I'm thinking about buying a flying -6 or -7

[DC YXer]

Hi everyone - long time lurker, (very) occasional poster... As you can probably tell from my login name, I've been previously leaning towards building a plane from, um, "another kit company" but have recently started considering the option of buying a flying plane instead of building. It's not that I've become disinterested in "the other" brand, but there are just so many more RV's already built that between the availability factor (and, yes, the additional range and XC performance) I've started thinking through what would be involved in buying a flying RV.

I've searched the forums (dozens of times, actually - which has been EXTREMELY helpful, as all of you already know), but I wanted to slap up a new thread with a few additional questions for which I couldn't find direct answers already posted:

1. The *vast* majority of the -6s and -7s I've seen have the engine controls (as standard) installed underneath the center of the panel. What's involved in moving those controls to the left side of the cockpit? I got my tailwheel endorsement in a Luscombe, which also required left hand stick/right hand throttle, so I think I have a fair idea of what that configuration feels like and even though it basically worked, for me it just didn't feel "right." I've read about lots of people making that transition more or less seamlessly, but even after about 12 hours in that Luscombe, I never did feel completely natural flying that way - and if I can get the controls re-oriented like this, that's definitely what I'd prefer.

As far as I can tell, it shouldn't be *enormously* difficult to move the engine controls from under the center of the panel to under the left - and I don't really need a quadrant, I just want right hand stick and left hand throttle & such - but on the other hand, how would I know? (I've never built anything more complicated than Ikea furniture!) And I know I could just fly from the right seat, but (1) I don't think I've seen a single RV panel with flight instruments on the right side, and (2) I'd just rather sit where the pilot is "supposed" to sit! ;-)

So, questions: has anyone made this change in an already-built -6 or -7? If so, are you satisfied with the outcome? Since I'm not a builder, I'd probably want to ask the builder I'd be buying from to handle this (or an A/P I guess), does that make sense? What about flaps - if they're not on the stick, how bad would it be to either reach across for them or dance my hands around to reconfig for a go-around? (Not ideal, at best, but is this a deal-breaker?) If electric, I guess I could also have the switch moved to the left side of the panel?

2. Obviously, without the repairman's certificate, I'll need an A/P to do the annual (is it still a "condition inspection" if an outside A/P does it?) I'd love to hear from anyone who is operating this way - does your A/P understand RV's? I realize flush riveted, monocoque construction with a good ol' 320 or 360 is a lot less exotic than many other types, but is it a mistake to think I could count on a typical A/P to keep an RV safe and in the air without having to bill me for hours and hours of learning curve? (Or, better yet, does anyone know of a good A/P in the DC area who's already way out on the end of that learning curve?)

3. Are there operational differences between the -6 and the -7? I'm not looking for anything particularly fancy, I guess I'd *like* a CS prop (and would prefer a tip-up to a slider), but other than wanting a taildragger with left hand engine controls, I'm ready to be flexible with just about everything else. (Except the engine, I'm not interested in auto-conversions.)

Am I overlooking anything with this approach? Are there safety issues or differences in flight characteristics between the -6 and the -7? The bad news is, I really can't spend more than $70-75K, tops, but the good news is that looks like it could cover a fairly solid -6 or a bone simple VFR -7. If you had that budget, which would you pick? Does it even matter at all? (And p.s., I'm at least three or four months away from actually buying, so while I'm not unwilling to look at any planes like this currently on the market, I'm afraid I wouldn't be bringing my checkbook just yet - just don't want to mislead anyone...)

4. Transition training is a must, obviously, and happily for me my mom lives in Vancouver, WA - which appears to be about a half-hour from Mike Seager's operation in Scappoose, OR. Van's website calls him the dean of RV transition training CFIs, so that endorsement sure looks good enough for me. Any further suggestions for making sure I'm prepared for this? I'm definitely low time (just over 100 hours total) but I started in gliders and added an SEL later, so I'd like to think that with 5/10 hours of transition training, I'd be ready enough to be safe. Yes/no?

That's about all I can think of for now (plus I REALLY need to get back to work!), but MANY thanks in advance to anyone who can supply any additional info on this!!!

Best,
Joe

[Mel]

Easiest thing would be to fly from the right seat. A lot of people do this. This also makes it easier to reach "stuff" with your left hand.

[Kanfly]

I have a 6A for sale that flys from the right seat (like a fighter jet, stick in right hand). 200hp, TruTrak flight director with altitude hold, Garmin 496 with weather. $54,000 Scott 620-353-0001

[Jim P]

For what's it worth, I had a good number of hours with RH Stick/ LH Throttle. I flew with Mike Seager and didn't even notice the LH Stick/ RH Throttle until I finished a day's flying with Mike. Much easier to fly with that arrangement then either swap the throttle or move primary instruments to the right side. That's just my $.01.

[Jim Lewellyn]

I built a Challenger II which is right stick and left throttle. I flew it for 150 hours just before jumping in my RV6 for the first time. I was sweatin' bullets thinking that I could'nt fly left stick and right throttle. You know, the old habits die hard thing.... anyway, by the time I was done with my transition training (about 2 hours), I really did not notice the stick in my left hand. I jump back and forth between the Challenger and the RV all the time and don't notice it at all.

The RV requires much smaller stick inputs than the Luscombe. Give the RV a try in normal configuration before you decide to change it. I am betting that you will not even notice the stick in your left hand.

[DC YXer]

I've really got my mind made up about left hand throttle from the left seat, but thanks anyway for the feedback!

[rvn817j]

I'd say you are a candidate for a -8 (RV that is)! Performance is way better than a Luscombe and the controls are the way you want them.

[Geico266]

Originally Posted by DC YXer

Are there safety issues or differences in flight characteristics between the -6 and the -7? The bad news is, I really can't spend more than $70-75K, tops, but the good news is that looks like it could cover a fairly solid -6 or a bone simple VFR -7. If you had that budget, which would you pick?

You have a handle on the RV-6 / 7 market. There are more -6's out there so the price is more competative with -7's. The -6 is just a tad bit more "twitchy" due to shorter wings. Not bad, just more than the -7. The -7 has a larger rudder, but the -6 certainly has plenty of rudder command. Both are excellant aircraft.

For the money you are talking I would go with a loaded -6with an auto pilot. The AP would compensate for "twitchiness". It is nice to have an AP so you can relax on cross country trips. Makes reading maps easier.

JMHO = DON"T! move the throttles. It will reduce the resale value. It will take you 2 mins to get used to the right hand throttle. It's like transitioning from yoke to stick. More in your head than a problem.

Good Luck! Keep us informed. We'll need pics!

[Sam Buchanan]

Originally Posted by DC YXer

I've really got my mind made up about left hand throttle from the left seat, but thanks anyway for the feedback!

Joe, if there is any advice I could give you, it would be to not have your "mind made up" about anything RV at this point (I know...the RV affliction exacts a terrible toll on the psyche!). Your total time is very low, and RV time non-existent, so you don't have much of an experience base to draw on. This is definitely not a poke at your piloting or decision capabilities, just a reality check.

The throttle thing is something that you will get accustomed to very quickly (I have ~300 hrs J-3 time, ~900 hrs RV-6) or, if you pursue the throttle modification (you have received very good reasons as to why not to do it) that can be accommodated later, although it will be expensive to have an A&P make the mod. Keep in mind you can legally work on your RV--you just need the A&P for the condition inspection.

I suggest you get the transition training from Mike Seager as soon as possible, definitely before you purchase a plane. This will provide you with valuable RV experience, and Mike is a great resource for "RV wisdom". After time with Mike, and a trip to Vans for additional input and/or demo rides, you will be in a much better position to make firm decisions about the direction you want to take in RV-dom.

Best wishes for a great trip to OR!

[Dgamble]

Originally Posted by DC YXer

2. Obviously, without the repairman's certificate, I'll need an A/P to do the annual (is it still a "condition inspection" if an outside A/P does it?) I'd love to hear from anyone who is operating this way - does your A/P understand RV's?

Yes. A&P training is about fundamentals, not specifics. The way I've been doing it is to have my AP/IA (IA not required, but I find it to be desirable) do an inspection and provide me with a to-do list. I work through the list myself (although I had him do one of the tasks this year since it was on the carb, and I like to think that I know my limits) and he re-inspects. Piece of cake.