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  #1  
Old 04-02-2019, 12:55 PM
mfleming's Avatar
mfleming mfleming is online now
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Joseph, Oregon
Posts: 796
Default Angle Clip Interference

The aft top fuselage skin is ready to be riveted, but there is one skin rivet that's giving me problems.

This skin rivet is directly over the F- 707B angle clip shown on drawing 26, detail C and there is no way to buck this rivet..

In my frustration I compounded the problem by drilling out the skin rivet hole to ⅛" thinking I would install a Cherry rivet but the Cherry rivet hits the angle clip well before seating. I relived the angle clip some with jewelers files to see if that would give me room for the cherry rivet to seat but I stopped before relieving too much material.

The obvious solutions is to drill out the AN470AD4-5 rivets that hold the clip and rib to the F-707 bulkhead and reinstall after the skin rivet is bucked.

BUT, I'm afraid of screwing up the AN470AD4-5 when reinstalling. These were obviously originally installed without the top skin on from F-707 aft. The squeezer will not fit up there with skins on and one would have to use an offset rivet driver to buck the -4's and I have had mixed luck with those offsets....

Soooo....How important is this one little skin rivet? Not very I assume.

Any Ideas??

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Michael Fleming
Joseph, OR
sagriver at icloud dot com

RV-7 Slider #74572
Started 11/2016
Empennage completed 11/2016 (sans fiberglass)
Ailerons and flaps completed 3/2017.
Wings completed 12/2017
Started on QB fuselage 01/2018
Sliding canopy mostly completed 10/2020
Wiring and Avionics harness completed 9/2/2021
FWF Started 9/3/2021

Donated for 2021 and so should you
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  #2  
Old 04-02-2019, 01:29 PM
lr172 lr172 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Schaumburg, IL
Posts: 6,681
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mfleming View Post
The aft top fuselage skin is ready to be riveted, but there is one skin rivet that's giving me problems.

This skin rivet is directly over the F- 707B angle clip shown on drawing 26, detail C and there is no way to buck this rivet..

In my frustration I compounded the problem by drilling out the skin rivet hole to ⅛" thinking I would install a Cherry rivet but the Cherry rivet hits the angle clip well before seating. I relived the angle clip some with jewelers files to see if that would give me room for the cherry rivet to seat but I stopped before relieving too much material.

The obvious solutions is to drill out the AN470AD4-5 rivets that hold the clip and rib to the F-707 bulkhead and reinstall after the skin rivet is bucked.

BUT, I'm afraid of screwing up the AN470AD4-5 when reinstalling. These were obviously originally installed without the top skin on from F-707 aft. The squeezer will not fit up there with skins on and one would have to use an offset rivet driver to buck the -4's and I have had mixed luck with those offsets....

Soooo....How important is this one little skin rivet? Not very I assume.

Any Ideas??

I doubt leaving it out will be a problem. However, you can grind a relief in the angle piece to allow the cherry rivet in, as long as you can maintain the edge diestance of the hole in it. A die grinder should make quick work of it.

For the future, an MK-319 is an acceptable substitute for -3 skin rivets and is very short. Probably would have fit.

Larry
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Last edited by lr172 : 04-02-2019 at 01:31 PM.
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  #3  
Old 04-02-2019, 07:21 PM
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rzbill rzbill is offline
 
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Location: Asheville, NC
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I vaguely remember this joint.
I think you identified the secret and it is 'order of assembly'.
Your choice on how you attack it though. A pop will certainly work.
Just an FYI, on a few occations I had problems with the pop being too long. However, sometimes you can partially pull the pop rivet in rough location to make it short enough to fully seat the head before finishing the pull.

I am curious, was this a quickbuild fuselage and the angle clip already installed by the factory?
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Bill Pendergrass
ME/AE '82
RV-7A: Flying since April 15, 2012. 850 hrs
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  #4  
Old 04-02-2019, 08:28 PM
rapid_ascent rapid_ascent is offline
 
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Location: Dublin, CA
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I?m almost to this point as soon as I get the parts primed. I think the instructions say to rivet the clip to the rib but not to the bulkhead until the skin has been riveted on. I don?t have them in front of me but that is my recollection.
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RV-7 Fuselage in progress
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* Both Wings fully skinned
* Fuel Tanks Complete - No leaks finally
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  #5  
Old 04-03-2019, 02:09 AM
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Draker Draker is offline
 
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Location: Livermore, CA
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I'm leaving mine clecoed to the bulkhead until the skin rivets are in.
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  #6  
Old 04-03-2019, 07:21 AM
BillL BillL is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Central IL
Posts: 6,311
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I honestly don't remember this particular situation being an issue for my build.

However the situation of removal and then needing an offset rivet set to reassemble is painfully familiar. Very painfully for me until I resolved (joke -HAD) to learn this skill.

Do this to your rivet gun to tightly keep the set from rotating, put two layers of tape on the rivet end, hold firmly, and burp carefully. Lightly hold the set.

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  #7  
Old 04-03-2019, 08:29 AM
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kentlik kentlik is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Oregon
Posts: 895
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I remember this specifically.

To be clear I used Cherry's in many places that would not be seen and also where they would.

I ground the bracket maintaining edge distance but it was borderline as I remember and ground the cherry pull stud down a bit as well. I was up to a 4 in this hole. I have since found good 3'ish pull rivets after I started the canopy.

It turned out good but there are a lot of rivets on the plane and in this area specifically. I am not concerned about this rivet. This may be covered as well if you are doing a slider, I think.
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  #8  
Old 04-03-2019, 10:25 AM
mfleming's Avatar
mfleming mfleming is online now
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Joseph, Oregon
Posts: 796
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rzbill View Post
I vaguely remember this joint.
I think you identified the secret and it is 'order of assembly'.
Your choice on how you attack it though. A pop will certainly work.
Just an FYI, on a few occations I had problems with the pop being too long. However, sometimes you can partially pull the pop rivet in rough location to make it short enough to fully seat the head before finishing the pull.

I am curious, was this a quickbuild fuselage and the angle clip already installed by the factory?
Yes the QB shop did me a favor and riveted the angle clip in....just one of many favors
__________________
Michael Fleming
Joseph, OR
sagriver at icloud dot com

RV-7 Slider #74572
Started 11/2016
Empennage completed 11/2016 (sans fiberglass)
Ailerons and flaps completed 3/2017.
Wings completed 12/2017
Started on QB fuselage 01/2018
Sliding canopy mostly completed 10/2020
Wiring and Avionics harness completed 9/2/2021
FWF Started 9/3/2021

Donated for 2021 and so should you
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  #9  
Old 04-03-2019, 02:39 PM
mfleming's Avatar
mfleming mfleming is online now
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Joseph, Oregon
Posts: 796
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Draker View Post
I'm leaving mine clecoed to the bulkhead until the skin rivets are in.
Smart choice
__________________
Michael Fleming
Joseph, OR
sagriver at icloud dot com

RV-7 Slider #74572
Started 11/2016
Empennage completed 11/2016 (sans fiberglass)
Ailerons and flaps completed 3/2017.
Wings completed 12/2017
Started on QB fuselage 01/2018
Sliding canopy mostly completed 10/2020
Wiring and Avionics harness completed 9/2/2021
FWF Started 9/3/2021

Donated for 2021 and so should you
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  #10  
Old 04-03-2019, 02:41 PM
mfleming's Avatar
mfleming mfleming is online now
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Joseph, Oregon
Posts: 796
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by rapid_ascent View Post
I?m almost to this point as soon as I get the parts primed. I think the instructions say to rivet the clip to the rib but not to the bulkhead until the skin has been riveted on. I don?t have them in front of me but that is my recollection.
I think you?re correct. Too bad the QB shop didn?t read that passage
__________________
Michael Fleming
Joseph, OR
sagriver at icloud dot com

RV-7 Slider #74572
Started 11/2016
Empennage completed 11/2016 (sans fiberglass)
Ailerons and flaps completed 3/2017.
Wings completed 12/2017
Started on QB fuselage 01/2018
Sliding canopy mostly completed 10/2020
Wiring and Avionics harness completed 9/2/2021
FWF Started 9/3/2021

Donated for 2021 and so should you
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