Gamut Services

Oldgeezer · #1 01-07-2007, 06:49 PM

Has anyone besides Bob Kelly recieved a composite canopy from Charles Wilhite ? Mine was on order and paid for in July 2006 and after many promises and delays, I decided that I have waited long enough. I have called, and emailed with no response. Today I sent him a FAX and tomorrow a letter will go out demanding a full refund of my $3400. I had high hopes for a decent product that would save building time, but this is real discouraging. I will now have to pay Van's full price for a canopy system, since I already have the finishing kit. A real bummer. I could say more but I am holding my tongue for now.If anyone has made contact with him, maybe you can find out what his problem is.

Ron

Ironflight · #2 01-07-2007, 07:22 PM

I don't really know anything about the company or the products, but I remembered this thread for a last month that might give you some more info:

http://www.vansairforce.com/communit...ighlight=Gamut

osxuser · #3 01-07-2007, 07:23 PM

Search the forums, I recall a thread about this a couple months back...

Mike Ice · #4 01-12-2007, 08:25 AM

Ron,

This happened to me as well. I signed up for one of the canopies and got nothing, well I finally got a refund but it wasn't easy. Keep hammering away.
I do hope you get satisfaction.

Mike

revenson · #5 03-04-2007, 05:44 PM

Bottom Line: Not yet ready for prime time. A great idea and the product is solid, but it is still in development. At this point, I?d advise one to insist that installation be included.

Introduction: This product was provided by Gamutservices (Charles Wilhite) as an alternative to the stock RV-7/9 sliding canopy. The intent is to provide this as a builder installed item. Some may know Charles as the provider of the RV-8 composite access door that has resulted in favorable reviews.

I first learned of a potential replacement for Van?s slider at Oshkosh 2004. After hearing all the canopy woes on the ?lists?, for me an alternative was worth further investigation. I contacted Charles shortly after Oshkosh 2004. The product was not yet ready. Since I was not yet ready for a canopy, I communicated periodically with him to follow its development, and visited him during the summer of 2005. I left with the impression he was technically capable, but I wasn?t convinced he had the necessary time and management skills to follow through.

Service: Nevertheless, I shipped him my canopy in September 2005. By May 2006, I was ready for a canopy and the arrangement was that Charles would install it at my hangar. June 28-29 was our first firmly scheduled date. Charles did not show. August 3 was our second scheduled time. Again, Charles did not make it. Finally, he made it to Tucson August 12-14. He worked about 25 hours over those days but could not complete the canopy. We scheduled another visit for August 25, but he did not make that date. He did return September 8-10, and worked about 24 hours. I had somehow lost the rail he had sent previously, so we were unable to complete the installation. He returned October 15, worked another 15 hours, and ?mostly? completed the job on October 18, 2006.

Comments: My canopy was Prototype #3, so I expected some bumps in the road. I believe Charles is honest, diligent and responsible, but to date my initial impression has proven correct. He has difficulty meeting his own time commitments. But he accepted this responsibility and did not attempt to blame others or provide weak excuses. In one way he went beyond his commitments?he provided me valuable tutoring and helped complete other composite work on my project. The trip to Tucson is 1300 miles one-way for him. In addition, he was doing this together with other, unrelated composite projects, and was trying to start this business on a shoestring. His tooling was not yet quite right, was resulted in the need for additional on-site, custom modifications.

Product: My expectation was for a canopy ready for priming. This was not met. I will have to complete additional fairing and sanding. In addition, I will need to make three additional, small aluminum pieces. These are not necessary, but will add to a finished look. The canopy fits solidly when secured from inside. It locks with two clasps, low on each side. There are no significant air gaps. The fit along the side is very good. There is no movement or sloppiness once secured. I think it will function well. The side rails have a nice finish, and fit lower on the side rails than those of the standard canopy. The sliding mechanism is very smooth. Some attachment hardware was fabricated on-site, so did not come with a ?finished? look. At this time I do not have a way to lock the canopy from the outside (a lock has been promised). Pushing the canopy closed from the outside rear results in some wobble. But when pulling it closed from inside, it travels very well. There is a 1/8" gap between the rear edge of the canopy and the fuselage skin when it is closed. However, this does not result in an air gap. There is no center brace in the windscreen, providing more visibility, yet this ?rollbar? frame is very strong. The windscreen looks great from the outside, but from the inside, there are uneven areas between the plexi and the composite frame that need cosmetic improvement. I don?t know how much the stock slider weighs, but the slider part of this one is 21 lbs. I?d be curious to hear how much Van?s weighs.

Comments: I have not yet evaluated to what extent most of the claimed advantages of the ?Charles Canopy? have been met: 3/4" more headroom; lighter by 8 lbs; stronger; 5 inches more room to access the baggage area; more visibility; easier and faster to install; easier opening and closing; tighter fit with fewer drafts; stronger rear slide rail; and, less drag due to no external handle.

I would not advise one to buy this product with the expectation that the customer can install it. There were no install instructions available at the time. In my experience, it was certainly not yet ?easier and faster to install.?

Roger Evenson
March 4, 2007

Kentsrv7a · #6 03-05-2007, 07:25 AM

I too have been taken by Charles Wilhite with my canopy. Unfortunately I did not discover this website until it was too late. I sent him my canopy in September as well as a deposit for an early December delivery. I was able to talk with him in early December and was promised a by Xmas delivery. Haven't heard from him since. I have contacted an attorney and step 1 is in the works. He will be receiving a letter requesting a complete refund. At this point I do not want anything to do with Gamut Services no matter what the product. I just want want my canopy in the new condition back or monetary compensation so I can purchase another and get my plnae in the air. His lack of service, for what ever reason, is a complete 180 from the RV community. I hope the people who know him and signed for my canopy will put some pressure on him before the court system does.

Kent

Oldgeezer · #7 03-19-2007, 04:23 PM

Today an Attorney has been contacted and legal action against Gamut Services and it's owner has been initiated. I have waited nine months for a carbon fiber composite canopy that was paid for in full and after many empty promises, excuses and failure to send me a full refund, I have had enough and have taken the only course left and that is a law suit. I know of five other RV builders who have also been ripped off by this individual and we are joining forces in a class action suit against him.
My understanding is that he sold 13 of these canopies, so if you too have been defrauded and wish to join us , then send me a private message, for details.
With all the good people in the RV community, it's a shame there is always a bad apple amongst us. If you have tried to connect to his web site or email or telephone, ForGetAboutIt , he has gone into hiding. Now it is time for the law to deal with him. We as builders cannot tolerate this dishonesty and need to reject these people from our group.

Ron

Mad as **** and tired of waiting

TxRVaviator · #8 03-31-2007, 08:10 AM

I went and saw Charles this week. He will finish the canopies he has orders for. He got behind due personal issues. He has someone who will take over the production of the canopies this summer. There was problems with the slight differences between the RV6 and RV7 frames so when he tried to use the RV6 mold canopy frame on a RV7 it becams a custom installation. He is finishing a RV7 mold. He will install my canopy system in about 8 weeks. (I'm only a few hundres miles away)

L.Adamson · #9 03-31-2007, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TxRVaviator

I went and saw Charles this week. He will finish the canopies he has orders for. He got behind due personal issues. He has someone who will take over the production of the canopies this summer. There was problems with the slight differences between the RV6 and RV7 frames so when he tried to use the RV6 mold canopy frame on a RV7 it becams a custom installation. He is finishing a RV7 mold. He will install my canopy system in about 8 weeks. (I'm only a few hundres miles away)

I would think, that some have already purchased replacement canopies, since their plane would possibly never be completed if waiting. I personally know one individual that has...

L.Adamson

TxRVaviator · #10 03-31-2007, 01:48 PM

I told him that. I was also about to buy a canopy from Van's. He told me he will contact the customers with canopies on order and work out refunds if they have replaced their canopy.