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06-05-2016, 07:37 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: adelaide, south australia
Posts: 171
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I don't get the 'brute force' description. At best I had to use what I would call a heavy but confident tap. I've heard people describing the actual destruction of bench vices. Wow. Mechanical empathy is all it takes. Obviously a cat can be skinned many ways. I almost laid down the money for a set of dies that would be used once.
Glad I didn't. Enabled me to spend that cash on fuel line tools I'd only use once  anyway, it's only my opinion. Do what you feel comfortable with.
Cheers,
DaveH 
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06-05-2016, 08:01 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: La Feria Texas
Posts: 3,822
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I used the dies, it took me about 15 minutes to make them perfect! I thought I could see problems doing it by beating them into submission so never even tried to do it that way;
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06-05-2016, 09:47 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Hubbard Oregon
Posts: 9,035
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People mentioning having to beat the *&#@~ out of them, or beat them in to submission never fully understood the desired process (not necessarily their fault.... not everyone will get the same understanding after reading text instructions).
As already mentioned, the hammering part of this process does not entail the use of brute force. It is just a firm wrap to induce the bend to take a set after a bending force has been applied by hand.
Most people that give it a try find that it was a lot simpler than it seemed....
__________________
Opinions, information and comments are my own unless stated otherwise. They do not necessarily represent the direction/opinions of my employer.
Scott McDaniels
Van's Aircraft Engineering Prototype Shop Manager
Hubbard, Oregon
RV-6A (aka "Junkyard Special ")
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06-05-2016, 10:59 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Gloversville, NY
Posts: 1,587
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DaveH and Scott,
I admire the skill and fortitude of those of you who found this task possible with a "heavy but confident tap" or a "firm wrap". I am guessing you both probably had some previous experience with metal work. When I did this task back in the day I did not have that background, and it proved very difficult. That is why I can empathsize with novice builders who are inexperienced in shop techniques who come up againsnt this job for the first time.
I think it important to remember that the RV-12 kit was designed for the novice ot first-time builder. Pre-drilled perfectly fitting parts and pop rivets etc. IMHO the longeron bending is a significant challenge to that first time builder. Sometimes what seems simple and easy to someone experienced can be very hard for the inexperienced. If there is a way to ease the frustration and end up with a better fitting part by using some kind of tool, jig, die or whatever you want to call it then I think that should be encouraged.
Scott, you are correct about some people not being able to get a full understanding of the process by reading the text. Certainly that was true in my case back in 2009 or 10. If I had someone to show me the ropes, or at least a video it might have been a whole lot easier. That is why I often suggest that for a task such as this the builder try to find a mentor.
Everyone that decides to attempt to build (some would say "assemble" in the case of an RV-12) an airplane comes to the project with a unique set of background skills and experience. For those on the lower end of that scale I would recommend using whatever tools make the job easier.
__________________
John Peck, CFII, A&P, EAA Tech Counselor, Flight Advisor.
?Master Pilot? Award, UFO Member.
RV-12 N37JP 120176 Flying since 2012.
One Week Wonder Build Team, OSH 2018.
VAF paid through 10/2019.
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06-05-2016, 02:30 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Stockton, California
Posts: 296
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There's another option, a good quality shrinker, like the Erco with the proper shrinking dies
[Couldn't link from my computer (I'm a rookie) so I linked to Fay Butler's website]
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06-05-2016, 03:19 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: St Lucie County, FL
Posts: 353
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First time builder here with no metal work background. I'm a quick hands on learner though. Bent my -10 logerons on the vise. The longerons did need some convincing though. I started with soft hits with a rubber mallot and progressed harder until I saw a change. Then repeated the same "firm" hit till it followed the contour of the side skins. I think the key was the preload. Took about one hour to do both which included frequent checks with the skins.
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Regards
Luis  --------------------------- RV-10---------------------------  Empennage. Complete Minus fiberglass and attach section. FOR SALE
Build Log N925LC (Reserved) YouTube
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06-05-2016, 03:59 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: New London, NC (near Charlotte), Boulder, CO
Posts: 271
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Every time I hear someone describe building the -12 as a simple assembly process I think back to the longeron.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJohn
DaveH and Scott,
snip
Everyone that decides to attempt to build (some would say "assemble" in the case of an RV-12) an airplane comes to the project with a unique set of background skills and experience. For those on the lower end of that scale I would recommend using whatever tools make the job easier.
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06-05-2016, 04:13 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Wee Waa Australia
Posts: 279
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Vans must have taken heed of the on going feedback from builders with the -14 longerons being pre- bent.
The only requirement is for a slight twist to be made which was simple.
I don't feel like a builder with the -14 more like an assembler. I've only had to reorder one small part so far.
I'm glad I didn't waste money on the fast build option.
Great kit!
__________________
Kit 140241
Tail Feathers done
Fuselage kit completed.
wings almost complete.
Flaps and ailerons done.
Canopy next. Phew!
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06-05-2016, 04:29 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Coeur d'Alene, ID/Casa Grande, AZ
Posts: 654
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Van's directions...a good heavy duty vice..some 3/4" pipe for spreading angles. Proved to be really simple.
But I have to admit, I spent much time concerned over them before getting started...hey, if you goof...new angle is cheap!!!
Go for it...you really don't need the fancy stuff😎
__________________
Ric Dickison
307 (CAB) Phantom
Search and Destroy (Can Tho RVN)
Distinguished Flying Cross Society Member
CH-47 & UH-1H "Driver"
Rotax 9 Series Service IRMT
RV-12 Kit#729 "N312RD" is now a full functioning fun machine!! Thanks Van for fulfilling my dream😎
2018 Dues Paid
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06-05-2016, 11:11 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Switzerland, Europe
Posts: 199
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used the dies
I used a fairly large mechanical press to open up the angle, then I used the Buller longeron dies and ended up in two nicely bent longerons at the same day.
I am glad to have gone that route.
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