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4 Titan Engines, 2 MT Props, One RV-8, 4 days

Relentless

Relentless

Well Known Member
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3 of our new Titan Engines all lined up and ready for MT vibration test on RV8. 212hp 409, 196hp 370, 188hp 340, and the last one that is not shown because if still on Dyno until tomorrow is our new counter-weighted 206hp 370.

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Strain gages on prop blades and on crank to measure torsional vibration levels to make sure MT Props are certified for all our new engines.

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Royce and I are on a role! We mounted equipment Monday and completed test on 409. Here we have just finished swapping 409 for first 370 and completed test in just 8 hours. Tomorrow we throw on next counter-weighted 370, and if all goes well we will finish with 340 and smaller MT prop on Thursday. I am really interested in finding out how 340 runs on RV8. It puts out about 188hp but only weights 250lbs. with cold induction and AFP fuel injection and Lightspeed.

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Joseph from MT Propeller, doesn't like riding in the back, I think he would much rather do the pilot thing.
 
Atta boy!

Great work, Kevin. Be careful of an aft CG with the lightest engine, with the fella in the back.

How is the wrap standing up to all the on-and-off process?

Carry on!
Mark
 
C/W 370 Crank?

Please post more info on your counter weight 370 crankshaft.
Will it be offered as a standalone item?

Very cool that y'all are spending your time doing this testing. Hope you
will post climb and speed performance.

Tailwinds to ya.

David Mojonnier
 
Aft CG

F1Boss said:
Great work, Kevin. Be careful of an aft CG with the lightest engine, with the fella in the back.

How is the wrap standing up to all the on-and-off process?

Carry on!
Mark
Click to expand...

Thanks mark, I was planning on weighing plane each time, I have same concern, Joseph is about 210 and equipment is about 30lbs in back. Test requires max MP at 2700rpm and test from stall to VNE.. :confused:

I am not getting paid enough for this......:(
 
Climb data from each Titan Engine....

MOJO said:
Please post more info on your counter weight 370 crankshaft.
Will it be offered as a standalone item?

Very cool that y'all are spending your time doing this testing. Hope you
will post climb and speed performance.

Tailwinds to ya.

David Mojonnier
Click to expand...

Mojo,

I will be workign on this exact comparison over the weekend. I have not posted like I wanted because there is simply to much to test before OSH. I can tell you the the difference between the 194hp 370 and 212 hp 409 was dramatic on climbout. I hope the couterweighted 370 will perform better.

We do not plan on selling any of our experimental components seperate, too many problems with engine shops in the past. We will upgrade anyone's engine for minimal expense and get the manufacturers guarantee it was tested and done right!!!:D
 
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Bravo!

In a world full of ad hoc engine/prop combinations, it's very good to see an engine house dedicated to the experimental market spending the time, effort, and money to do proper propeller vibration checks.

Hopefully you can get the Hartzell crew out to do their props also. Offhand, I'm not sure if anyone else has the equipment.
 
Test props

Keep in mind - the test prop is an ugly monster - with the strain sensors glued to it all over the place. Not the prop you want to use for flight testing...

Now, if MT brought production samples for you to teat, that is a different story!

This is great news, unless you are faster than me! :-0

Carry on!
Mark
 
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Prop Testing

DanH said:
Bravo!

In a world full of ad hoc engine/prop combinations, it's very good to see an engine house dedicated to the experimental market spending the time, effort, and money to do proper propeller vibration checks.

Hopefully you can get the Hartzell crew out to do their props also. Offhand, I'm not sure if anyone else has the equipment.
Click to expand...

MT seems to be the only one interested in doing this work with us but we are hoping the data we gather this week will at least give the other companies something to evaluate. MT seems willing to share for the sake of safety for all...
 
Relentless said:
I can tell you the the difference between the 194hp 370 and 212 hp 409 was dramatic on climbout.
Click to expand...

During Reno PRS last month, Titan allowed me to fly their 409 equipped RV8 we wrapped.

"Dramatic difference" would be very accurate regarding the Titan 409 compared to my 190+hp IO360. At 5000' and 80-90 degrees the 409 was very impressive.

Regards,

Scott
 
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Not meaning to be obnoxious but I thought the 409 was supposed to put out 230 hp or am I mistaken?

Glenn Wilkinson
 
Relentless said:
Mojo,

I can tell you the the difference between the 194hp 370 and 212 hp 409 was dramatic on climbout. I hope the couterweighted 370 will perform better.
Click to expand...

I am confused by this comment, did you mean difference in vibration or something else?

Great job undertaking these tests, like others have said Hartzell would be very remiss if they passed over the opportunity. The strength of the team is much greater than the sum of the individuals.
 
glenn654 said:
Not meaning to be obnoxious but I thought the 409 was supposed to put out 230 hp or am I mistaken?

Glenn Wilkinson
Click to expand...

We now have 3 versions of the 409, a standard parallel which puts out 210hp and 410lbs of torque, an angle valve version which is 230hp and 450lbs of torque, and the RSeries 409 which developes 230hp and 450lbs of torque but weights in under 300 lbs.

As a comparison we tested a ycoming 390 off one of the Aerodynamix RVs and it made a disappointing 205hp......not the advertised 215hp....
 
Doug said:
I am confused by this comment, did you mean difference in vibration or something else?

Great job undertaking these tests, like others have said Hartzell would be very remiss if they passed over the opportunity. The strength of the team is much greater than the sum of the individuals.
Click to expand...

The difference was the feeling in the seat of you're pants, everyone likes to talk about hp but what I will show the world very soon is how much better our stroker engines perform because of the torque they produce at around 2500 rpm.

Hartzell did testing on our engines back in 2009, I will be inviting them to test again once we finish Oshkosh.
 
Relentless said:
We now have 3 versions of the 409, a standard parallel which puts out 210hp and 410lbs of torque, an angle valve version which is 230hp and 450lbs of torque, and the RSeries 409 which developes 230hp and 450lbs of torque but weights in under 300 lbs.

As a comparison we tested a ycoming 390 off one of the Aerodynamix RVs and it made a disappointing 205hp......not the advertised 215hp....
Click to expand...

That (lower speed) torque advantage will really show in cruise settings! Lots of good pireps expected from that.

A curious question, what oil viscosity and temperature do you use for the standard power testing?

Also with the higher Cubes, how do you improve the breathing to get the air to go with fuel? No secrets, just generally.

Thanks for being here BTW- it is great having some direct contact with engine builders!
 
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Thank you and your crew.

I really appreciate what you all are doing and keeping us informed. One of these days I want to upgrade; and the Titan 340 is heading up my daydreams.

Best in your endeavors. :)
 
Relentless said:
As a comparison we tested a ycoming 390 off one of the Aerodynamix RVs and it made a disappointing 205hp......not the advertised 215hp....
Click to expand...

Well, in fairness, they've always been advertised at 210.

http://www.lycoming.com/Lycoming/PRODUCTS/Engines/Certified/390Series/EngineData.aspx

And Titan literature advertises 205 for the base parallel valve 409, with 10.5 CR. The low weight is attractive. Does it have pendulum absorbers?

http://www.titanengine.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/Titan_EngineComparison_041614-3.pdf

FWIW, my 390 did 205 on the Barrett dyno with just over 1 hour on the clock, and it has loosened up quite a bit since then. Dead stock kit motor (8.9 CR, Airflow, Slicks) with balancing, back when you could still buy a kit motor.

Kevin, how many hours on the A-Team 390? I know of a well-flogged acro 580 in for overhaul, so maybe we'll soon have some wear data for the big bore cylinder.
 
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