if you buy a kit or plane/letter to Van

The purpose of this post is twofold - first, to let people know that, if you buy someone else's RV kit or flying plane, Van's will require a Bill Of Sale, a notarized Liability Waiver, and a notarized License form before they will let you buy any parts from them.

The second purpose is to discuss what I think is overkill on the part of Van's regarding requiring all these forms to sell a part. This is a letter I wrote to send to Van along with the forms, whenever I can get the forms notarized:

Richard VanGrunsven
Van's Aircraft, Inc.
14401 Keil Road NE
Aurora, Oregon 97002 USA

December 13, 2011

Dear Mr. VanGrunsven,

I am returning these forms directly to you because I think the process of requiring them is overkill, and I think you might want to reconsider some of these requirements.

I was builder 71008 for an RV-7A. I sold the RV-7A last year, and bought my current RV-6A, built by Ralph Koger. When I bought this plane, it did not have the nose gear Service Bulletin completed, but it included the parts for me to do the SB.

When I started to do the SB, I realized the nose fork stop collar was cracked and the bolt hole elongated, so I called to order a new one. I was told that your company had to have my Bill Of Sale for the plane on file in order for me to buy any parts for it. The requirement seemed a bit obnoxious, but I said I?d send in a copy.

After sending in the Bill Of Sale, I then got an email detailing even more requirements; a waiver form and a license form. To make it even more inconvenient, I was told in the email that I also had to get both forms notarized.

I bought a Quad City Challenger LSA a few years ago, and I?ve been ordering parts for that without any problems or any forms required. I am sure that if I bought a used Cessna, I would not have to go through these hoops to get parts for it.

What sort of business problems do these requirements solve? I?ve been a member of the Van?s community for nearly 10 years, and I?ve never heard of anyone trying to build an illicit RV by ordering one part at a time, nor can I imagine that one of the big problems facing Van?s Aircraft is people building multiple aircraft from one set of plans.

You?ve got a great company, with the best products and support in the business, and I wish Van?s Aircraft nothing but the utmost success in the future, but I don?t think requiring this plethora of forms, notarized, is gaining you anything.

Brian Meyette

My thoughts are that it's perfectly fine for Van to run his company in a way that makes him feel the most comfortable when dealing with the general public. What another business would or wouldn't do should have little or no bearing on the way anyone else would run a business. Life is full of inconveniences, you overcome them and move on.

Van's documents

Brian,

Having run a race car business specializing in road racing formula cars, I can certainly understand that Van's wants these forms on file. Every time an RV crashes, the lawyers line up looking for the deepest pockets, reguardless of blame. The pilot might have tried and failed to do a snap roll on a low pass over the runway, but the (in my opinion crooked) lawyers will focus on the manufacturer and try to fix blame there 'cause that's where the money is. Van's must have a waiver of liability on file to protect the company.

The same is true at every Sports Car Club of America race - every race entry must be accompanied by a waiver of liability, which makes the driver accept that no liability for his damage or injury can be assigned to the SCCA, or any individual that has anything to do with the race. The SCCA waiver of liability has been tested in court, and has always prevailed.

It is definately inconvenient, but with the legal vultures circling around every aircraft accident, it is necessary.

It's becoming more and more prevelant in aviation business anymore. Example: Stop at any drop zone to make a skydive and the waiver will take you at least 10 minutes to complete and in some cases is 10-15 pages thick.

Nope, not suprised. Just a sign of the times and the world we live in...

I have purchased many parts from Van and I do not, nor ever have owned an RV or kit. Never had to sign any waivers either... Where is the problem?

Toobuilder said:

I have purchased many parts from Van and I do not, nor ever have owned an RV or kit. Never had to sign any waivers either... Where is the problem?

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Wait, what? So what's the RV-8 in your sig? A non-RV?

flion said:

Wait, what? So what's the RV-8 in your sig? A non-RV?

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its not his plane but he flies it and does maintenance, etc.

I have never signed a waiver as far as I remember, and I have bought kits and parts from vans for years. I dunno if i just got lucky or what (hiding my name now....)

I bougt all the airframe kits and lot of replacement parts, never had to sign my life away until I needed a bill of sale for registration last week, then came the paper and signature and notary shower.

Where do I get the forms?

Brian,

Where did you get the forms? I looked on Vans site and did not see any of the forms you are talking about. Where did you get the copies? My buddy just purchased an almost complete RV-4. He is totally computer illiterate so I figured I?d get the forms for him. We are going to pick up the kit this weekend. I?ll get the seller to sign what ever he has to at that time.

Thanks

Richard Fazio

Vans will happily email them to you!

Rivethead said:

My thoughts are that it's perfectly fine for Van to run his company in a way that makes him feel the most comfortable when dealing with the general public. What another business would or wouldn't do should have little or no bearing on the way anyone else would run a business. Life is full of inconveniences, you overcome them and move on.

Click to expand...

Ditto this. If you don't like the way he runs his business buy a different plane. He has every right to protect himself and you should appreciate that because if he didn't some greedy lawyer would sue the pants off him and he would no longer be building the kit planes we all love so much. Fill out the forms, fly your plane and thank God and Mr. VanGrunsven himself you can enjoy the privelege of flying a Van's RV.

Just focus...

on the mission.

Brian,
Glad to see you're flying a 6A.
Check your pms.

Dave A.
6A build