3 Ship Acro - Page 2

Mark Burns · #11 01-03-2010, 07:42 PM

Jerry,
Very nice! Thanks for sharing!

Mark

AZtailwind · #12 01-03-2010, 08:42 PM

that was great!

Paul Thomas · #13 01-03-2010, 10:17 PM

Best motivation video I've seen (and I'm not (yet) an acro pilot)

Andy · #14 01-05-2010, 06:22 PM

I'm sorry that my first real post has to be critical. I just watched this video because I love aerobatics and I'm passionate about formation. Maybe I was a USAF Flight Examiner too long, but three things gave me a "I can't believe I'm watching this" sort of feeling.

1) ALTITUDE. Widget, was that lake Sidney Lanier you guys were flying over? If so, I believe the surface of the lake is 1070' MSL. I lost count of the number of times when your altimeter read 1500' to 1700'. Now, maybe someone changed Part 91 when I wasn't looking, but the min altitude for aerobatics is 1500' AGL. All three of you repeatedly led your flight below the FAR minimum altitude, which makes me think that there was no discussion of a "floor" in your preflight briefing. {Please tell me if you were really over a different lake--with a 0' MSL surface--and I'll gladly withdraw the criticism.}

2) VISUAL LOOKOUT/CLEARING. Maybe you edited out all your good clearing time to keep your viewers from getting dizzy. But the video gives the impression that you almost never checked anything but 12 when you were leading (and even during your free time as #3 in the Cuban 8).

3) LANDING. I could be mistaken here, but the sudden jerk in the video seemed to indicate that you intentionally landed well short of a displaced threshold. As I'm sure you know, you can takeoff from behind a displaced threshold but you can't land short of one. {In your defense, perhaps there was a NOTAM opening the entire surface for landing--I'll take this back if so.}

I'm not trying to embarrass anyone with these observations. But I'm concerned about two things: that younger pilots will take this as a demonstration of the proper way to fly, and that your needlessly low aerobatics will eventually spoil it for the rest of us.

Again, no offense. I'm sure that you and Kahuna and Subob strive for absoute perfection every time you strap into an airplane (otherwise, there's no point in flying). But the lack of discipline evidenced in the video cheapens your efforts and has "amateur pilots" written all over it. In many ways you guys had a great ride; it's a shame to get a Q3 because of things that are so easily avoided.

Respectfully,

Andy

PCHunt · #15 01-06-2010, 02:08 AM

"Andy"

Ballsy posting! You have expressed your opinion very well. (However, I couldn't help but notice that you have left yourself an "out" at every point.)

But who are you? On your Public Profile, you have no "Bio", no "Location", no "Occupation", and not even a "Name!" I might suggest that your words might be more carefully attended to if you had bothered, in the last couple of years of lurking, to identify yourself to some degree.

You unfortunately remind me of too many "examiners" in my past..... Great on the "regs", but couldn't fly a plane without reading the book and flying by the numbers.

I'm sure you will hear stronger words from others.

And what's a Q3, anyway?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy

I'm sorry that my first real post has to be critical. I just watched this video because I love aerobatics and I'm passionate about formation. Maybe I was a USAF Flight Examiner too long, but three things gave me a "I can't believe I'm watching this" sort of feeling.

1) ALTITUDE. Widget, was that lake Sidney Lanier you guys were flying over? If so, I believe the surface of the lake is 1070' MSL. I lost count of the number of times when your altimeter read 1500' to 1700'. Now, maybe someone changed Part 91 when I wasn't looking, but the min altitude for aerobatics is 1500' AGL. All three of you repeatedly led your flight below the FAR minimum altitude, which makes me think that there was no discussion of a "floor" in your preflight briefing. {Please tell me if you were really over a different lake--with a 0' MSL surface--and I'll gladly withdraw the criticism.}

2) VISUAL LOOKOUT/CLEARING. Maybe you edited out all your good clearing time to keep your viewers from getting dizzy. But the video gives the impression that you almost never checked anything but 12 when you were leading (and even during your free time as #3 in the Cuban 8).

3) LANDING. I could be mistaken here, but the sudden jerk in the video seemed to indicate that you intentionally landed well short of a displaced threshold. As I'm sure you know, you can takeoff from behind a displaced threshold but you can't land short of one. {In your defense, perhaps there was a NOTAM opening the entire surface for landing--I'll take this back if so.}

I'm not trying to embarrass anyone with these observations. But I'm concerned about two things: that younger pilots will take this as a demonstration of the proper way to fly, and that your needlessly low aerobatics will eventually spoil it for the rest of us.

Again, no offense. I'm sure that you and Kahuna and Subob strive for absoute perfection every time you strap into an airplane (otherwise, there's no point in flying). But the lack of discipline evidenced in the video cheapens your efforts and has "amateur pilots" written all over it. In many ways you guys had a great ride; it's a shame to get a Q3 because of things that are so easily avoided.

Respectfully,

Andy

ronschreck · #16 01-06-2010, 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy

I'm sorry that my first real post has to be critical. (Snip)

Respectfully,

Andy

"Andy",

I see nothing "respectiful" at all about your post. Please update your profile so we all know who you are, then maybe we can discuss your concerns.

RV8iator · #17 01-06-2010, 09:05 AM

I guess that will be the last entertainment video for me.

Andy, I guess you've never heard of an aerobatic box. Not saying we had one or not, just you don't even offer me the opportunity of "doing it right".

Clearing turns and other stuff edited out, but good comment. Safety is priority number one for us. Head jerking in a video is really distracting.

Landing short of the displaced threshhold. You've got me on that one. At my little airport we are surrounded by trees and mountains and to get a license to operate we have a displaced threshold to keep our 22:1 clearway. When I'm clear of the trees I'd rather have concrete in front of me that behind me.

One thing this really drives home to me.
Glad I got out of the Air Force.

I took the video down because I don't want anyone to think we are promoting anything dangerous. We brief, plan and fly our briefs as everyone who is serious about formation should always do.

Thanks Andy for sharing your concerns and welcome to VAF.

N8RV · #18 01-06-2010, 09:36 AM

Well, Jerry, I wish you hadn't removed the video. I wanted to see it. I'm sure it was worth watching, without causing me to want to run out and do the same thing. I know that I'm not qualified.

I've learned something from participation on other forums -- never respond to anonymous posters. People grow pretty big cojones when they know that they don't have to stand behind their comments.

That said, "Andy" -- whoever you are -- you have a choice here. You can be an asset here on VAF or an a$$. Your choice. You probably have a lot to offer us all from a wealth of experience. However, respect is something that usually has to be earned, and you're not off to a good start.

There's nothing wrong with criticism -- we can all learn from it when offered constructively. There are many here who have participated in the RV community for years who could deliver your same observations without ruffling any feathers. They've earned that right.

I hope you'll hang around and earn the right to challenge the participants in this forum.

Brantel · #19 01-06-2010, 09:40 AM

Jerry,

Please put that video back up...I did not get a chance to see it...

Flying is dangerous. So is walking across the street and driving 75 MPH with opposing 75 MPH traffic just inches away...And we have no idea who is driving that other car or what there state of mind is.

Brantel · #20 01-06-2010, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy

Again, no offense. I'm sure that you and Kahuna and Subob strive for absoute perfection every time you strap into an airplane (otherwise, there's no point in flying). But the lack of discipline evidenced in the video cheapens your efforts and has "amateur pilots" written all over it. In many ways you guys had a great ride; it's a shame to get a Q3 because of things that are so easily avoided.

Andy, Andy, Andy,

Wow....A few minutes of edited video qualifies you to call these guys amateurs?