Lauren Paine article in SA

[Infidel]

Originally Posted by LettersFromFlyoverCountry

Well, your name is withheld. But accusing a right of falsifying content is a terrible allegation to make.

And you guys know Lauran is reading this thread, right? Show some respect to a gentleman who's more than earned it.

Too deep Bob and you are reading into it more than I implied. There was no disrespect to him as I greatly enjoy his writings and also understand we all make decisions that other do not agree with. And no, my name is not withheld. Blue skies....

[LettersFromFlyoverCountry]

Originally Posted by ExtraKatana

He did hear the story.
However I can remember my Grandfather scolding me when I was 8 yrs of age because I made a bold statement about out-of-state drivers. He made sure I understood before I left Elementary School that bold statements that targeted a "group" should not be spoken. Therefore in my thinking, any adult to say "They're all like that" greatly reduces the validity of a statement. As the sharks would say, For that reason I'm out.

The writer of the letter is obviously engaging in hyperbole. That can hardly be in dispute, but it's also irrelevant to the larger point Lauran is making: there's a broad consequence to being a jerk. I'm pretty sure this is also not in dispute.

Forget the RV component. That's not the point of the column and I'm pretty sure if we're capable of building airplanes, we're capable of understanding that and I think we do. Everything beyond that is just social media noise.

Represent.

[Kyle Boatright]

Originally Posted by LettersFromFlyoverCountry

The writer of the letter is obviously engaging in hyperbole. That can hardly be in dispute, but it's also irrelevant to the larger point Lauran is making: there's a broad consequence to being a jerk. I'm pretty sure this is also not in dispute.

Forget the RV component. That's not the point of the column and I'm pretty sure if we're capable of building airplanes, we're capable of understanding that and I think we do. Everything beyond that is just social media noise.

Represent.

The RV component was very pointed. That is why it is of interest to this board. If he'd written that being a jerk pilot is a bad thing and given examples of jerk type behavior without associating it to an aircraft type, everyone would have agreed. Tie it to an aircraft type, particularly when you build the column around a dubious letter claiming events that have not been substantiated, and there's gonna be blowback.

Simple cause and effect, IMO.

[ccsmith51]

Originally Posted by Kyle Boatright

The RV component was very pointed. That is why it is of interest to this board. If he'd written that being a jerk pilot is a bad thing and given examples of jerk type behavior without associating it to an aircraft type, everyone would have agreed. Tie it to an aircraft type, particularly when you build the column around a dubious letter claiming events that have not been substantiated, and there's gonna be blowback.

Simple cause and effect, IMO.

+1

This is a national magazine, read by many more than just RV pilots. Using the actions of some RV'ers as an example points us out in particular. Agreed it could (should) have been written without singling out a particular aircraft type.

[LettersFromFlyoverCountry]

The letter he got was the letter he got. And it's hardly news to any of us that RV pilots as a group have often attained a dubious status thanks to the lunkheads among us. That can hardly be disputed and you only need to go back over the years in VAF (and its father, Yahoogroups) to know that (my favorite part of that thread was when Louise pointed out that almost every pilot she's seen doing something stupid was male). Van, himself, has opined on the company's Facebook page about the hot doggers who ruin the image of people who buy his product.

As Paul Dye so eloquently put it in one such VAF discussion.

We are becoming the "Outlaw Bikers" of the aviation world because of the actions of a few. The only way to stop it is to be BETTER than we have to be - and either correct or shun those who refuse to play nice with others. Or we accept the fact that we will all be painted as outlaws.

Sound familiar? He made that point five years ago.

I think the danger now -- assuming Sport Aviation is full of letters next month from offended RVators -- is that in addition to appearing to be hot rodding jerks, we're going to look like a bunch of thin-skinned weenies .

Maybe we should just take a knee, accept Lauran's message in the spirit it was written and don't fly like jerks. Simple.

[skylor]

Originally Posted by LettersFromFlyoverCountry

The letter he got was the letter he got. And it's hardly news to any of us that RV pilots as a group have often attained a dubious status thanks to the lunkheads among us. That can hardly be disputed and you only need to go back over the years in VAF (and its father, Yahoogroups) to know that (my favorite part of that thread was when Louise pointed out that almost every pilot she's seen doing something stupid was male). Van, himself, has opined on the company's Facebook page about the hot doggers who ruin the image of people who buy his product.

As Paul Dye so eloquently put it in one such VAF discussion.



Sound familiar? He made that point five years ago.

I think the danger now -- assuming Sport Aviation is full of letters next month from offended RVators -- is that in addition to appearing to be hot rodding jerks, we're going to look like a bunch of thin-skinned weenies .

Maybe we should just take a knee, accept Lauran's message in the spirit it was written and don't fly like jerks. Simple.

Very well said Bob!

Skylor

[rvbuilder2002]

Originally Posted by LettersFromFlyoverCountry

The letter he got was the letter he got. And it's hardly news to any of us that RV pilots as a group have often attained a dubious status thanks to the lunkheads among us. That can hardly be disputed and you only need to go back over the years in VAF (and its father, Yahoogroups) to know that (my favorite part of that thread was when Louise pointed out that almost every pilot she's seen doing something stupid was male). Van, himself, has opined on the company's Facebook page about the hot doggers who ruin the image of people who buy his product.

As Paul Dye so eloquently put it in one such VAF discussion.
Quote:
We are becoming the "Outlaw Bikers" of the aviation world because of the actions of a few. The only way to stop it is to be BETTER than we have to be - and either correct or shun those who refuse to play nice with others. Or we accept the fact that we will all be painted as outlaws.


Sound familiar? He made that point five years ago.

I think the danger now -- assuming Sport Aviation is full of letters next month from offended RVators -- is that in addition to appearing to be hot rodding jerks, we're going to look like a bunch of thin-skinned weenies .

Maybe we should just take a knee, accept Lauran's message in the spirit it was written and don't fly like jerks. Simple.

Two thumbs up Bob (with a disclaimer)

As has been discussed in depth here many times in the past, there are many different levels of perception within the aviation community.
Many think that any formation flying, or an overhead break pattern entry, or <fill in the blank> is reckless and uncalled for. Period.
I do not feel that way, but do feel that we need to be sensitive to when and where, and avoid putting others in a position that they feel this way.
And we need to stop the back slapping / encouraging that promotes behavior that is inappropriate at any time.

[laz]

When I initially read this article I was not impressed with the letter included, nor the way it seemed to make up the main body of the message. Being a lousy writer myself I waited to see the reaction of others more skilled than myself. Not surprised at the response at all.

I am relatively new to the RV community. I am just now finishing up my RV8. I read the SA article several times, on different days just to see if my perception of its over all message would change. Unfortunately it did not. publishing the letter targeted at a specific aircraft type was a mistake on any level.

After 48 years of flying and 30,000 hours, it has been my personal experience there are jerks in every type of airplane. No single type or category has ever stood out. Targeting a specific aircraft group/type is simply wrong.

Think of the Long EZ community when John Denver lost his life in that "type" of airplane. Knowledgeable people know that the "type" of aircraft had nothing to do with the crash, but that stigma for the plane, to some degree, still lasts.

[Epepperman]

I will not "TAKE A KNEE" for anything I have not done just because someone has tarnished my image. We are all not guilty of having done something. It is not my place to stop a pilot and say hey dude you know your giving us a bad image,
BS, he is giving himself a bad image not me.

[KatieB]

I thought the article was well-written and thought provoking. The basic human reaction since the beginning of time is to assume after a few similar encounters that "they're all like that..." whether it's RV pilots, pit bulls, cops, or any other subject that will get a VAF post deleted. I wouldn't be surprised if Mr. Paine actually wanted his fellow RV pilots to be a little offended by this Cub pilot's opinion. Sometimes being offended is good for us, because it pushes us into thinking and talking about stuff that our egos normally try to push under the rug.