Dimpling/Riveting question

[tal454]

Hello,

I've searched the forums for this but couldn't find anything. Maybe my searching skills aren't too good. New guy questions here, but this is how we all learn right?

Is there any general rule of thumb for when to use a squeezer to dimple vs when to use a c-frame? And vice versa?

Same question applies to riveting, Any rule of thumb as to when to use the rivet gun over squeezing the rivet? I think blind rivets are pretty self explanatory.

Any advice is much appreciated.

-Tim

[bddalm]

Not really Tim. It is mostly personnel preference. I like to use a squeezer when ever possible for riveting and dimpling. There are places when a squeezer will not reach. I don't think one is better than the other. As you build you will have your favorite tools and technics. It's all about enjoying the process.

[rvbuilder2002]

Not a standard adopted by everyone, but my personal one is.....

-Dimple Countersinking-
If you care about the appearance (dimples on exterior skins, etc.) use a C-frame tool. Even on holes accessible by a squeezer.

If the dimples will be hidden (dimples in substructure flanges, etc.) then do what ever is most convenient/efficient; except for large dimples for screws I avoid using a hand squeezer (use a pneumatic squeezer if possible).

-Riveting-
1st choice - Use a squeezer when ever possible
2nd " - Back rivet (numerous different techniques)
3rd " - Conventional riveting with gun and bucking bar

[BillL]

Originally Posted by rvbuilder2002

Not a standard adopted by everyone, but my personal one is.....

-Dimple Countersinking-
If you care about the appearance (dimples on exterior skins, etc.) use a C-frame tool. Even on holes accessible by a squeezer.

If the dimples will be hidden (dimples in substructure flanges, etc.) then do what ever is most convenient/efficient; except for large dimples for screws I avoid using a hand squeezer (use a pneumatic squeezer if possible).

-Riveting-
1st choice - Use a squeezer when ever possible
2nd " - Back rivet (numerous different techniques)
3rd " - Conventional riveting with gun and bucking bar

I follow this priority list, but find that since most rivets can be reached with the squeezers, and some of the hard to reach ones need conventional bucking, that my bucking skills with offset and odd locations need improvement. So practice is required before setting a few hard to reach areas. Skins where there is room, no problem, it goes well, but rivet gun on one hand and bucking bar in the other trips me up. YMMV

[60av8tor]

Originally Posted by BillL

I follow this priority list, but find that since most rivets can be reached with the squeezers... but rivet gun on one hand and bucking bar in the other trips me up. YMMV

To me shooting and bucking solo has been a very valuable skill to develop. Do not want to start a hand vs pneumatic squeezer debate, but a pneumatic is certainly not a fire and forget tool. If I have very clear access, I certainly agree with that list. However, I am much more inclined than I was at the beginning of the build to pick up the gun and bar - certainly for those times when I'm war-gaming how to hit a rivet with a squeezer. Perhaps this would change if I was comparing to a hand squeezer. I used a friend's for a few rivets and it did appear a bit more manageable.

As far as dimpling - I only use other methods when I absolutely cannot use the c-frame.

[wirejock]

Welcome Tim. This site, these gifted builders will save you lots of time and errors.
Looks like you got good advise already. One thing to add.
Teach yourself to do most skills with either hand, especially driving and bucking rivets.
Using a rivet gun with your non dominant hand is a valuable skill.

[maniago]

Originally Posted by rvbuilder2002

-Riveting-
1st choice - Use a squeezer when ever possible
2nd " - Back rivet (numerous different techniques)
3rd " - Conventional riveting with gun and bucking bar

Agree 100% with this list; dimpling: squeezer, then Cframe, then pop rivet dimpler . The key is not all squeezers are created equal. The better the multiplication factor the better the squeezer. I bought Cleavelands Main Squeeze and never looked back; but its quite pricey. You get what you pay for wrt squeezers IMHO.

[rvbuilder2002]

Originally Posted by maniago

Agree 100% with this list; dimpling: squeezer, then Cframe, then pop rivet dimpler . The key is not all squeezers are created equal. The better the multiplication factor the better the squeezer. I bought Cleavelands Main Squeeze and never looked back; but its quite pricey. You get what you pay for wrt squeezers IMHO.

The other factor when using a squeezer for dimpling is what yoke you are using.
The shorter the reach, usually the better the result.
The reason is that quality dimpling requires a huge amount of squeeze force. Deeper reach yokes can have more flex in them than small yokes, which mis-aligns the face of the dies which results in a lower quality dimple. This is why when ever possible, my first choice for dimpling is a C-frame tool.

[Boomer506]

I am on my second RV and find that I hardly use a squeezer at all any more. I find it difficult to get the shop head flush before I begin the squeeze, and I still get the shop head to flop sometimes. You will get so good at working the gun and bucking bar that it is quicker, easier and better quality at least in my experience. Also, you will want to use your rivet cutter quite a bit to get half size length rivets when plans call out for a rivet that is a bit too long.

But one tool that I use a TON, is my imbedded bucking block. I use it mostly to dimple my large skins, but also to set rivets from time to time. Take a look at these pictures and you can get the idea. I have a female die on a swivel for the gun. Dimple all my skins with this thing.

[Raymo]

When setting a row of like size rivets, the squeezer will usually provide more consistency. That is, of course, after getting the appropriate adjustment made on the first one.

Once you have a few hundred or thousand rivets set by gun and bar, it becomes second nature and would be your favorite method, in most cases.

After you get the hang of bucking by hand, pick up a tungsten bucking bar and you will feel spoiled.