PMAG Problem

[GalinHdz]

Originally Posted by 6 Gun

Sounds like the P mag company needs to pay to fix this guys engine if he was not notified of problem.
Bob

Sounds like somebody should not be in the experimental aviation world.

[flightlogic]

Loal, it might not be practical... but a pinch hitter course for your wife might be something to look into. As you mentioned, having someone else to bounce ideas off of always helps. I started out just intending to have my wife get familiar. Eventually she passed the PPL test. She is far more engaged in all flights now. Though she has not flown the RV solo... just the Cessna trainers, she understands how they work.
I probably would have done just what you did. Having had a long list of inflight emergencies... I have had the "benefit" of trying out different things. Monday morning quaterback data base if you will. I had a very experienced B 17 pilot with me the time a plane caught fire inflight. He really helped. We got it on the ground gear up and ran like ****. It burned to the ground.
Anyway, I always switch tanks... richen the mixture... pull the rpm back, and then do some diagnostics. Somewhere in that flow is punching the nearest airport button on the GPS. Many pilots stay in the air far too long when working out a solution. A task much better suited to the ramp. Have a great holiday and hope future trips are much smoother.

[gbusterguy]

That inflight fire stuff scares me just thinking about it! Thanks for the tip on getting my wife up to speed on flying. I've tried that in the past and couldn't get her interested, I'll try again, I think it's a great idea.

I'll report back after the Emag guys do their evaluation.

[N941WR]

Originally Posted by GalinHdz

Sounds like somebody should not be in the experimental aviation world.

Let's think about this.

During the last Condition Inspection the Emag site was not checked for current service bulletins, which might have prevented the issue.

Then the aircraft in question had some shorting wires under the cowl, which may have (or may not have) caused the lost timing.

The pilot could have switched off the P-mag. Having a mixed ignition, that would be my first guess.

How are either of those two issues or the fact the pilot did not do a mag check the Emag company's fault?

Yes, it is a bummer that Loal is going to foot the bill for this.

[DanH]

Originally Posted by Whitman

Just a quick reminder to check emag website for service notes. I just had an emergency in flight and would have benefited greatly from seeing this before hand, reference case bolts on pmag in my case. More to follow once I get the plane flying again.

http://www.emagair.com/service-notes/

This is the problem Whit referred to; four internal screws that apparently didn't get locking agent when assembled. As a result, his p-mag was coming apart in flight.

[Walt]

Originally Posted by N941WR

Let's think about this.

During the last Condition Inspection the Emag site was not checked for current service bulletins, which might have prevented the issue.

Then the aircraft in question had some shorting wires under the cowl, which may have (or may not have) caused the lost timing.

The pilot could have switched off the P-mag. Having a mixed ignition, that would be my first guess.

How are either of those two issues or the fact the pilot did not do a mag check the Emag company's fault?

Yes, it is a bummer that Loal is going to foot the bill for this.

And lets also think about:

I thought the whole point of having an internal power supply was to prevent external electrical failure from shutting down the PMAG?

If the engine starts runnning rough, you have a lot on your plate, doing a 'MAG' check probably isn't the first thing that is going thru the pilots mind, so don't blame him.

I also take exception to the casting of aspersions on the last guy to do the CI, SB's are advisory in nature and not mandatory in any maintenance program I'm aware of (91, 125, 135, 121), blaming that guy for the failure of the PMAG is just not not cool.

[ChiefPilot]

Originally Posted by Walt

I also take exception to the casting of aspersions on the last guy to do the CI, SB's are advisory in nature and not mandatory in any maintenance program I'm aware of (91, 125, 135, 121), blaming that guy for the failure of the PMAG is just not not cool.

I think the idea is that the PMag wasn't solely to blame for the issue and was subjected to an environment outside it's design parameters. Frankly, I'm skeptical that such a failure could cause the timing issue and think maybe switchology might have been involved otherwise it's not clear how a powered-and-ungrounded PMag could revert it's timing.

And I could be completely wrong - or I could be completely right. Because that question exists, placing all the blame on the PMag is specious - and I think that is what Bill is getting at. I'd add only that he's not wrong.

[N941WR]

Originally Posted by ChiefPilot

I think the idea is that the PMag wasn't solely to blame for the issue and was subjected to an environment outside it's design parameters. Frankly, I'm skeptical that such a failure could cause the timing issue and think maybe switchology might have been involved otherwise it's not clear how a powered-and-ungrounded PMag could revert it's timing.

And I could be completely wrong - or I could be completely right. Because that question exists, placing all the blame on the PMag is specious - and I think that is what Bill is getting at. I'd add only that he's not wrong.

Thanks Brad. You are correct, this is a mix of faults. The OP is a good guy and when we spoke, he was unaware of the Emag SB. He is not happy but is not blaming Emag either. He is much more "collected" than I would be, if I were in the same situation!

The picture Dan posted is about two or three months old and is another reason you should check all your vendors for service bulletins!

[cguarino]

Originally Posted by Walt

And lets also think about:


If the engine starts runnning rough, you have a lot on your plate, doing a 'MAG' check probably isn't the first thing that is going thru the pilots mind, so don't blame him.

I'm not grading/insulting/judging etc anyone, but I think this is a dangerous comment. It lowers the level of performance expectation. To say that a pilot should not be thinking of a mag check in this situation is not accurate. If I have a recip that starts running rough, the first thing I'm going to do is push the mixture forward, turn the boost pump on and switch tanks. The second thing I'm going to do is a mag check. I've been in this exact situation and turned off the offending pmag and flew home on the other. I'm not evaluating one pilot's performance. Not my job. I'm talking about every pilot. If you fly airplanes, you need to be able to think clearly under stress. If it is time critical, such as engine failure on take off, it needs to be automatic. That is why there are boldface items in some aircraft. In fact, there should be boldface items in all aircraft. Some things just need to be muscle memory. On the other hand, if you are at altitude and have time, you need to be disciplined and methodical while attempting to solve the problem. Maintain aircraft control, analyze the situation and take the appropriate action. We have all heard those words and it is our responsibility to execute them. To say some one is going to be overloaded or overstressed and not accomplish basic EP items is not OK. I know we live in a society of participation trophies but that doesn't work in aviation. You either make the grade, quit flying or die. Even though we have a lot of fun doing it, this is serious business with dire consequences when not executed correctly. Fly safe.

[DanH]

Originally Posted by N941WR

The picture Dan posted is about two or three months old and is another reason you should check all your vendors for service bulletins!

You mean the bulletin is two or three months old.

http://www.emagair.com/service-notes/

I removed that unscrewed p-mag yesterday in Dothan.