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  #1  
Old 11-01-2015, 08:22 AM
yankee-flyer yankee-flyer is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Dayton, OH
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Default Prop strike/gearbox check? Questions

Had an incident yesterday where the prop tips touched the runway. Did NOT break props, did NOT stop engine. One tip has maybe 1/16" abraded off, the other 1/16 to 1/8". One a standard category engine this would not be a problem but I've been told that Rotax requires that the gearbox be torn down and inspected and that this requires the engine be pulled and sent to an authorized facility.

1) is this in fact the case?

2) Is there a facility closer to Ohio than Lockwood>

3) suggestions??

THANKS!!

Wayne 120241
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  #2  
Old 11-01-2015, 08:50 AM
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MartySantic MartySantic is offline
 
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Location: Davenport, IA
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Look in the 912ULS Line Maintenance Manual, Chapter 05-50-00 for the steps to follow.

http://www.rotax-owner.com/en/suppor...engine-manuals

You could call Leading Edge (LEAF) in Wisconsin. http://www.leadingedge-airfoils.com/contact.htm
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Last edited by MartySantic : 11-01-2015 at 08:53 AM.
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  #3  
Old 11-01-2015, 09:53 AM
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Walt Walt is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yankee-flyer View Post
Had an incident yesterday where the prop tips touched the runway. Did NOT break props, did NOT stop engine. One tip has maybe 1/16" abraded off, the other 1/16 to 1/8". One a standard category engine this would not be a problem but I've been told that Rotax requires that the gearbox be torn down and inspected and that this requires the engine be pulled and sent to an authorized facility.
Just to clarify, this would be considered a prop strike by Lycoming as well:

A propeller strike includes (ref. SB 533B):
Any incident, whether or not the engine is operating, where repair of the propeller is necessary.
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Last edited by Walt : 11-01-2015 at 09:56 AM.
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  #4  
Old 11-01-2015, 03:17 PM
Sink Sink is offline
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Hi Yankee,
As you have described this minor brush with the prop tips this wouldn't constitue a prop strike that would need a gearbox and crankshaft inspection. Just fix your prop.
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  #5  
Old 11-01-2015, 05:36 PM
jdiehl jdiehl is offline
 
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Location: Williamsport, Pa
Posts: 186
Default RV12 Prop Strike

I forwarded this thread to a friend of mine (at Lock Haven) that is familiar with Rotax engines. His comment is as follows:

The damage to the prop tips definitely requires inspection of the gearbox, but this does NOT require pulling the engine. Remove the spinner, then the prop, and then the dozen or so bolts attaching the gearbox to the crankcase (note: this unfortunately requires a special tool, but there is a shop in Dayton, Dreams Come True Aviation, that has one, and they can probably pull the gearbox for you). Takes maybe 15 minutes. Send the gearbox to LEAF, and if all checks good, remount the gearbox (using the correct Loctite sealant) replace the bolts (tightened to the specified torque), replace the prop and spinner, wait 24 hours for the Loctite to cure, and you're good to go.

H. Paul Shuch
Director of Maintenance
AvSport of Lock Haven
(A factory authorized Rotax Independent Repair Centre)
Call me of you have questions:
570-419-1229

Jim Diehl RV7A
Based at Lock Haven, Pa.
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  #6  
Old 11-01-2015, 08:04 PM
Sink Sink is offline
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I know Paul and he's a nice guy. I think he may have misspoke on this one.


Scuffing 1/16" to 1/8" off the blade tip with no slowing of the engine, no shattering of the prop, no stoppage of the engine doesn't require the initiation of the prop strike protocol. There would be nothing to check. You absolutely couldn't have twisted a crankshaft, bent the prop flange, tweaked the crankshaft end out of round or have damaged the gearbox under the circumstances you described in the first post. If all you did was scuff the tips 1/16" then none of that could have possibly happen with your composite prop. If you have a Sensenich prop and send it back to Sensenich they may be able to refurbish the prop. They would have to make that determination. Those blades can be shortened.
You can tear that gearbox down, but I'll bet money they find zero if all you did was scuff 1/16" off the tips.

If anyone thought there was enough force to damage a gearbox then there is enough force to cause further damage and the full prop strike inspection would need to be initiated.

So where would someone think any damage would occur?

If you had stopped the engine, splinterd or desentagraded the prop, slowed the engine significantly or had a Warp Drive prop involved in a destructive incident then it would require a prop flange runout, gearbox tear down and die penetrant test, bearing replacement, crankshaft runout and a crankshaft twist inspection.

Last edited by Sink : 11-01-2015 at 08:38 PM.
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  #7  
Old 11-01-2015, 08:51 PM
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rvbuilder2002 rvbuilder2002 is offline
 
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Free advice is worth what is paid for it....

Considering the consequences of a wrong decision for a diagnosis of an issue like this, is it worth second guessing what the Rotax documentation says?

The prop blades are pretty tough. If there was enough abrasion to remove 1/8 of material, I think there is a pretty good chance that some level of slowing took place.

A gear box inspection is not that big of deal... not doing one when you should have could be......
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  #8  
Old 11-01-2015, 09:26 PM
Sink Sink is offline
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If you believe there is enough evidence to inspect a gearbox then there is sufficient evidence to do a full and proper prop strike inspection and not do half a job.

Free advice has many values.
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  #9  
Old 11-02-2015, 09:15 AM
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rvbuilder2002 rvbuilder2002 is offline
 
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I was not attempting to provide a comprehensive list of a prop strike inspection, so I simple said gear box because that is the majority of it.


The Rotax documentation does not match Sinks opinion.

Rotax describes a prop strike as any contact that requires repairs be made to the propeller.

They do not prescribe a full dis-assembly of the engine for prop strike inspection.

Just inspection of accessories, the gear box, and the power take-off end of the crank shaft .
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Van's Aircraft Engineering Prototype Shop Manager
FAA/DAR
RV-6A (aka "Junkyard Special ")

Last edited by rvbuilder2002 : 11-02-2015 at 09:17 AM.
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  #10  
Old 11-02-2015, 11:18 AM
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f14av8r f14av8r is offline
 
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Default Resale

Hi Wayne,
Just a little off-topic but remember that how you handle the event will be scrutinized carefully by any potential buyer should you decide to sell your -12 in the future. When I was searching for my -4, I turned down two otherwise decent planes because they'd had prop strikes and the owner hadn't followed the manufacturers recommended procedures. Not saying you have to follow their recommendations but, at a minimum, I'd carefully document the path that you do follow to help with the resale process.

And, don't forget that the first thing many RV buyers do is search VAF for information about the seller and their airplane(s).

Good luck,
Randy
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