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  #91  
Old 11-27-2013, 09:35 AM
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Mike S Mike S is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by N395V View Post
Having said that I would like to put my Drs. hat on for a moment and make a SUGGESTION to my portly (and select skinny) friends.
Right on Milt--------folks a voice of reason from a person with the training, knowledge and many years of experience. You did catch the part about him being a Dr.............


Milts post is well worth re-reading a time or two.
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  #92  
Old 11-27-2013, 09:45 AM
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Thanks for the post Milt. Good to hear from you as always! Good advice!

For those that don't know Milt, he is a cardiologist and he knows his stuff!
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  #93  
Old 11-28-2013, 06:07 PM
NASA515 NASA515 is offline
 
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My father was skinny as a rail, and lived to 91.5. He spent decades berating his brother, my uncle, who was morbidly obese, about his weight and insisting he curb his appetite. His brother died this year at 95, having handily out-lived my dad - AND - surpassing him on the happiness and enjoyment of life scale by many orders of magnitude. Only a few weeks before his death, he spent 30 minutes on the phone with me regaling me with all the latest jokes he had heard. My dad died a lonely and unhappy man - all of his own choosing.

BUT - he was skinny!

The trouble with these measurements are numerous - many political, as pointed out by others.

Some of the problems have to do with the uncertain world of "correlations." We have people today who crunch enough numbers through enough high speed computers to prove just about anything.

For me to get back to Milt's "ideal weight" would require not that I go back to 8th grade - but more like 6th or 7th grade. Being a dumb engineer, I have kept records going back to my childhood and that's what it would take! Besides the difficulty of shedding all those pounds, (enjoyably added over many years, I might add), when I arrived there, I would look like a concentration camp survivor or someone fighting cancer.

One of the problems with BMI has to do with that other variable - HEIGHT. I am getting shorter! And so are most people (who lose an average 0.4 inches/decade after 40.) So, it's a double whammy - changing both the numerator and the denominator, both in the wrong directions - gaining weight AND losing height. Yikes!

Actually, I calculated my BMI using my current weight AND my old height - which would drop me out of the "bad" range. So, I guess, I need to also get taller. I had a hip replacement two years ago - I should have asked the doc to put those two inches back on me.....

A google search about height loss, shows that it too, causes reduction in life expectancy and all sorts of bad things. Geez, something else to worry about, and yet another correlation for the FAA's horde's of AMEs to zero in on.

In a study released this year, they found the following:

" researchers analyzed data collected from nearly 18,000 adults, beginning when they were 45 years old.

John Strauss, at the University of Southern California, said in a university news release, that he and his colleagues found that the overall age-related height loss was 1.3 inches among men and 1.5 inches among women. However, adults in cities had much less height loss than those in rural areas.

People who completed primary school also lost less height compared to those who were illiterate, 0.35 inches less in men and 0.23 inches less in women. In addition, men who completed high school lost 0.39 inches less than those who were illiterate."


So, there you can see what computers and correlations can do for you. It has to do with whether you can read or live in the city!


Bob Bogash - Light Sport Driver
RV-12
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Last edited by N395V : 11-29-2013 at 07:13 AM. Reason: Removed political content
  #94  
Old 11-29-2013, 01:52 AM
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ifixf15 ifixf15 is offline
 
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Default Careful Bob

Now Bob, you really shouldn't question your betters like that. You know they are only looking out for your well being. Now sit down and get your immunization, take your blood pressure pills, and they will let you know when recess starts so you can go out and play.

Tom
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  #95  
Old 11-29-2013, 02:42 AM
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ifixf15 ifixf15 is offline
 
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Default And now for something completely off topic

Quote:
Originally Posted by N395V View Post
I think the FAA, government, employer or any entity has no business or right to compel an individual to do anything healthwise unless it definitively has been proven that not doing so puts the general public at risk (ie vaccinations)
Milt, I must admit that I find the above quote confusing and possibly very disturbing. It appears that you don't think the govt should compel healthwise except for the times when you think the govt should compel healthwise. Is that correct, or did I misunderstand your statement?

Tom
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Last edited by ifixf15 : 11-29-2013 at 02:48 AM.
  #96  
Old 11-29-2013, 06:56 AM
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N395V N395V is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ifixf15 View Post
Milt, I must admit that I find the above quote confusing and possibly very disturbing. It appears that you don't think the govt should compel healthwise except for the times when you think the govt should compel healthwise. Is that correct, or did I misunderstand your statement?

Tom
You understood perfectly well.

The FAA (government) has no business telling pilots they need to have a sleep apnea evaluation WITHOUT good reason such as public safety.

They have not documented or proven sleep apnea is a safety issue putting the general public at risk. Therefore if someone at risk for sleep apnea wishes to ignore it the FAA has no business demanding the evaluation.

A case where government, IMHO, should be involved is vaccinations against serious epidemic causing contagious disease such as smallpox and polio or DPT. In this case public safety is clearly enhanced by government requirements.

Where you not compelled by the Air Force (government) to receive a series of innoculations or boosters in basic training? Or did you find that requirement disturbing and confusing ? Or did you just:
Quote:
Now sit down and get your immunization
as you suggested Bob should do?

You and Bob, however, seemed to have missed the main thrusts of my post so let me clarify.

1. It is my opinion the proposed FAA requirements are unnecessary, unwarranted, and an abuse of power.

2. The balance of my post was free medical advice to those who may be at risk for sleep apnea. You are not compelled to follow it you may heed the advice and use the formula if you wish, you are free to ignore it or scoff at it as you have.

Clearly the two of you know the subject matter better than I . I would expect a USAF MSGT E8 one of my
Quote:
betters
, as you above mentioned, to have a greater knowledge base than mine as I was only a SGT E5 when discharged from the Marine Corps. But then again it only took me 4 years to wise up not 30.

And I have once again re-learned that no good deed goes unpunished.
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Last edited by N395V : 11-29-2013 at 07:21 AM.
  #97  
Old 11-29-2013, 07:15 AM
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Milt,
How do you define public safety? Is it when a threat may affect thousands of humans? How about if it would only affect 100?

What about only 2? (If OSA is a true risk, it may only affect 1 or 2 people's lives directly...).

Deciding when the government "should" be involved is a complex issue, full of debatable positions.
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  #98  
Old 11-29-2013, 07:28 AM
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N395V N395V is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arlen View Post
Milt,
How do you define public safety? Is it when a threat may affect thousands of humans? How about if it would only affect 100?

What about only 2? (If OSA is a true risk, it may only affect 1 or 2 people's lives directly...).

Deciding when the government "should" be involved is a complex issue, full of debatable positions.

Brian I hope you do not mind my borrowing your photo




See my post above and re-read my original post. You will see I am not a proponent of sleep apnea evals for pilots based on the FAA criteria.

It was FREE medical advice to those who may have sleep apnea nothing more.

I don't give a rats A$$ if you use it or not.

How" I" define public safety is irrelevant to RVs and pilots and not relevant to this forum.
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Last edited by N395V : 11-29-2013 at 07:40 AM.
  #99  
Old 11-29-2013, 07:35 AM
60av8tor 60av8tor is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ifixf15 View Post
Milt, I must admit that I find the above quote confusing and possibly very disturbing. It appears that you don't think the govt should compel healthwise except for the times when you think the govt should compel healthwise. Is that correct, or did I misunderstand your statement?

Tom
I think it is pretty clear, if I am not mis-interpreting his post, and I feel the same way. Intervention to protect people from themselves I disagree with, but regulations for the common good are necessary - for instance, why is there a policy limiting OTR truck driver hours in a day? Drivers should be able to drive 20 hours/day, the industry would safely self-regulate... Now I'm not a trucker, and I'm not arguing the specifics of the policy, just using this as an example of what Milt is saying.

I am not arguing for this FAA action; I think it is absurd. But I do find it a little disturbing that some look at personal health and obesity so casually. Using an example of one morbidly obese, fat, but happy individual outliving a skinny, but miserable person, as an implication that obesity doesn't matter really amazes me. It does matter - it matters a lot. Look at our nation as a whole - especially our kids. The long-term health implications of an unhealthy life-style are amazing. All surface discussion aside, I do not think there are any overweight individuals that wouldn't agree to having a healthy weight/fitness level if someone could snap their fingers and give it to them. Making major life changes, and, more importantly maintaining them, is difficult, but the rewards for doing so can and will change your life.
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Last edited by 60av8tor : 11-29-2013 at 07:39 AM.
  #100  
Old 11-29-2013, 07:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by N395V View Post

It was FREE medical advice to those who may have sleep apnea nothing more.

I don't give a rats A$$ if you use it or not.

How" I" define public safety is irrelevant to RVs and pilots and not relevant to this forum.
Sorry to strike a nerve, Milt.
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