Dan Lloyd RV-10 "Factual" report out...

[boom3]

Sure a lot of reference to posts and emails in there that are now public record. No surprise and probably very helpful for putting the puzzle together.

[N941WR]

Originally Posted by MSFT-1

I have an RV-10 that I have flown for the last 250 hours.

I simply disagree with the comment that the airplane is fast and slick. I find it to be one of the nicest, well behaved airplanes I have ever flown...

I was the one who said the -10 is fast and slick. If you only have 225 hours TT and that time is in Cessnas and Cherokees, then the -10 is FAST and SLICK.

Granted, I thought the -10 was very easy to fly but then I have a good bit more time and a in a much greater verity of planes than he did.

Add to that the complexity of dealing with an EFIS he did not know or understand and a prop that you must adjust every time you make a power change; then any minor issue could cause him a major speed excursion.

I'm not saying that is what caused this accident, the NTSB will do that.

[JDRhodes]

I thought a Cessna 182 was fast and slick when all I had ever flown were 152's. It's all prospective.

As far as the report - WOW.

[rv6ejguy]

I agree, the RV10 is not much different than flying a Grumman- hardly a handful but you need to be competent in both. Take some training if you are not comfortable. Practice engine out procedures lots and lock best glide speed in your brain.

The propeller system as it was here is no different in operation than the IVO I run or an electric MT in manual mode (often used due to slow pitch response). Lack of electrical power simply means pitch is fixed wherever it is.

Lack of electrical power with no independently wired backup is a big deal as it states in the report- no fuel pumps, no injectors, no ignition. The experimental engine, gearbox and prop were not direct causes here- no electrons was- the same root cause of so many accidents using EFI in aircraft.

So many things were overlooked, disregarded and so many regulations broken starting right at the initial inspection before the first flight... it is simply staggering. I've read hundreds of accident reports in the last 30 years but never anything like this.

If we can learn anything from this, it is to boldly speak up and save a friend if you ever see something like this happening in the future. If speaking up involves alerting the authorities, do it. This might have saved Dan. Hurt feelings are minor compared to being dead.

Finally, Osh will be there next year. I've told a number of people with new airplanes not to rush heading to Osh until everything is 100%. Why would you want to do that?

[N62XS]

Originally Posted by n5lp

My rudder trim tab is currently held on with carpet tape after verifying the size by attaching it with duct tape. I see nothing wrong with that and if it falls off it doesn't cause a problem.

Of course I'm assuming that they are just referring to a fixed wedge of some sort. Initially I too thought they were talking about mounting some sort of adjustable trim tab with tape.

Two things in your post continue to bug me to know end. Number one, "if it falls off it doesn't cause a problem". WHAT ABOUT THE PEOPLE ON THE GROUND LARRY? Its that attitude that continues to plague the GA community. We are perceived as a bunch of arrogant airplane snobs by many, with too much money and too many toys. Everyone of us have a responsibility to the people we fly over to insure NOTHING falls off of our airplane and that our airplanes are safe when leaving the ground. Number two, "I'm assuming". I could rant about assumptions for hours, but I think the point is clear!

Nothing personal, but your choice of words hit a nerve that will never go away with me. Flying is a privlidge and an honor, IMHO.

[Mike S]

Originally Posted by RVbySDI

It was apparent to me from the emails discussed to his friend(s) that he was truly wanting someone to help him understand how to manage his airplane. The sad truth though is that he appeared to lack the self-discipline to restrain himself from flying his new airplane until he fully understood how to do so, and, more to the point, until it was ready to be flown.

This report indicates to me that this builder/pilot did not understand his airplane. From his own words: "Eww I am an idiot!! I had no clue. . .Definitely a case of money versus intelligence. . ."

Very well said.

Sorry to say this, I mean no slams on Dan, but reading the report it seems to be a study in what not to do.

Should be required reading for anyone planning of flying a new plane.

[allbee]

When I first started building my RV7a, I wanted things simple, so to speak. I put in the steam gauges, why, familiarization. I had about 800hrs at the time I started the build and I only flew steam. I put in steam, I also got turned to an EFIS. I still put in the steam, why, that first flight. I'm really glad I did, the steam was rock solid reliable. Sure the efis worked, but my eyes went right to the steam. If I had to do it all over again I wouldn't change a thing. I flew my first flight right over the field and, I left the prop flat, why, I never had one of those either, I just used the throttle and flew around slow. Fine with me, first flight, unfamiliar plane. Than I had troubles, the alert came up on the efis, no audio, Voltage low, 8.0 volts. Oh man, I did a quick stall, within what everybody else claimed, no radio, I came in for landing, tower was expecting anything, all went well, nice clean landing. Found too low of a fuse in the field. Landed and tore the whole plane apart, found nothing. Cool. Main thing is we need to be cautious of what we are doing. Don't put a bunch of variables that can get you into trouble into your airplane. Be simple. Add stuff later after you get to know the airplane.

[bsacks05]

"Eww I am an idiot!! I had no clue. . .Definitely a case of money versus intelligence. . ."

Unfortunately, this seems to sum up the whole report for me.

"Should be required reading for anyone planning of flying" or building "a new plane." Well said, Mike. My thoughts exactly.

[Danny7]

Originally Posted by boom3

Sure a lot of reference to posts and emails in there that are now public record. No surprise and probably very helpful for putting the puzzle together.

ANYTHING YOU'VE POSTED ON THE INTERNET IS PUBLIC RECORD.

emails are usually private, as long as the other person is trustworthy to keep them that way.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by Hard Knox

Two things in your post continue to bug me to know end. Number one, "if it falls off it doesn't cause a problem". WHAT ABOUT THE PEOPLE ON THE GROUND LARRY? Its that attitude that continues to plague the GA community. We are perceived as a bunch of arrogant airplane snobs by many, with too much money and too many toys. Everyone of us have a responsibility to the people we fly over to insure NOTHING falls off of our airplane and that our airplanes are safe when leaving the ground. Number two, "I'm assuming". I could rant about assumptions for hours, but I think the point is clear!

Nothing personal, but your choice of words hit a nerve that will never go away with me. Flying is a privlidge and an honor, IMHO.

a simple aluminum trim tab falling off an airplane is not going to do anything. You might as well sue all car dealerships for their pollution from all the balloons they release on accident. Those are 1000xs more often and "dangerous" than a piece of sheet Al.

flying should not be a "privilege". It should be a right, a method of freely moving about our country. The same with automobiles, bicycles, and pedestrian traffic. I'm not saying it can't be restricted for safety.

[nucleus]

Originally Posted by Danny7

flying should not be a "privilege". It should be a right, a method of freely moving about our country. The same with automobiles, bicycles, and pedestrian traffic. I'm not saying it can't be restricted for safety.

Hear! Hear!

Seems like they are trying to turn everything into a privilege these days!

Hans