A Newbie, Aircraft Electronic Ignition

[sc_acro2]

Hi, I am a newbie to the forum, aka. Thomas Shpakow, However not to aircraft building and performance mods. A new item that I have developed is an interface ignition set-up for Slick and Bendix Aircraft Mags. With great results, check it out at the link below. I?ll be in KOSH this year parked @ the IAC Head Quarters, Like to meet you and talk performance and more.

Sincerely,

Thomas S.
Power Play

www.g3ignition.com

ps. Hey Larry V. I'll get upto SD soon on the ignition stuff.

[osxuser]

Looks really cool! I'm assuming the mags have to be timed really close so that the distributor is contacting the right part of the block when the EI discharges? How do the stock distributor's hold up to the hotter spark?

I assume that the major disadvantage to this system is the inability to advance the spark at will (or at the computers will). Seems like the most certify-able EI i've ever seen though.

[Mel]

One of the big advantages of electronic ignitions is that they will allow you to build up a bigger charge before jumping a large plug gap thereby giving a much hotter spark. If the system reverts back to mag, then the plug gap must remain small. Doesn't this take away a lot of the EI advantage?

[sc_acro2]

Good topic Mel,
The larger the gap and or more cylinder pressure, the more KV is required to make the jump. When igniting the fuel, a multiple spark discharge is the ultimate. No need for the super large plug gap. The MSD ignition is capable of firing much larger spark plug gaps than a magneto is capable of firing. However this is not necessary. Typically, MSD ignitions recommend following the engine manufacturer?s specification for spark plugs. This dose not requires increasing the plug gap to enjoy the benefits of a more efficient ignition system. For example a Bendix 200 series 6 cylinder magneto is capable on the test stand with a o-scope hooked up, well over 40 KV @ 3400 prop rpm. I have flight-tested larger gaps with stock Slick and Bendix mags. And I could not see or feel a performance benefit. The old saying goes, if you put a 25-watt bulb in a 200-watt socket, will it be brighter? Most of the G3ignition set-ups have the standard aircraft mag harness and plugs and work excellent. Personally, I run the automotive NGK Iridium?s in my supercharge IO-540 @ a .026" plug gap. With S6LN-200 Bendix mags. Fired with the G3i module/ MSD 6a. Here is a good information link to MSD help; http://www.msdignition.com/1helpmechoose.htm

Thanks,
Thomas S.

[sc_acro2]

Hi Stephen,
The magneto rotor and distributor block stay in the stock timing configuration and hold up as in a normal configuration. Slick mags do have a ?X? marking for there Lasar variable timing advance set-up. In the Lasar system, the rotor and block assembly are the same part numbers as there stock mag. This can be configured into the G3i system if required. As for the hotter spark, it is about the same as a good stock magneto, it?s the multiple spark discharge that does it. It can vary though depending on the application and plug gap. Internal coil temps were measured at the higher rpm and showed an increased by 7 to 15 degrees, static air flow, on the test stand. As far as having a disadvantage, not being able to advance the timing is not a big negative. Timing advance is only beneficial at altitude above 8000 ft @ a lean cruise setting as shown from other systems. The most difference is about 0 to 2% over this system depending on your engine management. MSD amplifier works so well, there is no need to advance the timing beyond the manufacturers spec. Another benefit is that there is no unknown chance of a runaway timing advance detonation gremlin to deal with or the kick back, knock the starter nose off troll either.

Thanks,
Thomas S.

[magneto andy]

Hi Thomas,
I've looked at the data on the g3ignition website, and shared it with others. The flexibility, performance gains, simplicity, and extra-redundant safety features are amazing.
What's so surprising is there's no need to discard otherwise decent mags, when one may channel modern ignition through them at the flip of a switch. One more wire to the mag..Who'da thunkit? People have been asking me for years to find a way to build them boost retard systems that ran off the original equipment, and "hot up the mags while I'm at it". Looks a lot easier now.
TOO COOL DUDE.
Congrats on the launch of a beautiful product.
-Andy Richards
p.s. Some interested P51 racing folks are right over the hill from here. Expect a call from a tech guy and a Merlin engine builder.

[Mike S]

Hey Andy, welcome to VAF.

Good to have you aboard.

Are your "over the hill" guys from Eagles Nest??

[Jconard]

Say,

It appears that if the p lead or coil trigger wire breaks, the ignition WILL NOT operate any longer in either mag or electronic mode, is that correct? It appears that the coil wire no longer has any internal connection, it is routed through the new box and back to the point through the p-lead connection. So, if iether the wire to the p-lead or the wire from the new connection breaks, that whole mag would go down.

Is this correct, and is there an aleternate which would allow the mag to function as a mag if the wires break?

[sc_acro2]

Hi John,
Thanks for the scenarios, they are good, here’s some clarification.
However that is not correct, the mags are still independent of one another. Losing a p-lead and or primary coil lead would only possibly disable that mag. However, if you are triggering via magnetic crank trigger or aux contacts, the electronic portion will continue to fire the mag coil or both mag coils.
The p-lead can act as a trigger or a magnetic crank sensor pick-up can be used in place. Let’s use the example shown in my website " www.g3ignition.com " on Brandon’s ride. The left Slick magneto contact set (points) is the trigger source for the electronic amplifier. (ex.1) Let’s say that the p-lead from the left magneto just falls off in flight. Well this is the trigger source for the electronic ignition. The electronic amplifier will not have a signal to pip the coils. The electronic side of the system will not function. The right magneto will continue to fire as normal in mag mode. (ex.2) Right p-lead falls off in flight, the signal is still there from the left mag contacts, both mags will continue to fire in the electronic mode. Left mag will work in normal mag mode if called upon for back up There are 10 different ways that I suggest to hook the G3i system up depending your specific needs. The system includes new hardware and coil driver leads and p-leads from the G3i module to the mags so there is no chance of a poor or sloppy hook up connection and with less of a chance of a failure.

Thanks,
Thomas S.

[osxuser]

Just wondering, if you lost the trigger, why wouldn't BOTH mags keep going in revert mode? The mags don't need power to run, they just need to be ungrounded...