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04-22-2008, 04:40 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: SoCal
Posts: 2,061
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Does anyone know of a source for data on ALL deployments? I'm sure that manufacturers only report the times when things work out. I'm picturing situations where the chute gets deployed due to engine out. So, instead of dead-sticking onto a golf course, I float down into the path a freight train or into a volcano or some other undesireable situation. 
__________________
Steve Zicree
Fullerton, Ca. w/beautiful 2.5 year old son 
RV-4 99% built  and sold 
Rag and tube project well under way
paid =VAF= dues through June 2013
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04-22-2008, 06:53 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Bradenton, Florida
Posts: 348
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R & D for heavy metal ...
The TV news reported a few months ago that the major airplane manufactures were looking into having the BRS (or something similar and many times larger and stronger, I'm certain) aboard future passenger airlines. It doesn't make sense to me.
I'm sure the captain of that Boeing 767 that took me and my family on our last flight would have probably cast his fate to the wind and just passed on the preflight, fuel check and weather briefing because he knew, in the back of his mind ... his Boeing was equipped with chutes. That only makes sense to me.
Why would Lockheed and Boeing even consider the BRS in their future ... they already have a seat cushion that is also a flotation device (and you can inflate it with you own breath if it fails to inflate after pulling the chord), they already have lights on the floor that come on to direct you to the nearest exit, they have seat belts, oxygen masks, knowledgeable, trained experienced passengers willing and able to open emergency exits if necessary and airsick bags near every seat. I think they have every possible contingency covered. Why spend money on R&D for the BRS?... ticket prices are high enough already.
(I don't really think any of us will ever fly on a large passenger plane equipped with this technology ... but our grandchildren will!)
__________________
"Time, be careful how you spend it ... cause it isn't going to last."
VAF #1037
Reserved N124JG for RV-12
"12 for Jerry G.
http://jerryg150rv12.blogspot.com/
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04-22-2008, 09:07 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: SoCal
Posts: 2,061
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I sincerely think we'll eventually see unpiloted passenger aircraft. When that happens I'll be the guy wearing a chute sitting by the emergency exit.
__________________
Steve Zicree
Fullerton, Ca. w/beautiful 2.5 year old son 
RV-4 99% built  and sold 
Rag and tube project well under way
paid =VAF= dues through June 2013
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04-22-2008, 09:16 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Dallas, TX (ADS)
Posts: 2,180
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Quote:
Originally Posted by szicree
I sincerely think we'll eventually see unpiloted passenger aircraft. When that happens I'll be the guy wearing a chute sitting by the emergency exit.
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I was getting off a Dash-8-400 at SEA recently in the Horizon "bullpen". On my way into the terminal, I passed a guy who had what looked like a softie parachute slung over his shoulder like a backpack. It took me a sec to realize what it was and by that time, he was gone. D.B. Cooper lives?
TODR
__________________
Doug "The Other Doug Reeves" Reeves
CTSW N621CT - SOLD but not forgotten
Home Bases LBX, BZN
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04-23-2008, 07:35 AM
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Northern California, USA
Posts: 537
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Behold the debate
Quote:
Originally Posted by JimLogajan
Odd request - there appears to be no debate here.
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Jim, do you still feel that way? When it comes to my RV brethren, my crystal ball is pretty reliable
The original poster asked "how do I...?" and it quickly turned into a debate on "Ought you...?" This happens often on VAF, and is part of the fun.
I suggested the moderators move it to the "Never Ending Debates" section so that we keep the exchange rolling, but make it easy to tell what's where.
And here are my two cents:
Just make sure that you prime everything in three coats of two-part epoxy primer to keep the wreckage from corroding
...when your Subaru engine quits
...and your nosegear collapses in the ensuing off-airport landing
...that you chose to attempt rather than deploy your chute
...because it was IMC and you're not current in instrument parachute approaches since IMC in singles is invariably fatal
...and your wreckage will be there a looong time because you installed the ELT antenna inside the glove compartment for less drag
...and your corpse will be there forever too because your tipover canopy couldn't be opened inverted.
Did I get them all? 
__________________
Martin Gomez
Redwood City, CA
"My RV-7 is a composite airplane: it's made of aluminum, blood, sweat, and money"
RV-7 Slider QB
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04-23-2008, 10:46 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Dexter, OR
Posts: 96
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I wrote:
Quote:
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Odd request - there appears to be no debate here.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mgomez
Jim, do you still feel that way? When it comes to my RV brethren, my crystal ball is pretty reliable
The original poster asked "how do I...?" and it quickly turned into a debate on "Ought you...?" This happens often on VAF, and is part of the fun.
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Hey - my post was accurate at the time it was made!
Seriously though, if Van's sold preview plans for the RV-12 (doesn't, and may never - doesn't appear to sell preview plans for the RV-10 either) it might be possible to actually take an initial stab at answering the "how to" part. One could try to figure out chute placement, bridle runs, hard mount points for the lines, and such.
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04-23-2008, 08:47 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Northern California, USA
Posts: 537
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimLogajan
Seriously though, if Van's sold preview plans for the RV-12 (doesn't, and may never - doesn't appear to sell preview plans for the RV-10 either) it might be possible to actually take an initial stab at answering the "how to" part. One could try to figure out chute placement, bridle runs, hard mount points for the lines, and such.
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True. It's actually non-trivial to calculate the loads that a chute imposes on the airplane when it opens. My coworkers and I had to do it for a few UAVs, and there's more to it than we at first thought.
I'm sure companies that specialize in recovery chutes know how to do it. If I were installing such a chute, I'd leave the design of the installation to the experts.
Cheers,
Martin
__________________
Martin Gomez
Redwood City, CA
"My RV-7 is a composite airplane: it's made of aluminum, blood, sweat, and money"
RV-7 Slider QB
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06-10-2012, 05:37 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: enid,ok
Posts: 1
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Everyone is missing the point about BRS chutes including Van's
All the posts concerning installing BRS chutes in Van's aircraft are very informative and thought out but seem to address only mainly the pilot's point of view. Yes, the pilots who fly the Van's line of aircraft know they are the best designed and safest line of homebuilt aircraft available. However, there is a reason that Cirrus and Flight Design are the top selling aircraft in their categories. Girlfriends and Wives influence almost every decision about an aircraft purchase. Their feelings are important and should be thought of when buying an aircraft and asking them to fly with us. We as pilots know that our skills are adequate in most cases to handle an emergency but the psychological value of a BRS chute to a passenger is very significant. For this reason alone, Van's should do the design work necessary for the builders to be able to place a BRS chute in every model of their aircraft.
As an added note, I experienced an engine failure on takeoff in my 172 when approximately 700 feet above the ground several years ago. I was by myself, had partial fuel and STOL kit on wings. With a passenger I wouldn't have even considered turning around and would have landed straight ahead. However, I was able to turn and land back on the runway. The interesting question is what would I have done if a chute was available. The honest answer is, I do not know.
The main reason I personally want a chute available for the rv-12 is for night flying. I don't worry about engine failures during the daytime as I reason that you can set an rv-12 down just about anywhere if you keep flying
it all the way to landing. Night is a whole different animal. The main reason, as stated above is for the benefit of my passengers.
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06-10-2012, 07:57 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: SC
Posts: 12,887
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doctordale
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The main reason I personally want a chute available for the rv-12 is for night flying. I don't worry about engine failures during the daytime as I reason that you can set an rv-12 down just about anywhere if you keep flying
it all the way to landing. Night is a whole different animal. The main reason, as stated above is for the benefit of my passengers.
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Since the RV-12's target market is Sport Pilots who cannot fly at night, it is really unlikely Van's will ever add a BRS.
__________________
Bill R.
RV-9 (Yes, it's a dragon tail)
O-360 w/ dual P-mags
Build the plane you want, not the plane others want you to build!
SC86 - Easley, SC
www.repucci.com/bill/baf.html
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06-10-2012, 08:49 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Highland Village, TX
Posts: 1,520
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I was talking with an A&P/IA the other day who worked for Cirrus a few years ago. He was telling me about an accidental deployment that occurred to a hangered aircraft.
An A&P was working on the plane and accidentally deployed the chute - it went right through the roof of the hanger  The plane was destroyed and they were just lucky that no one was injured.
So a BRS chute may give some people peace of mind but I would rather not have potentially deadly ballastic device sitting behind me. Not to mention that if it's installed in an RV, it's more likely that it will be serviced by someone that knows nothing about the system at some point.
__________________
Rick Aronow,
A&P
Flying 7A Slider;
RV-12 SOLD
Jacksonville, FL
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