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Towered vs non-towered airports

curtis

Well Known Member
I flew into Jefferson City, MO airport yesterday to visit my son. While I was waiting on him to arrive to pick me up I stuck up a conversation with the young line-service guy. He had already completed his private pilot and was currently working on his commercial rating. The item that sort of set me back was the difference of opinion on controlled vs uncontrolled airports. I told him that out of 550 hours on my RV I have only flew roughly 20 times into towered airports, both Class C and D, where I was controlled (told how to fly), of which 4 of those times I was attending Oshkosh. He on the other hand only liked to fly into controlled airports because he didn?t really have to think about flying since they directed him every step of the way.

I wonder if this is more of the newer younger generation pilot thinking or if this thought process is spread across all age groups and experience levels of pilots. I realize that where some people hangar their aircraft this is not a choice, but to choose a towered vs non-towered airport is an easy choice for me. As someone stated in a post earlier this weekend, landing at different airports and experiencing aviation is the joy of what I like about flying small aircraft. Many of the towered airports are over regulated and if you don?t have a ramp badge you can?t just wander around plus they have tall fences and gates that keep people from experiencing what we all get to. I am in no means scared to go into towered airports, I just choose to avoid them and I don?t feel that I have missed too much by doing so.:cool:

I?m in not trying to change how anyone flies with this post more that it is an observation that I have made where I have a huge difference of opinion. Yes, I do realize what an opinion is liked to and that everyone has one. :D
 
I think you bring up an interesting point. As a former full-time CFI, now an RV-7 driver, and flying corporate aircraft for a living, there are several perceptions and opinions about towers I have observed. My home airport, Aurora State - KUAO which is also home to Van's, just got tower and it opened last month. When I was instructing out of Aurora, I didn't mind not having a tower. It allowed me and my student to do whatever we wanted without having to get a clearance. Maybe we wanted to enter the pattern on a left base and I'd pull the throttle to idle to simulate an engine failure....maybe we'd cross overhead and I'd pull the power. Having a tower still allows this, you just need to dialog more on the radio. I would say my students probably also preferred not having a tower since that is what they were used to. If they did their primary training at a towered airport, I would think that would be there preference too.

Now that I fly corporate jets for a living, I really enjoy having a tower at Aurora. An aircraft can depart IFR, one can be inbound on an approach, and the tower can still release us for departure. Previously, only one IFR departure or arrival could be in the airspace at a time. They also put jets on the other side of the pattern so we don't have to mix with the smaller and slower aircraft. Good for everyone.

When I am out in the RV, I don't really mind either way. So I have to talk to someone...so what. They are just trying to make a living like the rest of us. Some guys at our field were absolutely against a tower being built but I think they were either afraid of talking or just felt it was another government intrusion into their lives. Overall, I think having a tower does improve safety for everyone.
 
I learned to fly at a towered airport that has a pretty large amount of training traffic. In addition, it (KBVI) is staffed by student controllers (supervised, of course) from the Beaver County Community College, so there are a lot of people learning here all the time.

For a while after earning my PPL, I was always more concerned about landing at non-towered airports. This was mainly because things were always very orderly at BVI, and my experience at untowered fields had been iffy--I had had several experiences with other planes not making position calls (planes that certainly had radios) and other things that I considered confusing or potentially dangerous about the way some pilots behave at uncontrolled fields.

Since then, I have become more confident everywhere. And of course, I realize that even in Class D airspace, the primary responsibility lies with the pilot, not the controller, for separation. I think it may depend on what kind of airspace you learned. My early experiences were primarily in a Class D underlying a Class B, so I tend to be more comfortable with talking to controllers than other folks I know who learned "out in the boonies."
 
Interesting.
I am with Michael in regards to landing where needed for the mission.

However, since my home base in a towered field, I find that I really like the way they give you the most expedient path to the ground. Downwind, base entry, straight in, (or sometimes best speed to the numbers :D:D) whatever fits. Listening to ATIS will pretty much tell you how to steer and what you will get before the airport is in sight.

It makes the non-towered VFR 45 entry seem very tedious.

I remember one "best speed" event at home base. As I was getting closer to the field, I could hear a couple of training craft way out near the IAF getting lined up for practice ILSs. Approach said "turn for sequencing". I responded "Arghh!, Roger" (immediately regretted it because it was rude). BUT......, the controller came back and asked if I could do best speed base and 1/2 mile final. Yessir! I was very cordial to him the rest of the way to the hangar! Makes for more interesting approaches. I like that kind of practice.

*EDIT* When weather is involved, I thank goodness that I live at a towered field.
 
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I wonder if this is more of the newer younger generation pilot thinking

I suspect that is a factor.

I will always go for the non-tower airport if there is a choice.


Many of the towered airports are over regulated and if you don?t have a ramp badge you can?t just wander around plus they have tall fences and gates that keep people from experiencing what we all get to. I am in no means scared to go into towered airports, I just choose to avoid them and I don?t feel that I have missed too much by doing so.:cool:

Good analysis.
 
I'm comfortable with either and now live at an uncontrolled grass strip six miles from a Class Charlie and two Class Deltas.

What gets me is that when I learned to fly 30 years ago, everyone would go crazy if they lost an airport to a tower, like what just happened at Aurora State - KUAO. Now, when the FAA talked about shutting down a few towers to save us all money, like they attempted to do a few years back, the pilot community goes crazy.

Go figure.
 
I learned to fly at (BEFA) at Renton field. Renton was towered and I was surrounded by Sea Tac and Boeing field so good radio skills were a must. However with that said I would much rather fly out of non towered airports. Communication skills are also a must at non towered fields and on a regular basis I see pilots not following good radio communication. I still prefer non towered fields and like the multiple options I have vs. a towered location.
 
I don't think it is representative of the next generation, but more along the lines of where the pilot did his/her training at a towered on non-towered field.

I've seen (heard) pilots that will chatter away on the radio at a non-towered field but when it comes to talking to a controller, they get mic fright and flustered.
 
I'm somewhat with Infidel. Some pilots don't really know how to talk at non-towered fields. Others aren't comfortable talking to controllers. I think it is good for students to get comfortable with how to talk both places.

On this same note, some pilots fly long cross country flights without talking to anybody. Often it seems like it is because they are not comfortable with talking to ATC. I like to be "in the system" as much as possible. I almost always file IFR even in severe clear, just so I don't have to worry about restricted areas and so on.

I do realize that some pilots fly for a livi, so when in their RV they don't want to talk to anybody or anything. At is valid too, as long as it's done safely.

If you're not comfortable with talking on the radio in a certain area, I recommend getting someone who is to fly with you and do your next few practice hours there. It will make you a better pilot. (Just a generic comment, not intended for anyone in particular.)
 
I don't think it is representative of the next generation, but more along the lines of where the pilot did his/her training at a towered on non-towered field.

I've seen (heard) pilots that will chatter away on the radio at a non-towered field but when it comes to talking to a controller, they get mic fright and flustered.

I think you are right on the money.
 
I don't know about others, but I can communicate very well with control towers such as my visit with Class D airspace yesterday. The only reason I stopped at Jefferson City yesterday is there was no other airport in the immediate area, so the mission required it. I personally do not have a warm feeling that just because I'm talking to some I feel any safer. I remember earlier this summer while two aircraft were being painted on the radar of a Class C airspace, the fighter was allowed to drive through a Cessna. (There is only preliminary NTSB data on this accident). I don't know all of the particulars of this accident other than it confirms my lack of comfort to talking with someone on the ground will make my flight any safer.

I know that my view point is very controversial and not shared by most. As I stated in my OP, this is only my opinion and I'm not trying to change how anyone navigates the airspace and everyone must do what makes them comfortable.

(Edit; I like the statement in Mike S's signature)
 
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I've spoken to ATC twice since finishing my license in 2002; both times were during flight reviews at towered airports. I only went to towered fields three times during my training. From these five instances it's my experience that ATC will send you from Hilton Head to Savannah by way of Macon because they want to give the RJs first dibs on landing.

I much prefer uncontrolled fields.
 
I prefer non-towered because I fly because I love the freedom of flying vs driving. Driving you have to follow this road, go that fast, and stop and wait at all those stop lights. Flying within the ATC system is a lot like that to me so I enjoy the freedom of being able to make my own choice on which direction I fly and at what speed. Personal preference.
Yes I did learn to fly at a non-towered airport so maybe I am just rationalizing. But in any event, our system allows us the choice and that is the important part that we need to ensure is maintained.
 
Sounds like the young man needs to get more practice at uncontrolled fields.

I learned to fly in and around Tampa Class Bravo airspace, but we made sure to do plenty of practice at non-towered airports as well. The upshot of this that I am perfectly comfortable talking to ATC, and perfectly comfortable at uncontrolled fields as well.

The people that enjoy not having to talk to somebody also sometimes go way out of their way to avoid complex airspace. I have no reservations about calling up and flying right over TPA rather than deviate 30 minutes around their Class Bravo. ATC is a resource, why not be comfortable using it.

Chris
 
I have no reservations about calling up and flying right over TPA rather than deviate 30 minutes around their Class Bravo. ATC is a resource, why not be comfortable using it.

Chris

This is the way I see it. It only helps you get where you're going faster, or allows you to go places you can't get to directly otherwise. The best way to get comfortable with either towered or untowered operations is to go and do it frequently. If you're uncomfortable, bring an instructor or a pilot friend who is comfortable with the situation. Pretty soon you'll be as comfortable as you want to be.
 
Younger generationer here....

I would consider myself in this "younger generation" and certainly a low time pilot. I prefer a towered airport whenever possible. But not for the reason stated by the young man in the OP. It's not that I don't want to "think about flying", it's that I really don't trust the other pilots in the sky to be doing what they're supposed to be doing. I like the comfort of someone I'm in communication with being able to warn me of a silent someone else not being in the place they're supposed to be.

I've done plenty of flying at non-towered fields and they're all fine and dandy. But if I'm going on a cross country somewhere and have the option, I'll choose the towered place. I'm not an instrument pilot, but I always use VFR flight following whenever I can. I learned to fly here at Springdale, Class D, so talking to ATC is just a natural thing.

On a return trip from Oshkosh, I was flying Trutrak's RV12 and landing at a non-towered field for fuel. I made several inbound calls announcing which runway I was planning to use and how I would be entering the pattern for said runway. I had heard one random call from another plane operating at that airport, but each time I attempted to address the traffic, I got no response. As I got about 2-3 miles from the airport, I saw the other plane....using a different runway and flying patterns. I'm very glad I spotted him. Once I had him in sight, I announced in sight and that I would slot in number 2 behind him to use the same runway. Still, never anything said on the radio. Landed without incident and pulled to the pump. The pilot of the other plane came over and apologize.....he had his comm volume turned down all the way.........

That's why I prefer towered airports and controlled airspace. :)
 
Always Learning

Doesn't matter to me whether field has a tower. I'll review runway procedures on AirNav and plan accordingly, but flexible enough to adjust.

Not to lecture the already informed, but for those with some hesitancy about talking to ATC, how about just requesting flight following while proceeding VFR? My experience in the wilds controlled by Joshua Approach around Edwards, and numerous trips to PA is that a short, concise "If able" flight following request always works - or worse case results in a "Stand by" response. Once in radar contact, just let them know when YOU decide to change altitude.

Flight following will track you until airport in sight or you request switch to common. You'll usually be aware of airport traffic in time to adjust your arrival procedures. At towered airports, the flight following controller will inform the tower that you are inbound.
 
I don't have a preference, although I'm based at one of the busiest towered airports around and often wish I could be based at a nice, rural, uncontrolled strip like I see throughout the Midwest. We don't have anything like that near Denver.
 
I am based underneath Class C but all the airports within 75 NM are untowered. A pilot who is uncomfortable with untowered airports will miss all the cool events such as breakfasts and fly-ins in our area.

Joining a scrum of 50-60 aircraft ranging from ultralights to Bonanzas arriving within an hour at one of our local, untowered breakfasts can be interesting! Most pilots are well-versed in standard procedures at these events, but occasionally there is a pilot who is overwhelmed by the swarm. We see this when someone flies across midfield to cut into a line of six aircraft on downwind. An individual who isn't accustomed to being their own ATC and blending with other "non-controlled" aircraft will struggle in such a situation.
 
This has not been addressed (I don't think?)

Many, many towers do NOT have radar capability. I have heard some pilots that prefer towered airports because everyone is under "positive control". Of course, this is a false sense of security. Many towers only know where aircraft are located by what the pilots report. As we know, position reporting is sometimes very inaccurate.

When I lived in Albuquerque, based at Double Eagle, we did the Santa Fe breakfast run, frequently. Santa Fe was towered, but no radar, and reasonably busy, at times. What a cluster! The terrain kept everything pretty tight and aircraft would appear from the weirdest places!

Best advice, tower or non-towered, keep everyone in the airplane looking for other traffic.

R.
 
I don't have a preference, although I'm based at one of the busiest towered airports around and often wish I could be based at a nice, rural, uncontrolled strip like I see throughout the Midwest. We don't have anything like that near Denver.

I visited Denver this past spring and used Erie as my base. I didn't have to talk to anyone and it was a nice airport and the traffic was manageable. Not much on your side of town though.
 
Class C for training

I'm really glad to have trained at class C KBTR (Baton Rouge) because radio communications was the most intimidating part of flying to me, and it helped me get over the fear of talking and to learn the vocabulary and shorthand controllers use. There are usually lots of non-tower airports around to learn to fly in that environment.

I'm sure I'd have had a much harder time getting the IFR rating had I not trained for the private at a Class C airport. That said, I would happily base my plane at a non-tower airport now, and I really enjoy landing at those little aerodromes on cross countries. The GPS data bases are sooo nice for airport info in flight when you want or need to make an unscheduled stop. John
 
When did it become "towered" and "non-towered?" What happened to "controlled" and "uncontrolled?" What did I miss?
 
I am a relatively new pilot (got my PP in June) and have 70ish hours and learned to fly at a towered field in close proximity to a Class C (airspace starts 2 miles NW) and I am glad I did my primary training with the tower. It isn't because I feel anymore comfortable with or without the tower and I agree with the other posts on here in the fact that I like to fly whatever is feasibly closest to my destination. My experience with my local field did allow me to get a lot more comfortable talking with ATC and not just the local controllers but the approach controllers as well.
 
When did it become "towered" and "non-towered?" What happened to "controlled" and "uncontrolled?" What did I miss?

The FAA changed their terminology several years ago...seems they didn't like the implications of "uncontrolled" airports in the news media.
 
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I finished my PPL in August with approximately 50 hours. Of that I would say half was at a towered and the other half at non-towered airports. I guess I am lucky learning where I did: the planes and aero club were at KHMN (Holloman AFB) and Alamogordo-White Sands Regional (KALM) is 10 miles away; which is where we did most of our practice manoeuvres as to stay away from the military operations. Aside from a Class-B I am equally comfortable at either towered or non-towered airports.
 
I visited Denver this past spring and used Erie as my base. I didn't have to talk to anyone and it was a nice airport and the traffic was manageable. Not much on your side of town though.

Erie and Longmont are both nice airports but aside from being far across town from me, they sit in a very busy airspace corridor between Rocky Mountain (KBJC) and Fort Collins (KFNL). During the summer it's a madhouse up there with glider towing, skydiving, flight training and a lot of NRDO pilots. I've had two near misses while living in the Denver area and they've both been in that corridor.

My son goes to school in Greeley and KGXY is a wonderful airport. I fly up there to see him from time to time and it's always been relaxing and a lot of fun to fly up there. I'd love to be based at a field like that.
 
I questioned myself on terminology based upon a couple of post and had to go do some research. I have copied below what is in the Pilot's Handbook of Aeronautical Knowledge, chapter 13, page 13-1;

There are two types of airports—towered and nontowered

I made a mistake by putting a hyphen in "nontowered", This is the good thing about VAF and how it keeps people honest and the data within it correct.
 
The FAA changed their terminology several years ago...seems they didn't like the implications of "uncontrolled" airports in the news media.

It is like "Pilot License/Pilot Certificate" corrections. We know what is implied.

I made a mistake by putting a hyphen in "nontowered", This is the good thing about VAF and how it keeps people honest and the data within it correct.

This maybe a reason why people shy away from towered airports (and talking on the radio) since terminology keeps changing and, unless you fly regularly into a towered airport, there is the fear of getting something wrong.
 
Help

Ive always had the attitude that the people in the tower were getting payed big bucks to help you.SO a few years ago I decided to fly to Atl-Hartsfield (jackson) so I could put it in my log book it was a great experince and the FBO only charged me $85 for the pleasure.Just got to say the controllers were the best.
Bob
 
This maybe a reason why people shy away from towered airports (and talking on the radio) since terminology keeps changing and, unless you fly regularly into a towered airport, there is the fear of getting something wrong.

Doubt it. The only big changes in phraseology I recall occurring over the past 30 years is airspace classification (ie TCA to Class B, etc) and the change from "taxi into position and hold" to "line up and wait".

FWIW, I'm in the go where my mission takes me crowd. I don't care one bit whether it's towered or not. These days all I really look at is what the AVGAS prices are and make decisions based solely on that.
 
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I don't care if it's towered or nontowered...

But when they get a reputation for being out of control I stay far far away.

You know the ones... no one uses radio calls, or speaks in what you might call English.
 
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