MoTeC ECU

TXFlyGuy · #1 10-31-2017, 10:09 AM

Any of you RVer's with alternative engines (or otherwise) running a MoTeC ECU? I have heard that they are the industry leader, and are the best. Expensive? Yes.

A local dealer in the DFW area has been contacted. They have experience with a number of racers at Reno, and they were scheduled to do some work with the P-51 Galloping Ghost. Before the accident, that is.

This is the ECU used by the Thunder Mustang. Most often in dual installations.

Looking for any feedback on this.

Thanks!

hgerhardt · #2 10-31-2017, 06:41 PM

No experience with airborne Motecs, but I've had an M48 in my '66 GTO for 19 years. Never had an issue with it.

Heinrich

TXFlyGuy · #3 10-31-2017, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hgerhardt

No experience with airborne Motecs, but I've had an M48 in my '66 GTO for 19 years. Never had an issue with it.

Heinrich

How about programming? How difficult was that?
I will paraphrase the forums resident expert in all things electronic (and other things)...
"MoTeC is the absolute best ECU money an buy."
Ross Farnham

Toobuilder · #4 11-01-2017, 07:15 AM

Curious about the context of "best" in your mind.

You already have a functional ECU that is apparently recommended by the kit manufacturer (Titan). What specific, technical attribute does the Motec possess which has you thinking of changing? Have you compared MTBF rates, mass properties, technical features, cost, brand recognition... What?

If you want help, you are going to have to to do better than "...I heard they are the best..."

TXFlyGuy · #5 11-01-2017, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toobuilder

Curious about the context of "best" in your mind.

You already have a functional ECU that is apparently recommended by the kit manufacturer (Titan). What specific, technical attribute does the Motec possess which has you thinking of changing? Have you compared MTBF rates, mass properties, technical features, cost, brand recognition... What?

If you want help, you are going to have to to do better than "...I heard they are the best..."

At this stage, the kit manufacturer really does not have a hard and fast recommendation. Our Link G4+ Xtreme will be swapped out, and sold.

The MoTeC unit is functioning flawlessly in many aircraft, particularly the Thunder Mustang.

The bottom line is that MoTeC is the industry leader. Even Ross Farnham (resident expert) has made similar statements about this ECU.

We are working with Fischer Motorsports. They are highly experienced in aviation applications. Fischer has an enviable track record here. They have worked with a number of Reno Racers. That is the main reason for the switch.

It is expensive. And I will have to work some overtime to pay for it. But this is not an area we want to attempt to save money.

All of their stuff is mil-spec. An upgrade from what we currently have.

Toobuilder · #6 11-01-2017, 04:01 PM

In aerospace, a product either meets requirements or it does not meet requirements. Those that meet requirements are ranked based upon their attributes ? Cost, weight, form factor, supportability, etc. This is called a trade study, and the most desirable product is typically selected based upon the weight of the attributes. I have yet to see an attribute called ?better? in a trade study. You have apparently performed a ?trade study? of sorts and selected the Motec unit over your existing CPU. So once again, is there an attribute or attributes that the Motec unit possesses that exceeds the corresponding Link attribute(s)? You are soliciting comments on your decision, so you need to provide your criteria for anyone to have a chance at answering your query.

Yes, Ross is the resident expert in ECU's, and it does not surprise me if he is impressed with the brand, but in this thread, ?Better? or ?best? is meaningless without context.

TXFlyGuy · #7 11-01-2017, 04:13 PM

The decision is deeper than just the selection of an ECU. It includes the wiring harness, and the skill in assembly, plus the quality components.

Factory support from MoTeC is world class. This is huge.

No, there has been no study directly comparing the two units.

The decision is being influenced by comments from other ECU builders/companies (SDS), and the reputation of the company involved with the manufacture.

Plus real world feedback from those in the auto racing arena.

In addition, the fact that Thunder Mustang has selected MoTeC is a major factor.

Fischer Motorsports is the company we are dealing with. Their direct input on this issue, plus their experience in the aviation industry (Reno), is weighing heavily in the decision.

The only negative is price. But sometimes you really do get what you pay for.

Comments solicited are in hopes of finding someone here with first hand, real world experience with this product. Either positive, or negative.

Are they better than Link? My dealer says there is no comparison. But you would expect that.

hgerhardt · #8 11-01-2017, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TXFlyGuy

How about programming? How difficult was that?
...

I'm going by somewhat hazy recollection since I last tuned it 15 years ago, but what I like is the extreme adjustability. There are tons of options just for idle, off-idle, accelerator pump tuning... all those things that make it great for streetability from a 700HP V8 with a fairly big roller cam. It was one of the 1st ECU's to use a wide-band lambda sensor and can run closed-loop even at WOT if desired. Fuel tables can be set up with throttle angle vs RPM, manifold pressure vs RPM, and forgot what other methods. It will handle N2O, turbo boost, switch between different maps as desired. You write a table with desired fuel/air ratios and as the engine is running under various loads, hit the Q key on your laptop (quick lambda) which writes the corresponding cell in the fuel table, which makes tuning easy. You can tailor individual injector pulsewidth like we do with "GAMI tuning", as well as injection timing relative to intake valve opening. You can connect pretty much any sensor you can find.

All that is to say it seems to me to be overkill for aircraft usage where the majority of time you're running WOT at steady RPM. Unless of course you're racing and you think you need all that adjustability.

TXFlyGuy · #9 11-02-2017, 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hgerhardt

I'm going by somewhat hazy recollection since I last tuned it 15 years ago, but what I like is the extreme adjustability. There are tons of options just for idle, off-idle, accelerator pump tuning... all those things that make it great for streetability from a 700HP V8 with a fairly big roller cam. It was one of the 1st ECU's to use a wide-band lambda sensor and can run closed-loop even at WOT if desired. Fuel tables can be set up with throttle angle vs RPM, manifold pressure vs RPM, and forgot what other methods. It will handle N2O, turbo boost, switch between different maps as desired. You write a table with desired fuel/air ratios and as the engine is running under various loads, hit the Q key on your laptop (quick lambda) which writes the corresponding cell in the fuel table, which makes tuning easy. You can tailor individual injector pulsewidth like we do with "GAMI tuning", as well as injection timing relative to intake valve opening. You can connect pretty much any sensor you can find.

All that is to say it seems to me to be overkill for aircraft usage where the majority of time you're running WOT at steady RPM. Unless of course you're racing and you think you need all that adjustability.

Yes, as with many ECU's, there are a number of features that don't apply to airplanes.

Thanks for your input. The unit certainly looks to be robust, from what I have seen.

WOT power will range from 430 hp (4500 rpm) at sea level, to cruising at 12,000' MSL with 210 hp (3800 rpm).

Racing? Yes...count us in!

lr172 · #10 11-03-2017, 02:13 PM

Certainly the Motec is king for configurability, but it seems SDS has a pretty adequate level of configurability for aviation, along with a few unique ones, such as fuel flow (red cube emulation). However, the key thing that they have and Motec doesn't is redundancy. That simply isn't an issue for automotive, but certainly is for us.

I have a Megasquirt for EI and have toyed with the idea of using it for FI. The configurabliity rivals the Motec, however the reliability does not. Though I have sketched out plans for redundant MS's. All that said, there just isn't enough benefit for me to take the risk. I did a Megasquirt on my Porsche with custom turbo and I love it. The key difference is that with the Porsche I can pull over to fix an issue.

Larry