Help sizing up an auto pliot install/upgrade please.

AndyRV7 · #1 09-16-2014, 12:42 PM

I have a non-working TruTrak Pictorial Pilot in my new plane. I would like at a minimum to get the Pictorial Pilot working. TruTrak will take the controller back and "refresh" it (my words) for $500. This should mean a simple reinstallation in the current location, and hopefully a working, bank-only auto pilot now in my plane.

What I think I would rather do is upgrade to a Vizion dual-axis auto pilot instead. It is somewhat economical in terms of the upgrade cost through TruTrak. I would need to install a pitch servo (the bracket was installed by the builder), run the appropriate servo wires, including a refresh on the roll servo due to different connectors or similar, run static and pitot lines to the controller, and wire it into the panel.

I think I have my arms around the general process but I have no idea what this actually means in a real-world sense. I have zero time doing this type of installation.

Looking through all the installation manuals for all the gear in my panel, it looks like everything patches together with multi-pin plugs of various shapes and sizes. It is the wiring between these that scares me. And whatever other things I might have to run through the plane. Also, is this something that you would lay under the panel to do or would you have to pull the whole panel out? I have a slider canopy.

Can anyone help me get a better sense of what I am up against? I am either going to attempt this, or be so intimidated that I just get the Pictorial Pilot repaired and live with that. That is my second choice though. The other important items in the plane are a GRT Sport efis, and a Garmin G3X with no ADAHRS. I use the G3X as a GPS moving map only.

Thanks!! Andy

pierre smith · #2 09-16-2014, 01:41 PM

Andy, I just upgraded from an ADI II to the Vizion, mainly for IFR approaches, but the altitude preselect and VS preselect make this an incredible unit. I also had to buy a trim-sensing servo, so you might research that. I sold my old servos and everything on here and also found the servos I needed here.

Since it does not have an artificial horizon like the ADI did, I found a new Gemini PFD on here with both altitude, AS and AH and connected to its own battery, I can fly if I lose my alternator.

Best,

BillFear · #3 09-16-2014, 01:42 PM

We have a pictoral pilot also (ours works) and I would highly recommend the upgrade to the vizion or the new version of the Gemini with autopilot that is coming soon. I love the standalone nature of the TT products.

When I work on mine, I always work thru the front of the panel (by taking the efis out) this gives me the room to get behind the panel to install things and do the wiring. Hard to do anything lying on your back under that panel.

If you have to run new wires to the pitch servo, they will need to go under the seats and through or around the spar. Kind of a pain, but nothing that hard about it.

Call Steinair to get the pins and crimper you will need to build your connectors. Just like anything, simple when you have the right tools. If fact, you will like the mil-spec pins so much, you will use them for all types of small wiring jobs.

Good luck!

AndyRV7 · #4 09-16-2014, 02:26 PM

Glad you mentioned the servo Pierre. It has been a pain trying to left teh tail on takeoff because I have so much opposite trim in from the landing. The pitch sensing servo would kill a second bird with the same stone I presume!?

Thanks for the efis tip Bill. I should have access to both ends of the panel that way.

I think the think I am most worried about is having to get the AP connected to the efis and moving map as flight plan sources. It seems like i will have to find that/those wires coming from those units now to the Pictorial Pilot and add them to the new plugs. But I imagine that will require replacing them if I need longer runs. This is all in my minds eye anyway. I think I might have to commit to the upgrade, pull the PP, and have the new unit in hand just to get a better picture of what I need to do.

Thanks for the info. Andy

Isaac · #5 09-16-2014, 02:30 PM

You didn?t mention which RV you are considering this for. I have TruTrak AP DigiFlight II installed in an RV6 and was considering upgrading to the Vizion 385 but have looked at what would be required to convert to the GRT autopilot because I have GRT Sport HS displays.

Since you want to have vertical modes capability, you will need to install an elevator servo. The servo mounting bracket is the same for the TruTrak and GRT servo and is installed in the same location behind the baggage compartment bulkhead. Some drilling out of existing rivets and riveting will be necessary and the elevator bell crank will need a hole drilled in it for an AN3 bolt hole for the pushrod that connects the elevator servo to the elevator bell crank. Drilling the hole for connecting the pushrod would probably be easier done with the bell crank removed. Not a big deal as you will probably have the push tube to the elevator disconnected to provide access for installing the mounting bracket anyway.

Regardless of which autopilot you upgrade to, installing wiring from behind the instrument panel through the wing spar and on back to the elevator servo will be necessary for power and control. The TruTrak and GRT autopilot pitch and roll servo?s are similar in that they are both stepper motor designs and utilize the same mounting brackets, but the GRT autopilot servo?s require fewer wires as they are controlled via RS-232 digital bus. From a retrofit basis, fewer wires would obviously be easier to manage. The GRT Sport HS and SX versions support lateral and vertical autopilot modes and since you already have a GRT Sport installed in the aircraft, you could eliminate the separate autopilot controller that must be connected to power/gnd, the servo?s and the pitot static plumbing . The GRT Sport autopilot vertical modes are a software upgrade that you have to purchase and if you go the GRT autopilot route you will need to purchase a new roll servo also.

Operationally I think the TruTrak or the GRT would be similar but the GRT is more integrated with nav sources, pitot/static etc. Some would argue that having the AP independent of the EFIS is better because it provides a higher level of redundancy and backup because if one fails you still have the other and vice versa.

AndyRV7 · #6 09-16-2014, 02:55 PM

I really didn't want to be married to the GRT. There are things I don't like about my panel but didn't want to confuse the thread with that part of the problem. If I can get through an AP upgrade, I might like to make some changes to the panel too at some point.

I bought a beautiful RV-7 after about 4 years of trying.

AndyRV7 · #7 09-16-2014, 02:57 PM

I guess I should have asked if anyone has any pics of these component installs from their build. That would be great. Thanks!! Andy

BillFear · #8 09-16-2014, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyRV7

Glad you mentioned the servo Pierre. It has been a pain trying to left teh tail on takeoff because I have so much opposite trim in from the landing. The pitch sensing servo would kill a second bird with the same stone I presume!?

Thanks for the efis tip Bill. I should have access to both ends of the panel that way.

I think the think I am most worried about is having to get the AP connected to the efis and moving map as flight plan sources. It seems like i will have to find that/those wires coming from those units now to the Pictorial Pilot and add them to the new plugs. But I imagine that will require replacing them if I need longer runs. This is all in my minds eye anyway. I think I might have to commit to the upgrade, pull the PP, and have the new unit in hand just to get a better picture of what I need to do.

Thanks for the info. Andy

In my case it was just one wire from the GRT to the autopilot as it comes in serially. All of the other nav devices (SL30, IFR GPS and VFR 696 are wired into the GRT unit. you may want to connect with ARINC to the newer autopilot, in which case you will need two wires from the GRT. Simple.

http://www.grtavionics.com/Horizon%20-300XL.pdf

BobTurner · #9 09-16-2014, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndyRV7

Glad you mentioned the servo Pierre. It has been a pain trying to left teh tail on takeoff because I have so much opposite trim in from the landing. The pitch sensing servo would kill a second bird with the same stone I presume!?

Thanks for the info. Andy

Ah, no. The 'auto-trim, pitch sensing' servos only adjust the trim automatically when the autopilot is engaged. Most of the autopilots will not let you takeoff with the servos engaged, so it will not trim for you on the takeoff roll.

For your problem I would suggest an old fashioned pre takeoff check list.

pa38112 · #10 09-16-2014, 04:18 PM

I upgraded from a Digitrack to the 380. I had to install the pitch bracket, and I ran all new wires. It took me three nights. One of those was moving other instruments around in the panel because the 380 was longer and would not fit where the old unit was.
Not a bad job as long as you can slip inter your panel.