AFS 4500 Rebooted just before Take Off

I have an RV-8 with an AFS-4500, Garmin 430 w, Garmin 327 and some steam gauges.

Today I flew from Cameron Park (O61) to Salinas. I stopped to checkout the facilities then proceeded towards home.

After run up and just before take off, the AFS-4500 went black then rebooted by itself. I need that engine monitor so I decided to taxi back and watch the bahavior of the AFS to see what it was doing. While taxing back it rebooted a send time without me switch off the master.

On shutdown the EFIS stayed on using its own battery power beyond the norm 45 seconds. I did t not push any buttons to force it to stay operational.

It shut off normally after I switched on then off the master (again).

Any ideas what may have caused this?

Thanks,

Charlie

I'll take a guess....

If it was hot it may have overheated.

Or....

If your CPU is starting to die the unit will act funny and do odd things.

My CPU died a few months ago on my vintage 2009 AFS4500 and when AFS trouble shot it they told me the older CPU's were prone to failure with after many Cold and Hot cycles.

Since I lived in the NorthEast I figured it had seen many of those!

Batteries

Check the batteries.. Make sure pin 1 & 15 - Main are both connected to 5A Breaker .. & pin 1 of the expansion cable to a 5 A breaker ..

No ideas but . . .

Mine has done that twice in the 5 years it has been installed. The first time was just after an early morning, in the dark launch to Airventure 2013. It was off for a short time and I then came back on line. While there I asked Rob about it. His suggestion was to download the Lat st update. From then on it worked fine until a week ago, in the pattern turning downwind to base, when it went black and by the time I landed rebooted. Has worked fine since.

SmilingJack said:

I'll take a guess....

If it was hot it may have overheated.

Or....

If your CPU is starting to die the unit will act funny and do odd things.

My CPU died a few months ago on my vintage 2009 AFS4500 and when AFS trouble shot it they told me the older CPU's were prone to failure with after many Cold and Hot cycles.

Since I lived in the NorthEast I figured it had seen many of those!

Click to expand...

John,

After letting it sit for an hour, I went back and tried again. Made it home without incident. Worked as it should

It hit 90 degrees at Salinas while I was there. I closed my canopy while I was inside the terminal for about 45 minutes. The plane was parked in full sun. It was really hot under the cowl when I returned and checked the oil.

I think you're right, it overheated and tripped a thermal breaker or something. The fan was working.

Not fun when you're trying to get home.

What was the disposition on your AFS 4500? Did you get it repaired, replaced, updated? Or did you get something new?

Thank you for sharing your experience.

Charlie

chazking said:

Check the batteries.. Make sure pin 1 & 15 - Main are both connected to 5A Breaker .. & pin 1 of the expansion cable to a 5 A breaker ..

Click to expand...

Chaz,

Thank you for responding. Are your instructions for the failure to shut down issue? or the issue where it shut off at run up? or both?

Did you also have this problem and this was the solution?

Thank you,

Charlie

TrueAirSpeed said:

Mine has done that twice in the 5 years it has been installed. The first time was just after an early morning, in the dark launch to Airventure 2013. It was off for a short time and I then came back on line. While there I asked Rob about it. His suggestion was to download the Lat st update. From then on it worked fine until a week ago, in the pattern turning downwind to base, when it went black and by the time I landed rebooted. Has worked fine since.

Click to expand...

Terry,

Thanks for the response. I suppose there's no way to reboot an AFS-4500 during flight? Mine powers up when I flip on the master switch.

I will do an update and hope for the best. I was thinking about an upgrade but that isn't cheap.

Thank you,

Charlie

Chkaharyer99 said:

John,

After letting it sit for an hour, I went back and tried again. Made it home without incident. Worked as it should

It hit 90 degrees at Salinas while I was there. I closed my canopy while I was inside the terminal for about 45 minutes. The plane was parked in full sun. It was really hot under the cowl when I returned and checked the oil.

I think you're right, it overheated and tripped a thermal breaker or something. The fan was working.

Not fun when you're trying to get home.

What was the disposition on your AFS 4500? Did you get it repaired, replaced, updated? Or did you get something new?

Thank you for sharing your experience.

Charlie

Click to expand...

Charlie,

That sounds like an overheat. I too experienced that and my solution I even used today. I cut down and custom fit a "foil" automobile sunshade and now use that when I park. It seems to keep a 90 degree day from becoming a 1000 degree cockpit from my black glare shield. Since doing that the 4500 has never had the shutdown happen.

Now, as for the failure in November. It was in my hangar, I downloaded flight data one day, then when I went back the unit was having all kinds of boot up problems. At times it looked like a lot of code scrolling up the middle of the screen. And it appears at sometimes no power was being feed. I sent it back and it was the CPU that had failed.

AFS cut me a good trade-up deal so I upgraded to the 5400 and really like it.

SmilingJack said:

Charlie,

That sounds like an overheat. I too experienced that and my solution I even used today. I cut down and custom fit a "foil" automobile sunshade and now use that when I park. It seems to keep a 90 degree day from becoming a 1000 degree cockpit from my black glare shield. Since doing that the 4500 has never had the shutdown happen.

Now, as for the failure in November. It was in my hangar, I downloaded flight data one day, then when I went back the unit was having all kinds of boot up problems. At times it looked like a lot of code scrolling up the middle of the screen. And it appears at sometimes no power was being feed. I sent it back and it was the CPU that had failed.

AFS cut me a good trade-up deal so I upgraded to the 5400 and really like it.

Click to expand...

John,

I was seriously considering doing the upgrade to an AFS 5600 Touch. I've been asking the folks at AFS tons of questions about what's needed. It's a lot more than just the cost of the AF-5600. I've talked to quite a few AF-5600 T users and they all seem to love it. But then again, the Garmin users love there Garmin's and the Dynon....

Did you do better than 30% off the cost of the AF-5600 for the 4500 trade in? If you'd rather not say, I understand. That's all AFS is offering. The cost has me looking at the competition.

My email is my VAF screen name (Chkaharyer) followed by @yahoo.com in case you want to use that. I would love to see a photo of your panel with the AFS-5600.

I like the sun shade idea. I will do that also.

Thanks,

Charlie

Issues

Charlie,

I do not remember reboot issues with my 4500s. But I did have reboot issues with the main 5600 (it was after several months of operation that they began to occur). In flight, last year, the main 5600 rebooted. [I replaced the 4500s without changing the connector wiring, as they are "plug" compatible!].

After these incidents, I sent both 5600s to AFS & during their testing they experienced the reboot. After they upgraded with the latest hdwe / firmware, the reboot did not recur on their test bench.

After re-installation the 5600 rebooted 3 times and since the transponder was thru a serial port, not a good thing. At this point AFS could do no more & Shawn suggested connecting main pins 1/15 to a 5A breaker (only pin #1 was connected) and pin #1 in the expansion connector to a separate 5A breaker. After following those instructions I have had no further reboot occurrences.

While the CPU may be overheating, I would recommend confirming those connections before moving forward.

Chas

chazking said:

Charlie,

I do not remember reboot issues with my 4500s. But I did have reboot issues with the main 5600 (it was after several months of operation that they began to occur). In flight, last year, the main 5600 rebooted. [I replaced the 4500s without changing the connector wiring, as they are "plug" compatible!].

After these incidents, I sent both 5600s to AFS & during their testing they experienced the reboot. After they upgraded with the latest hdwe / firmware, the reboot did not recur on their test bench.

After re-installation the 5600 rebooted 3 times and since the transponder was thru a serial port, not a good thing. At this point AFS could do no more & Shawn suggested connecting main pins 1/15 to a 5A breaker (only pin #1 was connected) and pin #1 in the expansion connector to a separate 5A breaker. After following those instructions I have had no further reboot occurrences.

While the CPU may be overheating, I would recommend confirming those connections before moving forward.

Chas

Click to expand...

Chas,

Thank you for sharing your experience with AFS.

Reliability is a key factor with everything aviation related. I'm not sure what to think about this AFS reboot issue. Definitely speaks to reliability but overheat could surely be the cause. I hear Ipads reboot sometimes due to overheat. Nevertheless, my confidence in the device is shaken a bit.

I'm a relatively new, low time pilot flying a new to me aircraft. Got my PPL in 2014. Getting used to a glass panel has been a challenge but also very educational and interesting.

The builder and previous owner/flyer experienced reboot issues with the AFS as well. He sent it back to AFS and they did something but I'm not sure what.

You say your AF-5600 and transponder rebooted X3 since sending it back to AFS. Not good.

I will take a look at the wiring as you suggest specifically at the wires to/from pins 1 & 15 to see if they are connected to 5A breaker. Hopefully that will fix it, at least until after Air Venture when I plan to look at replacements.

On that note. Are you happy with your AF-5600? Would you buy AFS again?

Thanks,

Charlie

The wiring is not the same on the AF-4500 and AF-5600, the advice on checking the pins is not correct for a AF-4500.

Email us the system logs so we can see what happened. The AF-4500 is constantly reading data from the SD card, make sure it is correctly seated in the socket.

Are you running the latest software from our web site?

http://www.advanced-flight-systems.com/Support/AdvancedDeckSupport/AF4000VS80829-MV16-AV40.zip


Rob Hickman
Advanced Flight Systems Inc.

Power

The key take-away from my story is ensuring sufficient power. Hence, main pins 1&15 & expansion pin #1. AFS doc / wiring diagrams are clear on the wiring.

Once I followed the manual, all was well.

I use AFS gear & would definitely buy it again. Their support in spite of my ineptitude is stellar.

I tried to email you and this does not go through?

(Chkaharyer) followed by @yahoo.com

Rob Hickman

N402RH said:

I tried to email you and this does not go through?

(Chkaharyer) followed by @yahoo.com

Rob Hickman

Click to expand...

Add a 99 after Chkaharyer

N402RH said:

The wiring is not the same on the AF-4500 and AF-5600, the advice on checking the pins is not correct for a AF-4500.

Email us the system logs so we can see what happened. The AF-4500 is constantly reading data from the SD card, make sure it is correctly seated in the socket.

Are you running the latest software from our web site?

http://www.advanced-flight-systems.com/Support/AdvancedDeckSupport/AF4000VS80829-MV16-AV40.zip


Rob Hickman
Advanced Flight Systems Inc.

Click to expand...

Rob,

Thank you for the response.

The wiring is not the same on the AF-4500 and AF-5600, the advice on checking the pins is not correct for a AF-4500.

Click to expand...

Copy. Thank you.

Email us the system logs so we can see what happened. The AF-4500 is constantly reading data from the SD card, make sure it is correctly seated in the socket.

Click to expand...

I did check the SD card to ensure it was seated. I will grab the SD card and send you/yours the digital data on it so it can be looked at to diagnose the issue and hopefully come up with a viable solution.

Are you running the latest software from our web site?

Click to expand...

No. But I will do as advised. I received the update you send me in the email. Thank you.

This site is amazing. I sincerely appreciate the outreach and assistance I've received on this issue.

For any of those following this, please know I've received a personal email from Rob Hickman. Very impressive customer service there at AFS. It's Sunday and the President at AFS (Rob) took time to assist. Awesome!

Thanks again everyone.

Charlie