Hangar floor pics

[DragonflyAero]

I love the hangar floor pics posted today! I have been considering options and like this. Does this treatment eliminate the cement dust as a sealant would? What are people's experience with this "scrubber" treatment?

[ed. Picture in question.....



dr]

[Capflyer]

Using sealer on cement floors is becoming old school. The Jan/San industry is moving to Diamond pads. Different manufacturers call them different things but think of it like polishing aluminum. Start with heavier grits pads and work your way down. If you go into most Aviation Depots and some of the other big box stores you'll see glossy concrete floors done with this system and no sealer or finish on them. The problem with sealers and floor finishes used on concrete, terazzo (not that finsih should ever be put on terazzo but I see it all the time), VCT or older asbestos flooring is that they wear off and also require a lot more maintenance. Rental places that have any type of floor equipement are good places to start if you want to go this route. Not sure if they will carry the Diamond pads though. For those you may need to hit up a janitorial supply house that sells over the counter. Just be aware these pads are expensive.

In regards to DR's shiny new floors, they look really good. Keep them swept and mop occasionally using a neutral floor cleaner and they will continue to look great. Oh, and the "rabbit or turtle" buttons, fairly standard on this type of equipement. Many of the English speaking custodians I sell to are not the most literate or equpment carring sort so pictures work best.

[Clayton]

In my particular case, I am fortunate in the fact that my brother is in the Jan/San business as a manufactures rep. He put me on to the very thing that Mike (CapFlyer) mentioned - that being the use of Diamond pads and a stone sealer. These pads, in combination with a low speed machine like the one Doug has "Taken a Shine" to, and a high speed buffer/burnisher will make concrete look almost as good as granite. This is all done wet, so there is no dust to deal with.

The level of shine is just a matter of how much time and energy you are willing to put into the job - much like polishing aluminum. Unlike aluminum, the sealer will lock in the shine, and an occasional burnishing will bring back the full shine.

My hangar floor is about 30 years old and had everything from oil and acid spills to paint and upholstery glue on it. Consequently, after lots of clean up I still ended up with a number of "Character" marks in a very shiny floor. Which is fine with me and the look I am actually after.

The next step for an established floor is actual grinding, which is done dry, very messy, and extremely expensive. You would get the same shine, but get rid of most all of the character marks from past hangar spills.

If you have a new floor, or for those who will be pouring a new slab in the future, I would certainly suggest the polished floor with stone sealer over the epoxy paint. It is easier to clean, much less slippery when wet, and in my opinion looks better.

It looks like CapFlyer is in the business, and I am sure he could enlighten you even more. As I understand the Jan/San business from my brother, it is regional in nature, where the manufactures have representatives covering specific territories. If you are in CapFlyer's area, I will bet he can hook you up. If you have an interest in the equipment DR was using, you can contact Viper directly and Laura said she would line up VAF readers with the appropriate rep for their particular location.

Might be something that a group of hangar owners would go in on - especially when you look at the cost of renting the equipment.

[gtmule]

Anybody know what it'd take (time, money, etc) to take a rough looking epoxy floor to something like this? Call it 40'x80'.

[Cap'nCrunch]

I'm building a new hanger and would like to get an estimate on doing this to my floor. Does anyone know who I should contact in southeast Wisc.

[rleffler]

Originally Posted by gtmule

Anybody know what it'd take (time, money, etc) to take a rough looking epoxy floor to something like this? Call it 40'x80'.

I'm curious as to the cost as well. Depending on the expense, I'm may do the same in my hangar.

thanks,

bob

[BillL]

Very nice looking, but don't the big box stores use a top finish material and finishing technique to get the flatness and surface finish?

Without a sealant of some kind isn't concrete still porous? Won't moisture still come up from below, and oil, antifreeze and other spills on a well used garage area still seep into and stain the concrete? Isn't it still subject to corrosion from salt from winters drippings? Will it stop radon gas from the basement?

Update me please, these are long held beliefs based on real issues found over the decades. I am all for going to Sunbelt Rentals and renting a floor grinder, but if I have the same old concrete won't it have the same old problems without a sealant or coating?

[DragonflyAero]

Thanks for all this great information. Is this something a janitorial service might be hired for in lieu of renting the equipment and doing it myself?

[MS19087]

This assumes a 30 x 40 hangar polished to 3000 grit. Did mine last year - your price may vary depending on location, etc.

[Captain Avgas]

Originally Posted by BillL

Very nice looking, but don't the big box stores use a top finish material and finishing technique to get the flatness and surface finish?

Without a sealant of some kind isn't concrete still porous? Won't moisture still come up from below, and oil, antifreeze and other spills on a well used garage area still seep into and stain the concrete? Isn't it still subject to corrosion from salt from winters drippings? Will it stop radon gas from the basement?

Update me please, these are long held beliefs based on real issues found over the decades. I am all for going to Sunbelt Rentals and renting a floor grinder, but if I have the same old concrete won't it have the same old problems without a sealant or coating?

Bill, concrete grinding is a technical science. To get a really high quality job requires expertise at three separate stages. Firstly at the concrete mix stage, secondly at the concrete pour stage, and thirdly at the concrete grind stage.

Let me give you an example. Normal slab concrete is about 20 MPa strength. Concrete to be fully ground is normally specified at 32 MPa. The extra strength prevents the aggregate (the "stones") from dislodging from the concrete during the grinding. And that's just one requirement of many to get a top job.

Also people talk about "concrete grinding" but there are many types of concrete grinding. Typically most concrete grinding is just a half grind to expose the aggregate and then a clear coat is used over that. This is the most common "concrete grinding" because it requires less grinding and is therefore much cheaper. However this approach is not optimum because all clear coats (even expensive two-pack polyurethanes) eventually scuff when you walk on them and break down when subjected to UV so they require expensive periodic maintenance.

The best finish is a full grind so that you get the high gloss "granite" look without a clear top coat. It's very hard and resistant to wear. But it is more expensive. Typically with a full grind a sealer is still used to close the pores in the concrete.

There's a LOT of tricks to concrete grinding and it is best done by professionals if a high quality surface is required. I saw a concrete grind job recently where the workers had walked into the concrete slab by accident just after the pour. This pushed all the aggregate down into the mix. The concreters simply trowelled the footprints smooth but the aggregate was gone from the mix surface. It all looked good until it was ground and then you could clearly see the footprints where there was no aggregate. It then looked totally ridiculous.

As I said, there's a lot of tricks in concrete grinding. I don't profess to know a huge amount about it, but I know enough to know that a little bit of knowledge can be dangerous.