Tip: Installing Platenuts

[RudiGreyling]

Hi guys,

I had the pain last night installing some platenuts. This morning I searched this forum for tips on installing platenuts....and nothing.

So for completeness would you guys add/reference your platenut installation tips and photos here for others to find & use later:

Some specific Platenut questions from my side:
1) Is the platenut jigs worth it? Buy or make your own platenut jigs?
2) When to countersink and when to dimple platenuts?
3) I believe there is a special small head rivet to aid platenut installations (MS1097)? And
4) Apparantly Van's sell a flush head #40 Pop rivet to aid platenut installations?

Thanks in advance,
Kind Regards
Rudi

[Rick6a]

Originally Posted by greylingr

Hi guys,

I had the pain last night installing some platenuts. This moring I searched this forum for tips on installing platenuts....and nothing.

So for completeness would you guys add/reference your platenut installation tips and photos here for others to find & use later:

Some specific Platenut questions from my side:
1) Is the platenut jigs worth it? Buy or make your own platenut jigs?
2) When to countersink and when to dimple platenuts?
3) I believe there is a special small head rivet to aid platenut installations (MS1097)? And
4) Apparantly Van's sell a flush head #40 Pop rivet to aid platenut installations?

Thanks in advance,
Kind Regards
Rudi

Rudi,

Are platenut (nutplate) jigs worth it? In my opinion, every penny. I have an extensive collection of such jigs covering a wide range of applications from a #4 screw to 1/4" bolt and use the jigs frequently. This tool virtually guarantees quality and repeatability when installing platenuts without undo difficulty. If you've ever had to drill out the pattern for floating nutplates (or platenuts...the term is interchangeable) one at a time without a jig you know what frustrating work it can sometimes be.
I've installed thousands of nutplates over the years (ex production worker) and I've never run into a situation...including the construction of my RV-6A where I had occasion to countersink or dimple a platenut so I cannot comment on that point.
Use NAS1097AD3 rivets to install nutplates. I think Van's may have coined the term "oops rivet" to help describe using an NAS1097AD4 rivet in place of a botched AN470AD3 in a hole brought up to size #30 since the head diameters of the rivets are about the same.
If Van's sells a flush pop rivet to aid in installing the nutplates...all the better. But in my experience the head diameter of such pop rivets is the same as AN470's. Remember that .032 is the minimum material thickness for machine countersinking and much of the material we work with is thinner than that. Van's does sell the NAS1097AD3 in a few lengths but last I checked, you had to go to "the list" to find them. The NAS1097AD3-3.5 is by far the most commonly used length.
I will take a digital picture or two of some of my jigs (perhaps alongside an applicable platenut) to help illustrate their uncommon utility and will post the photo's here later. Such jigs are available wherever surplus aircraft tools are sold and don't forget the Flymart! I got more than one example there for just several dollars each.

Rick Galati RV-6A "Darla"

[RudiGreyling]

Thanks Rick6a, that helps

[RudiGreyling]

Suddenly a lot of talk on platenuts / nutplates on the forum. I'd like to consolidate some posts that have come up here.

Where to get cheap nut-plate drill jiggs:

Originally Posted by kcameron

I checked at the Avery and Cleveland site for nut-plate drill jigs. They both want about $40 for each size. That seems a bit steep to me. I found some at "The Yard Store" for about $18 apiece. <snip>

http://www.yardstore.com

Interchanging a #8 and #10 jig + nutplate specs:

Originally Posted by az_gila

<snip>...you can do #8 and #10 with a #8 nutplate jig....
All of the nutplates we use have only two spacings of the mounting rivets.
A #8 nutplate jig will also do #10 spacing, and a 1/4 jig will do the larger sizes. So for a #10 nutplate, just drill the main hole to #19 as if it was a #8 screw, drill the nutplate mounting holes with a #40, and then enlarge the main screw hole to #10.......

The specs. for the nutplate rivet spacing can be found here....
http://www.skybolt.com/catalog/anchor.pdf

gil in Tucson EAA Technical Counselor

When Countersinking - Use NAS1097AD3-x rivets w/nutplates:

Originally Posted by dan

<snip> NAS1097AD3-x rivets are ideal for installing nutplates in relatively thin material (i.e. .032" and thinner). Countersink the skin...but you don't have to go nearly as deep as you would for an AN426AD3-x rivet. Just a quick turn or two with the deburring bit or a 3/32" pilot countersink cutter, and your NAS1097 rivet will sit flush.

Van's sells these rivets. Just grab 1/8 or 1/4 pound of NAS1097AD3-3.5 and you should be good to go. May as well order some "OOPS" rivets while you're at it, such as NAS1097AD4-3.5 and/or -4. Never know when those might come in handy.

http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/parts.txt

NAS1097AD3-3 RIVETS (LB) $27.31
NAS1097AD3-3.5 RIVETS (LB) $29.45
NAS1097AD3-4 RIVETS (LB) $23.25
NAS1097AD3-6 RIVETS (LB) $26.95
NAS1097AD4-3.5 OOPS RIVETS (LB) $22.71
NAS1097AD4-4 OOPS RIVETS (LB) $17.00
NAS1097AD4-5 OOPS RIVETS (LB) $15.00
NAS1097AD4-6 OOPS RIVETS (LB) $18.62

)_( Dan
RV-7 N714D
http://www.rvproject.com

When Dimpling - Grind the female dimple on one edge:

Originally Posted by Bill Dicus

Just one guy's experience but I had no problem with dimipling the platenuts - that is the rivet holes in the platenuts. Seems to work fine and the skin dimple fits in well. You may have to grind the female dimple a little on one edge to clear the protrusion for the main fastener on the nut plate, and it takes me a good whack on the C-arm mandrel to do it. Van's comments that doing the little grind doesn't affect the usefulness of the die for regular dimpling. Bill

If you guys have more tips add them here...

[RudiGreyling]

OK,

I 'borrowed' this picture from yard store. Could you guys please say which styles to get for which type of RV, since I have not run into all the nutplates yet.
i.e. on a RV 7 get style x and style y since they are used a lot, on a RV 6 get style z and style y: (PS: I'm interested in the nutplates for RV7, but post the other as well if different for reference)



Thanks
Rudi

[rv8ch]

Hi Rudi,

99% of my nutplates were the dual lug #8. That would be the 518-B. I have also installed dual lug #6 and #10, but really very few. Some of these were for things I did that are not in the plans.

From time to time a single lug #6, #8, and #10 is needed. I don't recall ever installing a 1/4" nutplate.

[az_gila]

Ah yes... but if even though most nutplates you use are dual lug.... if you buy the one lug nutplate jig, it will do both one lug and dual lug layouts, while the dual lug jig will only do dual lug ones.

Buy the dual lug one.... 518-H

The www.yardstore.com price is even identical!!

...gil in Tucson