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  #11  
Old 08-06-2017, 10:04 PM
lr172 lr172 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Schaumburg, IL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slice View Post
I'm a forty-something, old school type guy buy I'd personally push you towards a mixed concept of less technology upfront(only VOR/DME with HSI?) then finishing with all glass. When sh*t goes wrong the ability to put your finger on the approach plate and know where you are without all the gee whiz stuff is priceless. JMHO.

What are guys doing for partial panel training with the G3X?
I agree in concept with your thoughts/approach here, regarding basics first. However, This can be done in a glass environment. I did plenty of VOR work (approaches, holds, etc.) My EFIS has an HSI that looks identical to a 3 1/8" version on a Cessna. Even has an OBS knob. I have CDI indicators just like on a seperate 3 1/8" indicator, it is just super-imposed over my attitude representation. I fully agree with the concept of not letting the student program everything in his 430 and navigate by following the pink line. However, most glass is just a way to combine the 6 pack in one screen and those individual components can still be taught by a good instructor. Clearly, removing some of the glass automation is an effective teaching tool. I was not allowed to use my autopilot at any time in my training and I felt it forced me to develop more precise habits.

Dial the clock back 20 years, and I am sure instructors were saying the same thing about HSI's, telling students to use a separate heading indicator and CDI / ADF to better prepare them. A parallel would be forcing all new drivers to learn on manual transmission based cars. Today, one can become a very competent driver without ever knowing what gear they are in.

In my intial training I did partial panel with and ASI, ALT and ADI - with GPS approaches (CDI on GPS screen). Later in my training I added a second EFIS and put in battery backups for them. Glass is my primary and my backup.

Larry
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N64LR - RV-6A / IO-320, Flying as of 8/2015
N11LR - RV-10, Flying as of 12/2019

Last edited by lr172 : 08-06-2017 at 10:28 PM.
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  #12  
Old 08-06-2017, 11:46 PM
BobTurner BobTurner is online now
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Livermore, CA
Posts: 6,797
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Well, I was instructing 20 years ago, and I never objected to an HSI. But I did love NDB approaches! When a student could do them well, I knew that he had mastered visualizing his position and orientation - without a moving map. The auto parallel would be a 16 year old learning to drive in a car with a gps moving map. Turn it off, and he can't figure out how to get home! Don't get me wrong, I love the avionics we have now. But I do a fair number of IPCs, and I can always tell the pilots who have never flown without moving maps. If I 'fail' the map, the pilot gets mentally lost.
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  #13  
Old 08-07-2017, 05:25 AM
terrykohler terrykohler is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,009
Default We're Getting Old

IIRC, my own early instrument instruction included some ranting about using a rotatable card on the NDB approaches - like it would destroy my capability to figure out headings and intercepts on my own.

My big challenge today is to stop over-controlling the aircraft because the digital information coming at me is showing heading and altitude changes one degree and one foot at a time. I have to keep reminding myself that maritime compasses showed 32 points (rather than 360 degrees) for a reason - holding course any closer was an exercise in futility.

Terry, CFI
RV9A N323TP
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