just didn?t feel right.

Geico266 · #2 02-22-2010, 06:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tinman

The point of the post is to remind everyone, if in doubt, ask. I didn?t think that I had been given permission to enter the runway and it took two questions from me to get what I wanted to hear from Tower before I felt that I was actually cleared onto the runway. It just didn?t feel right.

Seems like you did pretty good for an 18 years gap.

pierre smith · #3 02-22-2010, 06:32 AM

....Don, in that they asked you a question..."can you do an expedited take-off?"....they didn't clear you. The controller may have had a bad night

Best,

Mel · #4 02-22-2010, 06:47 AM

Never taxi onto that active runway without hearing the "magic words". And visually checking traffic for yourself.

terrykohler · #5 02-22-2010, 07:11 AM

Our ATC systems is undergoing the biggest influx of new people since the days of Reagan. I believe we have at least 6 trainees assigned to the tower at KPTK, and FAA.gov is listing jobs available all over the country in ATC. They are being supervised, but mistakes happen. Good post. It you're not sure, whether on the ground or in the sky, ASK. Even when you're cleared onto an active runway, check the sky. The system is pretty reliable, but it requires our active participation as well.
Terry, CFI
RV-9A N323TP

tinman · #6 02-22-2010, 07:28 AM

The controller did say a soft "thank you" over the radio as I rotated...didn't know if that was for getting off the ground so quick or for not creating a mess on the runway...

N8RV · #7 02-22-2010, 07:37 AM

Can you imagine the trouble you'd have been in if you'd just taken his request as a clearance and taxied out onto the runway ... and unseen traffic became an issue?

You done good.

Alan Carroll · #8 02-22-2010, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tinman

There was a LONG line of arrivals and after almost 15 minutes of holding, I was asked by Tower if I could execute an expedited departure. I replied that I could?and just sat there waiting on the magic words which never came. Finally, I asked Tower if they actually wanted me to go, and they said yes. I am still waiting on the magic words?nothing?
I then ask Tower ?Is 451BZ cleared for takeoff on runway xx??. Tower came back with the magic words- ?451BZ cleared for takeoff on xx.? which I read back, then took the runway and scooted on out of there.

When I was based at the local Class C airport I used to catch controller errors fairly regularly (it became kind of a game actually). Usually very minor ones, like wrong frequency assigned, forgetting which practice approach I had requested, etc. However, I once saw another airplane cross in front of me on an intersecting runway while I was starting my takeoff roll (apparently we had both received the "magic words"). Fortunately timing would have kept us apart, but not a good situation. I suspect that the other pilot started his takeoff a bit later than Tower anticipated.

Bottom line is that controllers are human too, and it pays to keep track of the big picture.

TSwezey · #9 02-22-2010, 07:48 AM

I think this was training weekend and the first weekend in a while where the weather has been nice and everybody was flying. Flying into Jekyll Island yesterday it took me over ten minutes to get through to Jacksonville so I could land. Back into Savannah it took another ten minutes to contact them.

Alan Carroll · #10 02-22-2010, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tinman

The controller did say a soft "thank you" over the radio as I rotated...didn't know if that was for getting off the ground so quick or for not creating a mess on the runway...

Probably for saving his bacon. I have always received courteous replies when asking for clarification of runway-related clearances.