Van's Air Force
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Extra tank in RV-12?
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vernhendershott
Well Known Member
That would be San Francisco to Honolulu which is about 2400 statue miles. Head winds most of the time.
Best regards,
Vern
JerryG150
Well Known Member
here's an idea
I've been thinking about extra gas tanks for the RV-12 for a quite a while ... here's a product I came across at Sun 'n Fun in 2008.
Turtlepac ... click here. (Be sure to page down and see all the products)
I've been thinking about extra gas tanks for the RV-12 for a quite a while ... here's a product I came across at Sun 'n Fun in 2008.
Turtlepac ... click here. (Be sure to page down and see all the products)
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engineerofsorts
Well Known Member
You may need a bigger tank
You could try CarolAnn and Carol's route around the world in a Mooney:
http://www.alsworldflight.com/
The home stretch from Cape Verde to Miami was a bit long too.
You could try CarolAnn and Carol's route around the world in a Mooney:
http://www.alsworldflight.com/
The home stretch from Cape Verde to Miami was a bit long too.
Jim "Sierra X-ray"
I'm New Here
re-engineer the fuel tank
I was wondering if you could re-engineer the fuel tank all together to increase it's capacity. The way it looks now you should be able to at lest doubly it to take up all of the back baggage area and in this way you would utilize the existing pluming and mounts.
Could something like this be done?? I would appreciate any comments from the forum.
By the way a light sport aircraft from South Africa did do a around the world trip on 09 with a Rotax 912 S http://www.airplanefactory.co.za/world/default.asp
I was wondering if you could re-engineer the fuel tank all together to increase it's capacity. The way it looks now you should be able to at lest doubly it to take up all of the back baggage area and in this way you would utilize the existing pluming and mounts.
Could something like this be done?? I would appreciate any comments from the forum.
By the way a light sport aircraft from South Africa did do a around the world trip on 09 with a Rotax 912 S http://www.airplanefactory.co.za/world/default.asp
extra fuel
Years ago I knew a guy who flew his Luscombe up to Alaska every summer. He liked the direct route (The Trench) so he carried extra fuel in the cabin. He strapped a pony keg into the right seat and had an old-fashioned bicycle pump mounted behind the right-side instrument panel so he could push the plunger a few times to move fuel to the main tank.
Hey, this would get you 8 gallons with minimal mods.
Jim
RV6A 0360/CS flying 550 hours
RV12 1/2 done, 7/8 to go
Years ago I knew a guy who flew his Luscombe up to Alaska every summer. He liked the direct route (The Trench) so he carried extra fuel in the cabin. He strapped a pony keg into the right seat and had an old-fashioned bicycle pump mounted behind the right-side instrument panel so he could push the plunger a few times to move fuel to the main tank.
Hey, this would get you 8 gallons with minimal mods.
Jim
RV6A 0360/CS flying 550 hours
RV12 1/2 done, 7/8 to go
vernhendershott
Well Known Member
Hi Jim,
If you increase the fuel tank to 40 gallons and fill it with a normal 180 pound pilot you will be 1.5 inches behind the rear CG limit at takeoff and just a little forward of the forward CG limit when landing with 2 gallons of fuel.
I think any large quantity of extra fuel will need to be in the right seat area due to CG issues.
Best regards,
Vern
vernhendershott
Well Known Member
Yes you have it right, but the simple solution is to have a tie-down kit in the baggage compartment would solve the problem, also being just a little forward of the CG limits is not as much of a problem as being down to two gallons of fuel when thinking about landing.
Best regards,
Vern
My initial idea was to make the passenger seat removable and replace it with an additional 20 gal. tank for long solo flights, and this seems doable. But now let me take it a step further. My calculations show that if I leave the passenger seat in place and take my wife along, we could stow an additional 20 gallons of fuel and still be within gross weight limits with 25 pounds to spare. SO with that in mind, I'm wondering if a custom 40 gal. tank could be designed to fit snug behind the seats so as to not violate CG limits. If this is possible, maybe that custom tank could be a molded material that is not prone to leakage, as seems to be a concern on the "fuel tank woes" thread. More thoughts on this?
Fuel In The Wings
A good friend of mine, who has enjoyed many pleasant hours in a TR-2, which is a late model Grumman American Yankee, has a marvelous idea. He claims that the RV-12 wing is the perfect candidate for fuel cylinders, similar to the TR-2, which could occupy the nice voids that the wing rib lightening holes provide. It would likely be very conceivable to carry up to 20 gal. in each of these wings, with just a little engineering. Any volunteers?? Yes, wing removal becomes more of a project, but surveys have indicated that the majority of us RV-12 guys don't plan of doing that on a daily basis.
Any Comments??
Tom
A good friend of mine, who has enjoyed many pleasant hours in a TR-2, which is a late model Grumman American Yankee, has a marvelous idea. He claims that the RV-12 wing is the perfect candidate for fuel cylinders, similar to the TR-2, which could occupy the nice voids that the wing rib lightening holes provide. It would likely be very conceivable to carry up to 20 gal. in each of these wings, with just a little engineering. Any volunteers?? Yes, wing removal becomes more of a project, but surveys have indicated that the majority of us RV-12 guys don't plan of doing that on a daily basis.
Any Comments??
Tom
vernhendershott
Well Known Member
The weight and balance would be similar in that you would be behind the CG rear limit with the 40 gallons in the tank, you would also have to spend most of the 25 pounds to make the extra 20 gallons of tank. Van's has limited the current baggage area to 50 pounds and the extra 20 gallons of fuel and the extra tank would weigh about 140 pounds so there would be a structural issue that would have to be checked to see if the structure could accept the weight in the baggage area.
The need to have the extra fuel would seem to be to go somewhere and if you take your wife and all the fuel you would have no room for any baggage and this could be a little inconvenient.
Best regards,
Vern
But on amateur-built aircraft, Van is not listed as the builder!
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Greg Arehart
Well Known Member
JerryG,
Seems your link to turtlepac no longer works. I'm wondering if you got any prices from them? Their website doesn't list any prices for the aviation bladders.
thanks,
greg
Seems your link to turtlepac no longer works. I'm wondering if you got any prices from them? Their website doesn't list any prices for the aviation bladders.
thanks,
greg
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If that is the longest leg and there are headwinds you should go the other direction
Extended fuel
Try this for turtle pac @ http://www.turtlepac.com/products/bush-plane-long-range-fuel-bladder.html
Try this for turtle pac @ http://www.turtlepac.com/products/bush-plane-long-range-fuel-bladder.html
ErichKeane
Well Known Member
If that is the longest leg and there are headwinds you should go the other direction
There are headwinds in both directions
joedallas
Well Known Member
Fuel in the wings
I think the best answer is to get vans to add an option of fuel tanks in the wings. This will put less stress on the wings and get the fuel out of the cabin.
It will also Keep the LSA Rating.
If van doesn?t do this I will and Go Experimental or Build two sets of wings.
Joe Dallas
I think the best answer is to get vans to add an option of fuel tanks in the wings. This will put less stress on the wings and get the fuel out of the cabin.
It will also Keep the LSA Rating.
If van doesn?t do this I will and Go Experimental or Build two sets of wings.
Joe Dallas
high negative-G loads
The RV-12 wings are probably strong enough to carry fuel internally while flying. If the wing tanks are full during a hard landing, the inertia of falling fuel will impose high negative-G loads on the spar-fuselage junction. An engineer should be consulted to determine if the RV-12 is strong enough to carry these loads.
Joe
The RV-12 MUST be registered as experimental. Modifications to Experimental-LSA have to be done after certification, whereas Experimental-Amateur Built can be modified at any time. By "Go Experimental", I assume E-AB was meant, not E-LSA.
The RV-12 wings are probably strong enough to carry fuel internally while flying. If the wing tanks are full during a hard landing, the inertia of falling fuel will impose high negative-G loads on the spar-fuselage junction. An engineer should be consulted to determine if the RV-12 is strong enough to carry these loads.
Joe
joedallas
Well Known Member
Mitch E-AB was meant. A normal landing has positive G-force on the wings until final rotation and the nose wheel has impact. (The fuel will affect the Positive force) A hard landing will Have negative G load applied to the spar fuselage moment. The arm of 3' and 100Lbs of fuel will add about 3 times the weight of fuel to this moment.
My Calculations have determined this is Feasible ( not shown). Vans is the first choice to determine this.
OR
An engineer should be consulted to determine if the RV-12 is strong enough to carry these loads.
Joe Dallas
www.joesRV12.com
There are headwinds in both directions
but there is only one longest leg. plan that leg to have the tailwinds
joedallas
Well Known Member
One more thing the spar to fuselage is not as much a moment connection as it is a wing to wing Moment / Shear Connection. The spar takes the moment.
Joe Dallas
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ErichKeane
Well Known Member
RV-12 Fuel Tank
For my purposes a flat fuel tank to replace Van's would be one that extended across the whole baggage area, and would 'use' that 50-lbs of baggage allowance to add 8-gallons of fuel, bringing the total to 28-gallons.
At 4.5 GPH that would give you slightly over 6-hours of flight, and if you figue 110 MPH, a range of 660 miles. That is a good 500 mile range with good reserve. Just perfect for me. The existing fittings could be used, and an all aluminum tank would be perfect.
Fabricators out there - let's start thinking !!!!
For my purposes a flat fuel tank to replace Van's would be one that extended across the whole baggage area, and would 'use' that 50-lbs of baggage allowance to add 8-gallons of fuel, bringing the total to 28-gallons.
At 4.5 GPH that would give you slightly over 6-hours of flight, and if you figue 110 MPH, a range of 660 miles. That is a good 500 mile range with good reserve. Just perfect for me. The existing fittings could be used, and an all aluminum tank would be perfect.
Fabricators out there - let's start thinking !!!!
marksmithhfx
Member
Or you could try Mike and James route in a D6 (LSA) Sling
http://www.airplanefactory.co.za/world/route.asp
Interestingly they increased the fuel capacity from 110 litres to 450 while only structurally reinforcing the landing gear to handle the additional weight (engine was a Rotax 912). Their longest leg was from Guinea to Brazil, 4044 km, 21 hrs. Too much adventure for me...
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