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03-01-2014, 11:31 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Louisville, Ga
Posts: 7,840
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Certified as well
Both of my certified Air Tractors have the same rod end bearing hinge as Van's and they have locking nuts from the factory.
Best,
__________________
Pierre Smith
RV-10, 510 TT
RV6A (Sojourner) 180 HP, Catto 3 Bl (502Hrs), gone...and already missed
Air Tractor AT 502B PT 6-15 Sold
Air Tractor 402 PT-6-20 Sold
EAA Flight Advisor/CFI/Tech Counselor
Louisville, Ga
It's never skill or craftsmanship that completes airplanes, it's the will to do so,
Patrick Kenny, EAA 275132
Dues gladly paid!
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03-01-2014, 12:08 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: 57AZ - NW Tucson area
Posts: 10,011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rvbuilder2002
.......
My main point is "do not become complacent and assume that just because an AN365 nut has been replaced and is now safetied with a cotter pin, that it is automatically safer".
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If you really, really want "belts and braces" then you can use a self-locking castle nut...
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalo...es/ms17825.php

__________________
Gil Alexander
EAA Technical Counselor, Airframe Mechanic
Half completed RV-10 QB purchased
RV-6A N61GX - finally flying
Grumman Tiger N12GA - flying
La Cholla Airpark (57AZ) Tucson AZ
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03-01-2014, 03:11 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Dallas/Ft Worth, TX
Posts: 5,687
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There have been numerous documented accidents due to a cotter pin that was left out but I can't recall every hearing of a "good" self locking nut departing for no reason.
__________________
Walt Aronow, DFW, TX (52F)
EXP Aircraft Services LLC
Specializing in RV Condition Inspections, Maintenance, Avionics Upgrades
Dynamic Prop Balancing, Pitot-Static Altmeter/Transponder Certification
FAA Certified Repair Station, AP/IA/FCC GROL, EAA Technical Counselor
Authorized Garmin G3X Dealer/Installer
RV7A built 2004, 1700+ hrs, New Titan IO-370, Bendix Mags
Website: ExpAircraft.com, Email: walt@expaircraft.com, Cell: 972-746-5154
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03-01-2014, 03:48 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 2,295
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Walt
There have been numerous documented accidents due to a cotter pin that was left out but I can't recall every hearing of a "good" self locking nut departing for no reason.
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My thoughts exactly. There is a trade-off. The only way that nut is going to back out is if the bearings in the rod end-bearing fail or something else causes the rod-end bearing to lock up, then rotation could be applied to the nut. But, the rod-end bearings are supposed to be sandwiched between the adjacent tabs (read: tight). If the bearing fails it should be very, very obvious.
But I too have seen many missing lock nuts. Once even on a rental I was going to fly as a newly-minted pilot. It was a 172 and during my walk-around I noticed that there were no cotter pins on any of the castle nuts holding the right aileron on. Turns out the aileron had been pulled so that part of the wing could be inspected -- two weeks prior. Countless students flew that airplane like that.
__________________
"What kind of man would live where there is no daring? I don't believe in taking foolish chances but nothing can be accomplished without taking any chance at all." - Charles A. Lindbergh
Jamie | RV-7A First Flight: 7/27/2007 (Sold)
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03-01-2014, 08:55 PM
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Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: DFW Area, TX
Posts: 229
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I understand about a cotter pinned nut on a rotating bolt, but why do we use a cotter pin on the bolts that hold the engine mount on?
Just wondering if its because of the tensile load instead of the shear load?
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Bob B
RV-7A Sold
RV-4 Sold
DFW TX
Dues Paid
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03-01-2014, 11:01 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: BC
Posts: 1,674
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Taildrgr
I understand about a cotter pinned nut on a rotating bolt, but why do we use a cotter pin on the bolts that hold the engine mount on?
Just wondering if its because of the tensile load instead of the shear load?
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Probably because fiber nuts are not to be used FWF (temp limits).
Bevan
__________________
RV7A Flying since 2015
O-360-A1F6 (parallel valve) 180HP
Dual P-mags
Precision F.I. with AP purge valve
Vinyl Wrapped Exterior
Grand Rapids EFIS
Located in western Canada
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03-02-2014, 01:10 AM
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Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: US
Posts: 2,251
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bevan
Probably because fiber nuts are not to be used FWF (temp limits).
Bevan
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Somebody needs to notify Lycoming, then, because my brand new IO-360 from the factory came with (gasp) fiber locknuts on it (e.g., on the Adel clamps holding the fuel injection lines).
I've heard this before about fiber locknuts FWF, and granted there are places in the engine compartment where they probably shouldn't be used (and I used a lot of all-metal locknuts when installing the systems on the engine), but even the fuel injection servo uses fiber locknuts in one or two places, IIRC.
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03-02-2014, 03:41 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Defiance, MO
Posts: 1,674
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Taildrgr
I understand about a cotter pinned nut on a rotating bolt, but why do we use a cotter pin on the bolts that hold the engine mount on?
Just wondering if its because of the tensile load instead of the shear load?
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Engine mounts are also a high vibration joint with rubber in the clamp-up stack. Both vibration and movement can work a nut off a bolt unless mechanically restricted with a cotter pin.
__________________
Philip
RV-6A - 14+ years, 950+ hours
Based at 1H0 (Creve Coeur)
Paid dues yearly since 2007
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03-02-2014, 04:28 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: SC & CA
Posts: 907
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Heck, on my fixed pitched prop, even Sensenich uses self-locking nuts.  I was surprised to see this, but that's what their documentation shows.
__________________
Tom Valenzia
RV8 (Sold)
RV12 Jabiru 2200 Powered (Sold)
Dues contributor since 2007
Learn from the mistakes of others. You won't live long enough to make all of them yourself...Anonymous
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03-02-2014, 06:44 AM
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Super Moderator
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Join Date: May 2005
Location: Locust Grove, GA
Posts: 2,627
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Cotter pins
I just inspected an RV-10 yesterday with 100 hours on it and NO cotter pins in any of the 4 engine Lord mount bolts.
If it calls for them, they have to be used.
Vic
__________________
 Vic Syracuse
Built RV-4, RV-6, 2-RV-10's, RV-7A, RV-8, Prescott Pusher, Kitfox Model II, Kitfox Speedster, Kitfox 7 Super Sport, Just Superstol, DAR, A&P/IA, EAA Tech Counselor/Flight Advisor, CFII-ASMEL/ASES
Kitplanes "Unairworthy" monthly feature
EAA Sport Aviation "Checkpoints" column
EAA Homebuilt Council Chair/member EAA BOD
Author "Pre-Buy Guide for Amateur-Built Aircraft"
www.Baselegaviation.com
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