VansAirForceForums  
Home > VansAirForceForums

-POSTING RULES
-Advertise in here!
- Today's Posts | Insert Pics

Keep VAF Going
Donate methods

Point your
camera app here
to donate fast.

  #1  
Old 12-24-2018, 11:26 AM
ronschreck's Avatar
ronschreck ronschreck is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 1,700
Default IAC Known Sequences for 2019

When you are through with the eggnog and ready to get back in the cockpit you might like to try out the IAC KNOWN SEQUENCES for 2019. Final approval by the IAC Executive Committee is expected soon after the holidays but these sequences are the latest proposals by the Known Sequence Committee and I expect they will be approved without changes.

Below is the Sportsman Known. The only change from the original proposal was to change figure 8 from a reverse wedge to a forward wedge.

2019 Proposed Sportsman Known



Below is the Intermediate Known. The snap on a 45-degree up line was removed and an avalanche was added. There was some discussion about removing snap rolls from the Intermediate sequences but the Known Sequence Committee rejected that and opted to keep snaps in Intermediate.

2019 Proposed Intermediate Known



Rule proposal 29-2019 was approved by the Board so K-values for all categories are increased. This means that the free programs you may have used last year may need to be revised and signed off by a judge again. This might be a good time to develop a free sequence if you didn't have one or re-design your old free sequence.

2019 K Value Changes



I flew the Intermediate Known sequence a few times this morning and was surprised to find that it is an altitude GAINER! I like it!

I will be tracking RV pilots again in 2019 and will be publishing contest results here on VAF. You need to fly at least two contests in 2019 to qualify for a place in the standings.

Here's wishing you a very happy holiday season. I hope Santa brings you all the RV related goodies you hope for. Merry Christmas!
__________________
Ron Schreck
IAC National Judge
RV-8, "Miss Izzy", 2250 Hours- Sold
My Aerobatic Video
My Formation Video
CAF B-25 - Airbase Arizona
VAF 2022 Donor
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 12-26-2018, 12:57 AM
Gash's Avatar
Gash Gash is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Goodyear, Arizona
Posts: 949
Default

Thanks for posting these Ron! Hey, I feel a little dumb for asking, but I can't find these on the IAC website. Can you give me a link to the sequences, either proposed or final for 2019?
__________________
Karl, Goodyear, Arizona (KGYR) ATP, CFII
RV-14A
Yak 50
=VAF= donor 2021
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-26-2018, 06:21 AM
ronschreck's Avatar
ronschreck ronschreck is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 1,700
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gash View Post
Thanks for posting these Ron! Hey, I feel a little dumb for asking, but I can't find these on the IAC website. Can you give me a link to the sequences, either proposed or final for 2019?
Gash,

For the original proposals: Sign in to the IAC web site. Go to the Archives Tab, Governance Docs, Board of Directors Meeting Minutes, Fall Board Meeting Agenda, Agenda 13b. Simple.

https://www.iac.org/files/minutes/Ag...ard%202019.pdf

For a listing of sequences (known, free, unknown) from as far back as 1995 go to the Archives tab, Sequences. I go here and randomly pick sequences to practice for Unknown sequences. Also a great resource if you are looking for Free sequence ideas.

BTW, we will vote on the revised proposals for the 2019 Known sequences on December 29th. I'll post the results here.

BTW Gash, there are no dumb questions. Just dumb answers and I have lots of those!
__________________
Ron Schreck
IAC National Judge
RV-8, "Miss Izzy", 2250 Hours- Sold
My Aerobatic Video
My Formation Video
CAF B-25 - Airbase Arizona
VAF 2022 Donor
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 12-26-2018, 04:21 PM
f14av8r's Avatar
f14av8r f14av8r is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Tampa (Wimauma actually)
Posts: 451
Default Like it, mostly

I like the new (expected) known sportsman sequence. I especially like that it eliminates a spin. Spins are so very different from airplane to airplane that they do not make a good completion figure. Kudos to the IAC for eliminating spins from the known.

I dislike the inclusion of snap rolls in the intermediate sequence. RV type aircraft do not snap well or easily. And, frankly, it's just **** hard on the airplane. I love competing in my airplane but I don't want to destroy it either. Snaps should be for advanced and above. That would encourage more proficient sportsman category participants to move up a level. I will never move up to Intermediate if I have to snap roll my airplane - period.

Nice job Ron and IAC on the new sequences. I'd like to think that the RV communities support of Ron as a Director has contributed significantly to making entrance into and participation in the IAC a more attractive thing for RV owners!
Best regards,
Randy
__________________
Randy King
Tampa (Wimauma), Florida
RV-4 N212CS (sold)
RV-8 N184RK (sold)
Currently flying a Pitts S-2E

Exempt and gladly donating anyway - Current through March 2025
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-26-2018, 04:25 PM
f14av8r's Avatar
f14av8r f14av8r is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Tampa (Wimauma actually)
Posts: 451
Default Knowns

And then . . .

I looked at the Primary sequence on the IAC website and saw it starts, typically, with a 1 1/2 spin! So we put our newest competitors in the position of executing one of the most competitive judging specific figures. Go figure!

Oh well, progress however slight . . .
__________________
Randy King
Tampa (Wimauma), Florida
RV-4 N212CS (sold)
RV-8 N184RK (sold)
Currently flying a Pitts S-2E

Exempt and gladly donating anyway - Current through March 2025
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-26-2018, 05:11 PM
sandifer sandifer is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: NC
Posts: 667
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by f14av8r View Post
I like the new (expected) known sportsman sequence. I especially like that it eliminates a spin. Spins are so very different from airplane to airplane that they do not make a good completion figure. Kudos to the IAC for eliminating spins from the known.
Randy, the lack of spin in the Known is not really a strategic trend beginning this year. The Known changes every year, and sometimes they simply don't have a spin. This has happened before. Regarding different flight characteristics of various aircraft, that's what makes this sport interesting. It's also what forces pilots to really learn what's required to produce good results in their aircraft. Not every airplane has to spin exactly like another airplane to make the spin a suitable competition figure. It's all about technique and practice. I only recall one or two airplanes (both warbirds) in my ten years in the sport, including judging, that physically could not be coerced into a decent looking spin. But these planes were being flown purely for laughs and you can bet the pilot and everyone else on the ground were having fun and not caring about the airplane's spin qualities. 99.9% of the time, spin presentation problems are pilot issues, RVs included.

Quote:
Originally Posted by f14av8r View Post
I dislike the inclusion of snap rolls in the intermediate sequence. RV type aircraft do not snap well or easily. And, frankly, it's just **** hard on the airplane. I love competing in my airplane but I don't want to destroy it either. Snaps should be for advanced and above. That would encourage more proficient sportsman category participants to move up a level. I will never move up to Intermediate if I have to snap roll my airplane - period.
I understand the RV-centric perspective on this, but the counterpoint here is that there are maybe two RV pilots in the whole country currently whose participation in Intermediate may be influenced by the snap roll issue. I'd love to see more RVs at contests, but the snap issue is definitely not what is holding back the RV population from giving the sport a try. The basic level snap is a rather fundamental acro figure, and 95% of IAC pilots who are willing to fly Intermediate are also flying aircraft perfectly capable of snapping. The snap and the occasional roller are practically the only new maneuvers that actually differentiate Intermediate from Sportsman. Eliminating it would significantly change the building block nature of the category structure, and make it a lot less interesting watching newbie Intermediate pilots work on them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by f14av8r View Post
I looked at the Primary sequence on the IAC website and saw it starts, typically, with a 1 1/2 spin! So we put our newest competitors in the position of executing one of the most competitive judging specific figures. Go figure!
This is nothing new either, and the 1.5 spin is actually the easiest spin to fly and score well. Easier than the 1 turn. You'll of course never see the 1 1/4 in Primary.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-26-2018, 06:55 PM
SMRacer's Avatar
SMRacer SMRacer is online now
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Leesburg, VA
Posts: 608
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by f14av8r View Post
And then . . .

I looked at the Primary sequence on the IAC website and saw it starts, typically, with a 1 1/2 spin! So we put our newest competitors in the position of executing one of the most competitive judging specific figures. Go figure!

Oh well, progress however slight . . .
Go figure, is right. Spin is eliminated in Sportsman but remains in Primary. The spin is an intimidating figure for beginners, and the RV will find it difficult to score well (Unless you have 30 pounds of lead shot in your tail)
__________________
Jim
Leesburg, VA (KJYO)
RV4 N444JT (sold)
RV8 N37PK
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 12-26-2018, 07:02 PM
spatsch spatsch is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Denison, TX
Posts: 308
Default

I will actually miss the spin. Always liked them. Oh well might finally force me to get my act together and get the free I have been talking about all year .... ,

Haven?t flown the sequence yet ( waiting for a new alternator) but sportsman figure 5-6-7 seems interesting for an RV. You either keep the power in but then you will have to much speed for a spli-s or you don?t and get a slow roll like this year. In particular if you don?t have the breaking power of a constant speed prop.

Will make it interesting.

Thx Ron for representing RV?s at the IAC you are doing a great job. Looking forward to flying this.

Oliver
__________________
Oliver Spatscheck
RV-8 N-2EQ -- flying 500+ hours
Fokker DR-1 N-22EQ -- under construction
http://www.spatscheck.com/oliver
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 12-26-2018, 07:11 PM
spatsch spatsch is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Denison, TX
Posts: 308
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SMRacer View Post
Go figure, is right. Spin is eliminated in Sportsman but remains in Primary. The spin is an intimidating figure for beginners, and the RV will find it difficult to score well (Unless you have 30 pounds of lead shot in your tail)
Not quit sure why you say that. Only made one contest this year but my spin average was 8.8 in both flights and I have no weight in my tail. Never had an issue with spin entry.

Oliver
__________________
Oliver Spatscheck
RV-8 N-2EQ -- flying 500+ hours
Fokker DR-1 N-22EQ -- under construction
http://www.spatscheck.com/oliver

Last edited by spatsch : 12-26-2018 at 07:24 PM. Reason: Correct last year to this year. Not 2019 yet....
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 12-26-2018, 08:39 PM
SHIPCHIEF SHIPCHIEF is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Seattle
Posts: 1,412
Default

I noticed the snaproll in the Intermediate Sequence is at the top of a loop.
This has got to be the most gentle snap roll. Low airspeed, minimal positive G.
I don't see this as a high stress maneuver for an RV.
However, a more vigorous snaproll could be included in the 'Unknown'?
Additionally, unknown sequences tend to have more pilot errors, so a poorly flown snap done at a higher speed could occur in the 'Unknown'.
I would lobby for restricting those instead of the Avalanche in the 'Known Sequence'.
__________________
Scott Emery
http://gallery.eaa326.org/v/members/semery/
EAA 668340, chapter 326 & IAC chapter 67
RV-8 N89SE first flight 12/26/2013
Yak55M, and the wife has an RV-4
There is nothing-absolute nothing-half so much worth doing as simply messing around with Aeroplanes
(with apologies to Ratty)
2019
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:45 PM.


The VAFForums come to you courtesy Delta Romeo, LLC. By viewing and participating in them you agree to build your plane using standardized methods and practices and to fly it safely and in accordance with the laws governing the country you are located in.