IFR - Clearance copy practice

Hello all:

I'm a bit rusty on IFR flight and I'm preparing to do an IPC ride. One of the hardest parts for me was and is getting the clearance copy correct without having to have ATC repeat the clearance - especially a change when I'm not familiar with the area and names of VOR's, etc. So after working hard to seem professional - flying accurately and precisely - It all goes out the window when I botch the clearance copy.

Used to be easy when leaving Muscatine, Iowa direct to Muscle Shoals, AL as it was always cleared direct as filed . Since moving to the ATL area and having a daughter in San Antonio, flying across several MOA's that may force a change, getting put on Victor airways, etc. It's not cleared direct much anymore.

Leaving 19A (Jackson County, GA), I pick the logical fixes trying to get "cleared as filed" but doesn't happen very often. I've got the CRAFT acronym so it isn't that it's the actual hearing and writing it down.

Has anyone found a solution to practice listening / copying clearances?

Regards,
Doug

If you have a hand held radio, maybe just tune into the local clearance delivery freq and copy them down for practice...

I just got my IFR ticket last weekend. I'm still not great at getting the clearances right every time and the clearances I get in the Columbia River Gorge are pretty straightforward but...

A couple things help me.

First - The replay button on the G1000 panel that I fly. Not every panel is going to have that. If you happen to fly Lightspeed Zulu 2's, they have an app that can record everything that passes through your headset onto your iPhone or iPad. With that app, you can play back audio snippets which basically does the same thing as the Garmin replay button.

The second is that I fly Microsoft Flight Sim almost every day. Fly a lot of approaches and it gets easier.

I still find myself saying "Say Again" a bit but those two things have helped me.

Dmadd said:

If you have a hand held radio, maybe just tune into the local clearance delivery freq and copy them down for practice...

Click to expand...

This is what I do to keep in practice. I also made up my own "shorthand" which lets me copy the clearance faster and makes sense to me. Listen to a local clearance delivery (more activity at a big airport) and play with making up your own "shorthand". It will make the entire process less dificult for you.

Pick a clearance delivery to listen to on liveatc.net.

Also in their forums some users have posted "cleaned up" recordings just for practicing copying clearances.

Here is one...
http://www.liveatc.net/forums/atcaviation-audio-clips/more-ifr-clearance-practice/

Please note that you have to be a member and logged in to see and click on the audio links. (Not a big deal) Also there are hours and hours of great audio clips that users have captured from ATC recordings. I enjoy the funny ones but don't care for the accident ones.

GalinHdz said:

This is what I do to keep in practice. I also made up my own "shorthand" which lets me copy the clearance faster and makes sense to me. Listen to a local clearance delivery (more activity at a big airport) and play with making up your own "shorthand". It will make the entire process less dificult for you.

Click to expand...

+3
When I was learning I parked near SFO with a handheld tuned to clearance delivery, and practiced copying for a few hours.

Before I call I write "N48HT Clrd to (destination)" because that's what you get 99% of the time - but listen, sometimes it's different!
Agree with others about shorthand. I use a "D" with an arrow thru it for "direct", just write down the numbers for departure and squawk (if I forget departure's name, I just call them "departure" (!).

Congratulations!!

ERushing said:

I just got my IFR ticket last weekend.

Click to expand...

Eric, congrats on the new rating

Try these...

See what routes have been recently cleared:

http://flightaware.com/news/article/Did-You-Know-You-can-find-IFR-routes-for-an-upcoming-flight/46

Or the FAA preferred routes:

http://www.fly.faa.gov/Products/Cod..._Database/nfdc_preferred_routes_database.html

Having an idea of what to expect seems to make it much easier to copy the clearance.

airmel said:

See what routes have been recently cleared:

http://flightaware.com/news/article/Did-You-Know-You-can-find-IFR-routes-for-an-upcoming-flight/46

Or the FAA preferred routes:

http://www.fly.faa.gov/Products/Cod..._Database/nfdc_preferred_routes_database.html

Having an idea of what to expect seems to make it much easier to copy the clearance.

Click to expand...

Agreed! And look over your intended route on charts, SID's and STAR's and read as many names as you can see to become familiar with them - Brain Conditioning

Sign up for text message alerts from FlightAware. They'll send you your route as soon as it's in the system. Supposedly it can change, but in my experience, it's always the same.

Also, look at an approach plate for the departure frequency and write it down before you call for your clearance.

What Rob said, but I use Flt Plan.com. I know the clearance before I call CD. Haven't had a change yet.

The route part is the hard part to get. Tell them you are unfamiliar with the area and to spell out the waypoints. CRAFTY EHH.

I have heard all types of pilots need a read back when there has been too much coffee consumption. Now stand by for a full reroute.

flyinga said:

What Rob said, but I use Flt Plan.com. I know the clearance before I call CD. Haven't had a change yet.

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I have been using Fltplan for nearly every filing and seldom I get the route sent to me, but always get an e-mail that it was filed. Now, granted most of the time I get the same route as I have filed so that might be the reason.

RV10Rob said:

Sign up for text message alerts from FlightAware. They'll send you your route as soon as it's in the system. Supposedly it can change, but in my experience, it's always the same.

Also, look at an approach plate for the departure frequency and write it down before you call for your clearance.

Click to expand...

A lot of great ideas here. Although I've been IFRing for many years (and I use Flight Aware), I wasn't "aware" of this service.
I will certainly take advantage of it...THANKS!

Good ideas here. Thanks. I have this form that I use for myself which helps a lot for the initial clearance. I've always been told to just write down what you hear and not try to understand but seems I struggle with this part if not familiar with the area. As Turbo stated, the changes enroute are the hardest for me.

____N277CK________________ is cleared to ____________________ airport

______________________________________________________________
(as filed, via, etc.)

After departure Runway ______

Turn / fly _________. Climb and maintain ___________, expect _______ in _____.

Departure ______

Squawk ______________

I'll try to listen in to some of the recorded clearances.

Regards,
Doug

IFR Clearance Practice

Hi Doug,

Welcome to the club of having issues when copying clearances. Not only did I have problems in the beginning, so have several of my instrument students. Something I found that has helped is the COMM1 "Clearances On Request" CD. You can find it at several of the typical sources (Sporty's, Aircraft Spruce, etc.). It's not cheap but the best thing about it is you get to hear the proper phraseology and not the slang you typically hear on things like LiveATC or over the local radio. COMM1'S other radio simulators are good too for their respective use. You can also practice this without burning 100LL!!

I hope this helps.

Jeff

I will second LiveATC. Stick with CRAFT.

Don't rely too much on expected route and what you think your clearance will be. It isn't always correct. I got surprised with a very lengthy clearance flying out of Boston last week and none of it was in the expected clearance ForeFlight and FlightAware gave me.

LOTS of great ideas here! And many I did not know about like text alerts, etc..
I have been flying for NetJets for 15 years, and we go to many far-flung airports large and small. My best advise is to never be afraid to say, "please say again the routing, slowly this time" or "what was the initial altitude again" or "what's the identifier for DuPont" or whatever. Get it all written down, corrected as needed, before reading it back.

When ATC reads the clearance rapid-fire like an auctioneer, I used to get frustrated. Now with experience i just put the pen down until he's done, and slowly and politely ask him to repeat it. Its actually amusing to me when they read it so fast, as if they are saving time only to have to say it again a second or even third time! (Same with ATIS, for that matter.--a special pet peeve of mine.)

Experience helps, i guess, when it comes to not being intimidated by ATC, but I bet that after asking them to repeat just a few times it won't feel so weird. YOU are the one in charge, not them!

Marc

Doug,
United gave the discretion of their captains to broadcast on channel 9 of rue sitting in the back of the bus.
I ask when I enter the cabin, provided I'm not interrupting checklist review.

Most agree when they see my Vans Hat.
I listen in and copy clearances on my kneeboard. I find it more fun than in-flight movies, and it is "real-world".

Some United 4 -stripers have confided they believe it opens them up to liability, but I think that is perceived, not so real.

Daddyman
Dues paid (happily)

I remember a few years back (before pdc), hearing an "experienced" airline pilot call for clearance at a major NYC airport. He told the clearance delivery guy when he called for clearance..."We can do this one time slowly, or two times quickly".

Some years ago I was on United 123 to ATL, with ch 9 active.
ATC "UA123, expect to hold 15 minutes for weather"
UA: "We don't have enough gas for that. We'll divert to Nashville"
After 2 hours on the ground at Nashville:
ATC: "UA123 is cleared to ATL via Nashville-1 departure, ..."
many seconds of silence, then
UA:"Uh we don't seem to have any Nashville charts, can you read us the departure procedure?"
ATC: "Okay, new clearance, UA123 cleared to ATL via radar vectors,..."

Liveatc.net. I used it a ton when I was getting my IFR ticket. There are several airports that you can listen to clearance delivery. Practice writing them down as they are read using shorthand. You'll also discover more than a few pros who ask for say again. I still do it to keep in practice. If I'm travelling, I take my handheld scanner, look up the freqs of the airports I'm at an tune and listen to all the traffic.

HTH,
Dale

I did not see anyone mention Foreflight. They email you the expected route to flight that ATC will clear within a couple minutes of filling your flight plan.

Like others have suggested, liveatc is a good way to hear a ton of clearances.
I find taking down a clearance in my own shorthand on a blank pad of paper much more effective than having a pre-printed form. I do unscheduled world wide operations and I am forever in some new airport that I am not familiar with. Throw in a thick accent from a controller for whom english in not their native language and this can get pretty exciting.
This is what I do:
Look at the departures for KDFW. There are no less than 50 possible SIDs (nobody needs that many, seriously). Now assume you are going to fly west for instance and you filed the COYOTE 6 to CORONA VOR. If you eliminate the SIDs that go north, south and east you are down to only about 8 or 9 possible options. Each SID obviously has a different name and by this point there is a very high likelihood that there will not be two SIDs going west that start with the same letter. You can familiarize yourself with the available possibilities going west and be ready. When you filed COYOTE 6 to CORONA and the clearance you get is the WORTH 8 CORONA it is simple enough between memory and your shorthand to write down W8 CNX and when you read it back you remember W8 meant WORTH 8.

I don't write down the destination. I know where I am going. If the clearance was to somewhere else I will keep writing the rest of the clearance but clarify before proceeding with any read back.

If the departure procedure is a manual turn, my short hand is LT or RT for left or right turn and RH if it is runway heading

Like others have mentions, I also use a capital D with an arrow drawn through it for DIRECT.

I use AF for as filed.

Altitudes are a series of numbers in my short hand. If I receive a clearance that says climb to 5000, expect FL410 10 minutes after departure, what I write down will be 50/410/10. In my shorthand I know what that means.

Departure frequencies and squawk codes are also just numbers. I don't label them. The order is fixed so I know what those digits mean.

A KDFW to KSFO clearance that was read to me as:
N12345 is cleared to the San Francisco airport via the Worth 8 departure, CORONA transition, direct CIMARRON and then as filed. Climb and maintain seven thousand, expect flight level three eight zero five minutes after departure, departure frequency will be one two six point four seven squawk three five one seven.
would look like this in my shorthand;

W8 CNX D(with an arrow) CIM AF
7/380/5
126.47 3517

When you read it back just re-translate from shorthand to english. It is so much easier than trying to write it in english when the controller is reading it a 300 words per minute with gusts to 400.

Don't be worried about asking for clarification. If I had a dollar for every time I received a clearance on the east coast that went from a SID to a fix and then cleared as filed, except that fix was not in my filed flight plan, I could retire. Unknown fix names are a favorite too. Get any confusion cleared up on the ground while you are not also having to keep the airplane in the air right side up.

I spent a lot of time on Live ATC as well doing clearances for the IFR ticket and for sure you need to do that so you aren't a total dufus on the radio. That said, after listening long enough, I've heard plenty of pros goof it up or in reality just being a normal human on the radio - as has been noted by several pros already on this thread (thanks guys). That's when I finally put down my fear of making a read back mistake and just make a good valiant effort to get it right the first time and if its not, hey that's ok. Get what you can, read back what you got and re-ask for the rest.

Its pretty much the same at the dinner table these days..."hey speak slower, I can't listen that fast!"

For your specific situation, the best way to copy a clearance and read it back correct is to know what to expect. In the Atlanta area, which I have been OT many times, every pilot seems to know, from their airport, going through the Class B, which altitudes give them what routing (most of the time). For example, if you want to get vectored over KATL, you file for X,000 ft and then ask for higher when you get past. If you ask for Y,000 feet, they will send you out and around.

So, talk to some people at your airport that frequently fly the same general direction as you and see what their "system" is and what waypoints they usually get.

Any time I get a waypoint, I ask for it to be spelled phonetically. I don't care how long it takes. As others have said, if they say it too fast, especially if they act rushed, just ask for it again, and again if necessary.

Now, for a funny story. A student pilot friend was doing his towered airport work. He was given instructions, which he wrote down and read back. The tower said, "read back correct," so he read it back again. The tower said, "read back correct," so he read it back again. Then the tower finally said, "your read back was correct," and he departed. Knowing what to expect to hear is more than half the battle in copying and reading back correctly.

Usually...

And I mean usuallly, CAF. But if a MOA goes HOT as it did with me on an A/C delivery several years ago, approaching Buckeye MOA, I had to whip out a different chart to see which waypoint they gave me. that means you need to be ready for almost anything once "up there"

Shorthand

Doug,

I have a friends Grandson that I'm working with on his instrument rating right now. His biggest challenge has been interaction with ATC. Learning clearance shorthand is a must as it helps you focus on just what the controller is rattling off to you and writing it down. Then you can review the issued ATC clearance and route as you plug it into the flight plan page. Here are some ideas. http://djw.org/djw/ifr/IFR_Clearances_and_shorthand.pdf.

This young man is getting better at expecting what's going to be said next when getting ATC instructions, and formulating his own shorthand.

Mark CFII