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  #41  
Old 12-04-2020, 02:24 PM
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KatieB KatieB is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Belton, MO
Posts: 1,124
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If you are considering buying a pre-flown RV with any of the glass cockpit systems, especially if you intend to fly IFR, it is SO EASY to ask the seller to take out a few screws and pull out one of the EFIS displays so you can check how the wiring looks. If it's a rat's nest, walk away. If there isn't enough service loop to get the display out enough to undo the connector, that's a major red flag. If it's neat, that's a great start. You don't even have to crawl under the panel.
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Katie Bosman
CFII/A&P
EAA Homebuilt Advisory Council
Rebuilt most of SNF tornado victim RV-3B Tony Boy II (had to sell him, but he's flying!)
RV-9 93281 tail kit has arrived... here I go again!
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  #42  
Old 12-04-2020, 02:59 PM
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wjb wjb is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Half Moon Bay, CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scsmith View Post

In the end, I routed wire bundles for multiple devices together into bigger bundles with a disconnect in each of those big bundles. Those bundles do not have service loops. The wires in each bundle are routed neatly to a common point, assembled into the bundle, and then straight across to the panel with the disconnect plug in it. So I can crawl under the panel and undo 5 big plugs and the panel can then be completely removed. Takes about 10 minutes to take the whole panel out.
This was exactly my philosophy when putting together my panel .. one common connector area for all electrical connections to the panel environment. It takes easily less than 10 mins to pull the panel .. pull 5 connectors and the pitot/static lines and air vent tubes, uncrew, and lift!

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  #43  
Old 12-04-2020, 04:02 PM
PilotjohnS PilotjohnS is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Southwest
Posts: 1,382
Default Garmin sample panel

The thing i dont like about the wiring on the Garminís demo panels are the unsupported connectors. Heavy Connectors should never be left dangling on reL aircraft.
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WARNING! Information presented in this post is my opinion. All users of info have sole responsibility for determining accuracy or suitability for their use.

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Fuselage Kit 98% done
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www.pilotjohnsrv9.blogspot.com
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  #44  
Old 12-04-2020, 04:13 PM
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KatieB KatieB is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PilotjohnS View Post
The thing i dont like about the wiring on the Garmin’s demo panels are the unsupported connectors. Heavy Connectors should never be left dangling on reL aircraft.
Thanks for bringing this up! I know people like to look at the back of Garmin sales kiosks at Oshkosh to see how the "pro's" do it... but they are designed to be a static display only. They are pretty, but not necessarily the right thing to do in an airplane, because of vibration, grounding, etc. Some of them are also designed to come apart for transportation.

Also, the connector idea above is cool, but use caution doing this if you have a CAN bus. Ideally, you wouldn't have any connectors in a CAN bus backbone, but sometimes they are necessary. If you do this, make sure you connect the shields together through the connector and try to minimize the amount of unshielded CAN bus wire going into it.
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Katie Bosman
CFII/A&P
EAA Homebuilt Advisory Council
Rebuilt most of SNF tornado victim RV-3B Tony Boy II (had to sell him, but he's flying!)
RV-9 93281 tail kit has arrived... here I go again!
VAF Dues Paid 2021!

Last edited by KatieB : 12-04-2020 at 04:22 PM.
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  #45  
Old 12-04-2020, 04:18 PM
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FORANE FORANE is offline
 
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Location: East TN
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So what's it cost ballpark to eradicate the rodents?
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  #46  
Old 12-04-2020, 05:30 PM
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rswalden rswalden is offline
 
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Thanks, Vic

My guess is that the original builder didn't even provide an electrical system diagram for that RV-10's wiring mess.

Once, I helped someone install a new EFIS in his airplane...and when I saw the rats nest of spaghetti under the panel with exposed wires wrapped around flight control push rods, we wound up ripping out EVERYTHING and starting over. Think about it... Are you going to trust your life to that wiring while shooting an IFR RNAV to minimums on an approach with your family?

Here's a good tip: SteinAir.com provides an EXCELLENT service for about $500 that gives you a large-scale printout of your avionics wiring diagram. Just tell him what components you have (EFIS, transponder, radios, nav equipment, servos, AHARS, etc) and he'll mail you a professionally designed, pin-for-pin wiring diagram customized for your airplane that will make your wiring decisions easy.

Neatness pays off. When you install or modify your own avionics devices, it's very satisfying to see it work perfectly the FIRST time you flip the switch.
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RV-7A Tip-Up, IO-390, 800+ Hours
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  #47  
Old 12-04-2020, 06:13 PM
RetDALCpt RetDALCpt is offline
 
Join Date: May 2020
Location: Atlanta, GA area
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Can I assume this will be posted in the first update to your book on what to look for in a pre-buy inspection?
BTW, I really enjoyed reading the book!
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  #48  
Old 12-04-2020, 06:22 PM
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1001001 1001001 is offline
 
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Location: Just Minutes from KBVI!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rswalden View Post
Here's a good tip: SteinAir.com provides an EXCELLENT service for about $500 that gives you a large-scale printout of your avionics wiring diagram. Just tell him what components you have (EFIS, transponder, radios, nav equipment, servos, AHARS, etc) and he'll mail you a professionally designed, pin-for-pin wiring diagram customized for your airplane that will make your wiring decisions easy.
Wow, I didn't know that. I think that would easily be worth the money. I want to build and wire my own panel but I have been dreading doing the wiring diagrams. I look at some of the really nice panels our controls engineers design where I work and despair of being able to do that kind of high quality work (at least without spending at least a month solid on things like selecting a wire numbering scheme, color coding, drawing symbol list, etc., etc.

I have gone through several sets of drawing packages for our chemical process plants trying to figure out how to do it (I'm a ChE and can do some controls programming, but I leave the nice electrical detail work to the EEs) and just really would like to build it rather than draw it. I have the proper software to do it, but the time!
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  #49  
Old 12-04-2020, 06:37 PM
kaa kaa is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Boulder, CO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1001001 View Post
Wow, I didn't know that. I think that would easily be worth the money. I want to build and wire my own panel but I have been dreading doing the wiring diagrams. I look at some of the really nice panels our controls engineers design where I work and despair of being able to do that kind of high quality work (at least without spending at least a month solid on things like selecting a wire numbering scheme, color coding, drawing symbol list, etc., etc.
SteinAir does great work, but be sure to know where exactly you want to put your boxes and how long the runs between them should be. I gave them some approximate numbers (bad planning on my part), and it was quite annoying to properly route everything later. Also check the harness before putting it in. It didn't take as long as I had thought it would, and I found an error that would be quite annoying to figure out when everything is installed and bolted in place.
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  #50  
Old 12-04-2020, 06:49 PM
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PaulvS PaulvS is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: Western Australia
Posts: 559
Default Wiring line list data

The electrical wiring 'diagram' that came with my airplane is not a traditional line drawing. It is actually an Excel spreadsheet with a full listing of every line and where it goes 'from' and 'to'. Each 'from' and 'to' connection is simply the plug/switch/connector name and pin number. While I do know how to read and follow lines on an electrical schematic, I've found this Excel database approach to be much easier and flexible and I'm convinced that this is the way to go in the digital age.
And I'm really grateful that the previous owner/builder provided such good documentation, apart from making electrical maintenance much easier, I have also learned a lot from it that I can apply to my RV project!
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