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Is this a bad data cable or a bad Garmin 660?

Pilot135pd

Well Known Member
I'm installing a JPI 830 and connecting the Garmin Area 660 to it for the fuel use functions and it seems like the GPS shuts down the data stream after a few seconds and the JPI then says "no gps comm". The video shows the problem and I explain it better there.

https://youtu.be/Q5cuthUiPL4

Could this be a bad data cable or a setting on the 660 that I'm missing?
Any ideas?
 
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I'm installing a JPI 830 and connecting the Garmin Area 660 to it for the fuel use functions and it seems like the GPS shuts down the data stream after a few seconds and the JPI then says "no gps comm". The video shows the problem and I explain it better there.

https://youtu.be/Q5cuthUiPL4

Could this be a bad data cable or a setting on the 660 that I'm missing?
Any ideas?
I wouldn't come to the conclusion that "the GPS shuts down the data stream".

Think about what you are doing in that video. You are not restarting or resetting the Aera 660, but rather, you are breaking, then remaking the RS-232 link to the JPI.

This is a wild guess, but perhaps the JPI is getting over-run with data, shuts down data processing, then recovers for a short time each time you remove the data stream and restore it. You could better test this theory by leaving the Aera 660 snapped into its mount and running normally, and then opening/closing the transmit line to the JPI.

How is the Aera 660 output configured? Perhaps there is a better selection.

If you want to test the Aera 660, remove it from the plane and connect it to a PC running one of the many available programs that will show you that the ASCII NMEA data stream is not stopping.

Something else to check is to make sure that the Aera 660 case is not touching the gizzymo enclosure. If the enclosure is pushing on the Aera 660 and trying to push it out of its mount, the RS-232 connection between the Aera 660 and the mount could be poor. Does pressing on the Aera 660 restore the data stream?

Steve
 
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I wouldn't come to the conclusion that "the GPS shuts down the data stream".

Think about what you are doing in that video. You are not restarting or resetting the Aera 660, but rather, you are breaking, then remaking the RS-232 link to the JPI.

This is a wild guess, but perhaps the JPI is getting over-run with data, shuts down data processing, then recovers for a short time each time you remove the data stream and restore it. You could better test this theory by leaving the Aera 660 snapped into its mount and running normally, and then opening/closing the transmit line to the JPI.

How is the Aera 660 output configured? Perhaps there is a better selection.

If you want to test the Aera 660, remove it from the plane and connect it to a PC running one of the many available programs that will show you that the ASCII NMEA data stream is not stopping.

Something else to check is to make sure that the Aera 660 case is not touching the gizzymo enclosure. If the enclosure is pushing on the Aera 660 and trying to push it out of its mount, the RS-232 connection between the Aera 660 and the mount could be poor. Does pressing on the Aera 660 restore the data stream?

Steve

Good suggestions. The fastest thing to do was to order a data cable for the 560 I also own and see if it's the data cable not making a good connection because although I thought about connecting it to a laptop from a previous thread I read, I wouldn't know what program to use so that would take longer to figure out.

Meanwhile regarding your other thoughts, I've tried every data output setting fast and slow and everything between and nothing works. The JPI is also supposed to adjust automatically no matter what data speed you send to it.

I only noticed they briefly connected because every previous time the 660 was in the cradle and I only changed data settings. That one time I took it out to reinstall the gps antenna and when I pushed it back into the Gizmo that's when I caught a glimpse of it connecting.

Having said that, since I took the video I've tried to recreate it with no success. Nothing I do will make it connect again.

I cleaned all the contacts and even tried to replace the connector with another one I had that doesn't have the data wires (they're both the same part inside and same version as you can see in the picture attached) thinking it could be a bad connector but it didn't make a difference.

Going back to connecting it to a laptop to check the RS232 output, I do have the programming USB cable and if you know of a program I can download to my laptop I'll test that too. I have a Mac with Windows 7 also running under Parallels, so either one will work fine.
 

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Having said that, since I took the video I've tried to recreate it with no success. Nothing I do will make it connect again.

Going back to connecting it to a laptop to check the RS232 output, I do have the programming USB cable and if you know of a program I can download to my laptop I'll test that too. I have a Mac with Windows 7 also running under Parallels, so either one will work fine.

Since you can no longer achieve any success with the connection, it is sounding more like a cabling, configuration, or usage problem.

If you are testing this on the ground with the plane parked, GPS ground speed is invalid. The JPI needs valid ground speed and distance to next waypoint/destination (using a direct-to or flight plan) from the GPS before it can calculate Fuel Required to Waypoint/ Destination(REQ) and Fuel Reserve (RES) at next waypoint/destination.

Perhaps what you are seeing on the JPI with the REQ and RES fields x'd out is normal when you are not airborne with a valid flight plan or direct-to.


I use a free terminal program called PuTTY to monitor and capture RS-232 data. Just search for PuTTY, and you will find the download area. I only use Windows computers, so no idea if it works on a Mac.

You won't be using the USB connection on the Aera 660, just the RS-232 output and ground of your data cable connected to the RS-232 input and ground of your PC.

Do you have a ground wire connected between the Aera 660 and the JPI?

Steve
 
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I ordered a new data cable for my Area 560 to install it and see if it's the 660 cable or the JPI. It should be here Monday or Tuesday. I also know a pilot who has a 830 in his plane so I'll reach out and see about the airplane moving part.

Will be back with updates after that. Thanks.
 
cable 560 versus 660

ACS lists different cables for the 560 versus 660, although they look similar. Have you defintely got the right cable for the 660?
 
I ordered a new data cable for my Area 560 to install it and see if it's the 660 cable or the JPI. It should be here Monday or Tuesday. I also know a pilot who has a 830 in his plane so I'll reach out and see about the airplane moving part.

Will be back with updates after that. Thanks.
Hopefully you read the bolded text in my previous post. There is no way it can calculate that data when parked.

I hate to see you go to the trouble of changing out the Aera 660 mount for the Aera 560 mount when the solution might be as simple as just giving it some ground speed.
 
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Hopefully you read the bolded text in my previous post. There is no way it can calculate that data when parked.

I hate to see you go to the trouble of changing out the Aera 660 mount for the Aera 560 mount when the solution might be as simple as just giving it some ground speed.

Yes I discussed that as part of the troubleshooting. Thanks.
 
I bought a new data cable from Aircraft Spruce for the Aera 560 GPS instead of the Area 660, and after installing it all is good. So it ended up being a bad 660 data cable/connector, something so extremely rare that nobody even considered it since it seems like such a simple bare wire connector. Turns out it has a lot of electronics in that connector (as you can see in a previous picture I posted) and something is wrong with it. At least I know it's not the Area 660 GPS or the JPI 830, because dealing with JPI Support I found out the last month, is HORRIBLE !

I also want to say something pretty important. We should always be on alert to new members offering things for sale, we know how scammers work, but this member with only 1 post in the forum at the time, offered me a data cable and he wasn't a scammer, far from it, and I wanted to post this so in the future if anyone does a search they'll know how helpful he was.

A BIG shout out to a new member on VAF who really helped out:

Eric Sallustio, aka "sallue" here on VAF.


Eric not only sent me the cable but later even offered to send me his Aera 660 on loan to help me when I was having issues troubleshooting what I thought was an installation problem !! Not many would do that and I'm very appreciative of him. I definitely owe him dinner next time I go to Florida or if he stops by East Texas any time.

Now I'll have a project to work on during the colder days next month and an excuse not to leave the warm house. I'm going to take apart that 660 data connector and do as much troubleshooting as I can with the non-existent info that Garmin provides. I'll be comparing the working connector with the bad one and keep looking until I hopefully find what's wrong. Something to spend some quiet time on and in tune with my hobby for so many decades : AF5R - Amateur Extra Class.
 

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