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  #61  
Old 05-06-2020, 12:12 PM
seward747 seward747 is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 198
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Allan, enjoyed, and agree with, your commentary, and description of your "personal street vehicle". If I'm reading this right, it has 10 more horsepower than my first Navy airplane - the mighty 1425 hp., R-1820 powered, North American Aviation T-28 Trojan. "No substitute for cubic inches", eh?

Doug
Seattle area
  #62  
Old 05-06-2020, 12:13 PM
rv6ejguy's Avatar
rv6ejguy rv6ejguy is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Calgary, Canada
Posts: 5,907
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I dunno, we've seen a couple of turbo RVs which will exceed 220 KTAS if you want to try that. You don't need to use all that power if it scares you.

Simple solution here, limit MAP and/or RPM to hold power down to 320 levels.

Can install a throttle stop if you can't trust yourself...

End of story.
__________________

Ross Farnham, Calgary, Alberta
Turbo Subaru EJ22, SDS EFI, Marcotte M-300, IVO, Shorai- RV6A C-GVZX flying from CYBW since 2003- 445.9 hrs. on the Hobbs,
RV10 95% built- Sold 2016
http://www.sdsefi.com/aircraft.html
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCiy...g2GvQfelECCGoQ


  #63  
Old 05-06-2020, 02:07 PM
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PerfTech PerfTech is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Redlands, Ca.
Posts: 1,497
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Quote:
Originally Posted by odens_14 View Post
I agree 100%, but you have to keep in mind the OP posted that he was concerned about his -9 with a -360. I haven't seen anyone saying he shouldn't be able to have it or that it shouldn't be allowed; just that if you do have one you need to pay close attention to multiple factors that are more easily exceeded with the extra power.
....You are absolutely correct, and I really didn't address the original post at all.
I went off on my rant and should have perhaps been a bit more tactful. I do feel
if you are going to fly an airplane, you should know the definition of your V numbers,
and pay attention to them. I come from a different place, and the goal in my
turbocharger business, our engine and dyno shop, high end off-road truck and
sand car building businesses is to give the customer as much HP as possible.
so far with many hundreds of customers, and over 2K vehicles built in our shops,
I have yet to have even one, come with the complaint of having too much HP.
I have not even considered a liability issue as being a driving force in any build.
It would be more likely I get sued because I failed to meet their HP expectations.
Wow! There I go again. Thanks, Allan..
__________________
Allan Nimmo
AntiSplatAero.com
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(909) 824-1020
  #64  
Old 05-06-2020, 02:30 PM
lr172 lr172 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Schaumburg, IL
Posts: 5,870
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PerfTech View Post
I have not even considered a liability issue as being a driving force in any build.
It would be more likely I get sued because I failed to meet their HP expectations.
Wow! There I go again. Thanks, Allan..
Big difference between someone paying you to create an HP monster and Selling a full assembled "standard" RV-9 to an average buyer. It is easy for someone to assume that your RV-9 is similar to all the others along with their their demonstrated safety record. There is no inherent negligence when someone asks you to build a 1400HP vehicle and then kills themselves due to the abundant power.
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  #65  
Old 05-06-2020, 03:02 PM
DeltaRomeo DeltaRomeo is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Highland Village, TX
Posts: 4,170
Default Boy that went sideways fast...

Oh my. ‘Civil’ is literally the third word on the front page of VansAirForce.net, so you’ll understand why I’m locking this thread. I went back and cleaned up some of the posts. I thought that better than deleting the whole thread - there is some good info in it.

Please play nice in my house. Pretty please.

v/r,dr

PS: I locked the thread before Mothership Greg could post this. I copy/pasted his emailed words below:
Quote:
Originally Posted by DeeCee 57
and this is another thread when having Mothership take position or explain would have been nice.

Why is Vans, save for the sales dept, not represented here on VAF?
For the record, we don't actually have a sales department. We are a small shop that tries to keep the cost to you down as low as we can. Our support team stays very busy with email and phone support for when you need it, and a few of us participate here on VAF to try to contribute to the community.

The mothership did take a position on this, both in this thread, on other threads on VAF, and in documents we've published in the past. For the record: Scott works at Van's and has worked here for more years than almost every other employee. He posts on behalf of Van's and also offers some of his own opinions where it seems appropriate. So do I, for that matter. We are community members and builders just like you.


Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulvS View Post
I am sure that VAF saves Vans from an ongoing bunch of support calls, and therefore real time and money.**So hopefully there is recognition of that by the Mothership and some assistance to DR to help keep this community going...
Van's supports Doug's business financially - we purchase advertising - and in other ways. And in reality, we often get more calls of certain types in our support department because of something that comes up on VAF, so it's not as simple of an equation as "VAF reduces the Van's tech support load." For certain the VAF forums and community is a truly great and very important asset! I've been leveraging it for years myself. But even I was surprised when I started getting involved in support discussions how many support calls/emails are something along the lines of, "Yes, I read my plans pages and I get it, but this other guy on VAF said xxx." And yes, we answer those questions, too.

And, I'll put forward a more human, personal note that I'd just ask everyone to consider: We all (builders, pilots, Van's employees, etc.) are under a lot of stress right now and some of us have some incredibly difficult things happening in our lives. The kinds of things that don't get added to the VAF posts talking about RV-9 airspeeds, powerplants and Van's recommendations. All of us, collectively, could probably do well to take a step back and relax a bit. I had a boss once who took the common adage of "Don't wait, say/do something!" and instead made it, "Don't say/do something, just wait." It can be useful when opinions are strong and people are a little edgy/grumpy/getting old (that's a reference to me, not anyone else!) and whatnot (especially in the Internet age). And, for people who are experiencing tough times right now (I know there are some of us here in that situation) our hearts go out to you (and we thank you for your support, too!)

Related to the original topic... For the OP, who's flying an aircraft that causes him apprehension, there is one first-best route I would recommend above all others, and which someone suggested earlier in the thread. Get some training in your airplane from a competent and recognized RV training CFI. We have a list on the Van's web site.

Finally, when we use the term "Van's recommends" as connected to a design spec, two things that are good to to keep in mind:

1) We have specifically designed and tested the airplane for what is recommended. Of course, we stick to that -- it's what it was designed for with all appropriate and standard structural margins built-in, etc. It's based on actual math, not desire. The engineering safety margin belongs to the engineers, and our margins are based around industry-accepted practices.

2)**When you build the airplane, you make your decisions about engines, operating limits, modifications, etc. and you own them. When Van's doesn't recommend something, or even if we specifically recommend against something, that doesn't mean someone's going to show up at your shop to yell at you or anything like that. It's your airplane, and they're your decisions. We will consistently state the position of the designers and what our numbers and limits are. Especially in instances where there seems to be a lack of understanding regarding something, to where it could be propagating info that at the very least would be frustrating but potentially even be dangerous to the literally thousands of others that will be reading it. If we revise the numbers or a design for any reason, we will also state that. The choices you make relative to the factory's recommendations is your prerogative and responsibility as the builder of an experimental aircraft. We have said in the past and will reiterate here, that just because you can do something doesn't necessarily mean you should. But the choices are yours to make.

Okay, now let's go flying.
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Last edited by DeltaRomeo : 05-06-2020 at 03:55 PM.
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