|
-
POSTING RULES

-
Donate yearly (please).
-
Advertise in here!
-
Today's Posts
|
Insert Pics
|

12-23-2006, 09:55 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 5,685
|
|
Microlon?
In doing a fast scan back through my copy of Kent Paser's book "Speed With Economy" I was struck by something on page 132. Here are a few lines to set the mood. I read the book as I was building our plane as part of my effort to build for speed. I tried to build it "slick" with every fillet and fairing done to the best of my ability, biggest engine for the design, best constant speed prop (at the time). With extensives internal baffel modifications I have been able to coax out around 5 kts over my 170+kt baseline speed.
Ok today I read this paragraph on "Engine Aditives" (p.132) from this respected book, author and engineer that sounds like it came directly from a carnival snake oil salesman. To cut the story short - He added the Microlon that he won at Oshkosh and (quote) and says:
"The results of the test flight to determine the effects of the Microlon was a genuine surprise. My Mustang-II showed an additional 6 MPH of top speed! I can't verify all of the claims made by Microlon, and other teflon additives but I do believe my test data."
He has a fixed pitch prop so all I can see that would enable such a speed gain is higher RPM due to lower friction. In a constant speed prop installation the lower internal friction would result in higher prop pitch for the same RPM.
I checked it through Google and the company is still around and they have a product for racing. To say that I am dubious is putting it mildly. Has anyone else tested Microlon in their engine? If so, what is the engine/prop combination? What were the test results? What is the long term operational experience?
Bob Axsom
|

12-23-2006, 10:18 AM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
Posts: 1,324
|
|
From the Skeptic's Dictionary
The basic ingredient is the same in most of these additives: 50 weight engine oil with standard additives. The magic ingredient in Slick 50, Liquid Ring, Matrix, QM1 and T-Plus from K-Mart is Polytetrafluoroethylene. Don't try to pronounce it: call it PTFE. But don't call it Teflon, which is what it is, because that is a registered trademark. Dupont, who invented Teflon, claims that "Teflon is not useful as an ingredient in oil additives or oils used for internal combustion engines." But what do they know? They haven't seen the secret studies done by Petrolon (Slick 50).
PTFE is a solid which is added to engine oil and coats the moving parts of the engine.
However, such solids seem even more inclined to coat non-moving parts, like oil passages and filters. After all, if it can build up under the pressures and friction exerted on a cylinder wall, then it stands to reason it should build up even better in places with low pressures and virtually no friction.
This conclusion seems to be borne out by tests on oil additives containing PTFE conducted by the NASA Lewis Research Center, which said in their report, "In the types of bearing surface contact we have looked at, we have seen no benefit. In some cases we have seen detrimental effect. The solids in the oil tend to accumulate at inlets and act as a dam, which simply blocks the oil from entering. Instead of helping, it is actually depriving parts of lubricant".
In defense of Slick 50, tests done on a Chevy 6 cylinder engine by the University of Utah Engineering Experiment Station found that after treatment with the PTFE additive the test engine's friction was reduced by 13.1 percent, the output horsepower increased from 5.3 percent to 8.1 percent, and fuel economy improved as well. Unfortunately, the same tests concluded that "There was a pressure drop across the oil filter resulting from possible clogging of small passageways." Oil analysis showed that iron contamination doubled after the treatment, indicating that engine wear increased.
John Clark
RV8 N18U
KSBA
|

12-23-2006, 11:47 AM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Chandler, AZ
Posts: 2,901
|
|
Microlon
In the mid-80's I was actively involved in racing RC airplanes. The engines were hand built custom fit units. Any edge to be gained was explored. We tried Microlon and experienced 2-300 rpm increase. This isn't much when you are turning 18,000 RPM but it is a little gain.
One of my racing buddies got a quantity of Microlon for a good price and we used it. I don't think I would have spent the money otherwise.
I don't think it would create any real advantages for our airplane engines.
__________________
Darwin N. Barrie
Chandler AZ
www.JDair.com
RV-7 N717EE-Flying (Sold)
RV-7 N717AZ Flying, in paint
EMS Bell 407,
Eurocopter 350 A-Star Driver
|

12-23-2006, 02:21 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Santa Barbara, CA
Posts: 1,324
|
|
BSIAB
There is a great thread on the Avsig forum about oil and additives. Search BSIAB (BS In A Bottle)
John Clark
RV8 N18U
KSBA
|

12-24-2006, 12:28 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 5,685
|
|
Compromise
There's and old story about closing one eye to avoid total blindness while risking a look at something tempting. Maybe a one shot treatment just before the AirVenture Cup Race would yield some speed without plugging the lubrication ports. If my MTBO went down to 1900 hours but I picked up 6 MPH it would do it without a second thought. Not a good idea probably but the God of Speed demands sacrifices.
Bob Axsom
|

12-24-2006, 06:45 AM
|
 |
VAF Moderator / Line Boy
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Dayton, NV
Posts: 12,247
|
|
Ah....I'm beginning to understand why Bob liked "The World's Fastest Indian" so much...
Paul
__________________
Paul F. Dye
Editor at Large - KITPLANES Magazine
RV-8 - N188PD - "Valkyrie"
RV-6 (By Marriage) - N164MS - "Mikey"
RV-3B - N13PL - "Tsamsiyu"
A&P, EAA Tech Counselor/Flight Advisor
Dayton Valley Airpark (A34)
http://Ironflight.com
|

12-24-2006, 06:58 AM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 1,587
|
|
PTFE Additives in Oil
Microlon and its other names is a crude slurry of PTFE particles in oil. It is not in true suspension and it won't coat your moving parts as claimed and certainly will not last beyond the oil change. It is or was FAA approved because all that means is that it did not hurt the test engine. In a given engine it it possible to see gains from it. I have talked to folks who have said similar things to what is reported above. It is, as far as I know, the same thing as Slick50, the slickest thing about which is the marketing.
I cannot say the improvements did not happen. I will say, though, two things about Microlon's improvements in performance. 1. Do the math - what kind of HP gains would it take to produce the claimed improvement? I'm sceptical. If the BSFC were correct to begin with, would it still be believable after the claimed improvements? 2. An engine with certain characteristics, among them some severe internal friction problems, will possibly gain from the PTFE getting into the oil. There have been other additives with similar potential - Moly particles for instance, which are better than PTFE in high pressure testing.
Because it is a crude slurry and not a true suspension, it can and IMHO will clog something it should not. Use at your own risk.
For automobiles, there is a better way: TufOIl ( www.tufoil.com ) it has published testing and patents. It is a true suspension and does not settle out even afer years of sitting on the shelf.
Disclaimer - I tried selling TufOil to the transportation market in the late 80's. I have no connection with them now.
I have millions of miles of expeience with TufOil in cars and trucks and can recommend it. However, with airplanes it's a little different. TufOil is not formulated to be ashless and is not FAA certified. For that reason, even the inventor/manufacturer does not use it in his Bonanza. I did try it in a Moni with a KFM 2-stroke engine and the results were spectacular in climb. Since the 2-stroke is RPM inflexible, there was no noticeable change in cruise. I once helped a Pitts driver try it in his Lyc and he reported that his vertical performance was noticeably improved and his temperatures were lower. He tried it after watching my before and after tests in my Moni. Everyone at the airport that day had a similar reaction to watching the difference in my climbout.
I have a bottle of Micron for 2-strokes at home. All the PTFE is settled into a glob at the bottom and it will not re-disperse when I shake it. The reason for this is what makes TufOil different than all the others. PTFE is attracted to itself. Special, patented treatments are needed to keep it in suspension. One of these is particle size. TufOil particles are sized to easily pass through any normal filter. Microlon is not. Another is chemistry. TufOil is a true suspension and under magnification the beginnings of Brownian movement of the particles can be observed.
My advice to everyone is to be honest with yourself, analytical and safety aware. Use it at your own risk. I would not put Microlon in my lawnmower, let alone my airplane. We are all experimenters; do it if you choose to.
__________________
H. Evan's RV-7A N17HH 240+ hours
"We can lift ourselves out of ignorance, we can find ourselves as creatures of excellence and intelligence and skill. We can be free! We can learn to fly!" -J.L. Seagull
Paid $25.00 "dues" net of PayPal cost for 2015, 2016, 2017 and 2018 (December).
This airplane is for sale: see website. my website
|

01-16-2010, 02:02 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 5,685
|
|
I order Microlon for a test
There was a more recent thread on this but I couldn't find it in a brief search. In that thread I said I would buy it, test it and report my results. I ordered the Microlon from Aircraft Spruce for $119.95 and the shipping cost for Fedex Ground was $13.61. I use Aeroshell 15W-50 which aready contains additives. When I changed C/S props recently I saw evidence of buildup on the walls of the cavity in the crankshaft behind the prop before ordering the Microlon so there may be some conflict in the application but a promise to test is a promise to test. I received the order today (1-15-10). The product comes in a "kit" which consists of two cans and an instruction sheet. The large can is 32 oz. and it is labeled "CL-100 Engine Treatment." The small can is 4 oz. and it is labeled "CL-100 Fuel System Treatment." The situation here at home is such that it will be a while before I can run the test (probably in February) but I will give it the best checkout I can. Images of product and instructions below. Logistices of a fair test should not be a problem since I have to run the engine before the installation and after so the configuration will be the same. I currently have three wing configurations and I am working on another. The best (fastest) one is not installed but it will be before the test is run. The best speed I have established so far is 184.4 kts but I am working on two new mods that have not been tested and the new blended airfoil prop that has not been tested in the fastest configuration. In the current configuration the prop did produce the 3 kt gain expected. Since I have a Hartzell C/S prop, I expect the prop speed to remain the same but the pitch to increase and any improvement will be measured in aircraft top speed. If the manufacturer's claims are applicable to my airplane I should see something on the order of 192 kts. We will see.
Bob Axsom

Last edited by Bob Axsom : 01-16-2010 at 02:08 AM.
Reason: typos
|

01-16-2010, 09:57 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 371
|
|
The World's Fastest Indian
Great movie for us old folks.
|

01-16-2010, 10:27 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: BC
Posts: 1,674
|
|
Suspension
A local pilot here has had great results, more power and lower temps. BUT he followed the instructions exactly and apparently is very important because the particles are not in suspension. Namely, you must SHAKE WELL and apply to a hot engine then fly immediately at high cruise power (not circuits). I think his memorable flight was over an hour where the temps came down during the flight and RPM increased.
His report has made me curious. I too wonder about the material stopping in the filter and blocking oil galleries but his results were impressive
Bevan
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:28 AM.
|