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GNS 430W Terrain Data Card Update crashes flygarmin app

mikelupo

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I regularly update my databases. This time, when I was prompted for the Terrain data card, as soon as I insert it into the Garmin reader, the flygarmin software crashed. Tried this on two difference macs and a PC. The flygarmin app on the PC does not crash, but it never sees the data card either.

During this update cycle, the Nav data card updated just fine so I know the reader is working.

I conclude that the Terrain data card is corrupt b/c when I install it back into the 430W, it won't start up and instead displays an integrity error. If I remove the Terrain data card, the 430W starts up fine and seems usable (Whew! I didn't brick it).

I said all that to ask:
Does anyone have any experience with this problem and what did you do to resolve it??


Thanks
Mike
 
IIRC the terrain card uses a different reader / writer than the NAV Data card uses. Check with a local Garmin dealer and they can verify.


:cool:
 
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I have been updating both nav and terrain with the same reader for quite a long time. I’d be surprised if the Garmin dealer says anything different. I’ll be calling them when they open.
 
Having the same problem

Did you get a resolution to this problem? I started having the same problem with the terrain card. As soon as the reader recognizes the card, the flyGarmin app crashes on my Mac. Successfully used the same card and reader for the last update just last month (to the post above about being a different reader/programmer, it always worked before until this latest update). I am guessing something is corrupt somewhere, either in this months update or an update to the flyGarmin app update.
 
Same Integrity Error

After messing around with it for a while, and trying the old method referenced on Garmin's website (Garmin Express? Didn't seem to work or find my reader/card at all, deleted it). I put the card back in the 400w, and am presented with this

IMG_6838.jpg

What was supposed to be a quick monthly update has now turned into a bricked Terrain/Obstacle card :mad::mad:

Guess I'll have to contact Garmin support tomorrow
 
Garmin Support

Contacted Garmin Support, which was not supportive at all.

Basically said it's a "certified" card and that my only option is to contact a Garmin dealer, let them look at it, and they would determine whether it was something that was "covered" or not, and he had no guidance on whether there would be a charge for that or a charge to have it replaced or fixed.

I asked if there was any way to prevent this from happening in the future when doing updates, he said don't do multiple updates at once (which you can't do anyway from what I can tell using the flyGarmin website and the flyGarmin app).

Also said there is no way to reformat the card, and that if it happened again while "under warranty" (presuming I bought a new card I guess?) then maybe Garmin would cover it if it was determined to be a software issue. He also said they have never seen this on a 400w, but I don't think the cards are any different, and the problem happened when the flyGarmin app crashed when inserting the terrain card.

Needless to say, all very frustrating, since now I have to run around town to a Garmin dealer and hope for the best, and my GPS is reduced functionality for the flight I wanted to make this week. All this because there was an Obstacle update, I should have just left it alone. :mad::mad::mad::mad:
 
I have never updated a terrain card in my 430W. didn't know it had obstacles on it either. interesting thread.
 
I am in exactly the same predicament than mikelupo and untainted123. Same circumstances and same response from Garmin today. Is it really our cards or is it Garmin screw up? Quite a coincidence.

Michel
 
Garmin, I love ya, but...

If you search online, several threads have popped up on other forums with the exact same issue, and all of them are rather recent.

I suspect it's a software issue, after some digging it looks like it crashes in some code here: /Users/janssen/Workspace/avdb.app.mac/core/libs/USB/mac/USB_AvtnNandDataCard.cpp Line: 122 (would love to ask Jeremiah Janssen at Digital Cyclone/Garmin what that line of code says)

Running the (older) manual update method (the one with the exe you download and point at your card reader, on Windows), it crashes at the equivalent place in Windows, since the error message points to the same code in Jeremiah's workspace (I am sure they share libraries and code between the versions).

After the flyGarmin app crashed the first time, my card was useless, for updating and in the unit, and not just no data in the unit, the unit won't even complete booting up without crashing, like the picture in my post above. I suspect that some data on the card is corrupted during the reading of the card to check the serial number and which card it is.

I get that these are old technology, and I am thankful Garmin still supports them with updates, but if you essentially have to buy a new card every year just to have it in warranty if the software trashes it, that just adds to the cost of keeping it updated. Also, I really feel like a little bit of software developer time spent on this problem could problem fix it from happening again, and resurrect our cards, but that is just wishful thinking for all of us still stuck in the late 90's. :(
 
Not Just Terrain Card Problem

I have never updated a terrain card in my 430W. didn't know it had obstacles on it either. interesting thread.

If you search around, it appears the same problem can happen to the NavData card, but apparently isn't nearly as common, and may just be coincidence (ie, the NavData card for those users really had gone bad).

My guess is that we don't see a lot more errors with Terrain card updates is because my impression is that most people are like you, and don't ever update their terrain and obstacle data. I updated mine because I paid for the package subscription, and the obstacle data is updated every 56 days, so why not? Well, now I know why not...:mad:
 
We had the same error message several years back caused by a terrain data card that failed. New card fixed the problem.
 
Software Bug?

We had the same error message several years back caused by a terrain data card that failed. New card fixed the problem.

I am sure a new $250 card would "fix" the issue, Garmin said as much; I just have a hard time believing the card that was working just fine in my unit 10 minutes before I pulled it and put it in my reader to update, completely, irrevocably died, after the flyGarmin app crashes and gives me error messages. No integrity checks, or the ability to attempt a reformat, or force a write, or anything?

Additionally, this all happened before the actual update even began. The app crashed immediately upon me inserting my card into the reader: the app flashed that is saw it, then crashed, then no more card.

I get that my card is old, more than 10 years, so mine probably really is dead, but there is no way to know, and the circumstances are suspicious. Mousse's card however is only 18 months old, and they're in the same boat, which either means the cards are very unreliable, or there is something more going on.

I can deal with unreliable cards, I don't trust any external storage (usb, sd, cd, etc). If I am going to use it, I always reformat them to check all bits, and write my data, and keep it backed up somewhere else. In this case, Garmin says once it's hosed (bad card? bad write? corruption from bit drift? who knows?), you just have to buy a $250 attempt to try again. That is gonna add up real quick.

If it really is a hardware limitation of that gen of technology that it can't be formatted or overwritten or resurrected, I get it, it's old, I would just like to know. But it burns knowing that is almost certainly not the case, since obviously you can update it. In addition, the Garmin support was not even a little bit sympathetic (my feelings! :eek:), and had no interest at all in the error message details, nor the circumstances of how it happened. As a software developer, that annoys me, cause I have reproducible steps and a line number in code to debug, could we even pass that along to someone somewhere? :p I mean, how do they even ever figure out they have bugs anyway if there isn't a way for the end user to report them?
 
Interesting tidbit

I asked if there was any way to prevent this from happening in the future when doing updates, he said don't do multiple updates at once (which you can't do anyway from what I can tell using the flyGarmin website and the flyGarmin app).

I think I understand what he was saying, maybe.

I updated both of my cards today, using the Garmin reader. There appears to be a change to the procedure. Previously, you opened the card-programming app *once* to program *two cards in a row*. Now you have to open the app *two separate times,* programming one card each time.

Perhaps this is their way to fix whatever screwed up code torched your card. Who knows.

The cards, and Garmin's pricing and policies around them, are a definite pain point with the 400-500 series boxes.
 
GNS Database Updates

I apologize for the late response here, I went in to do some digging on the database update issues reported here with the GNS data cards.

We recently updated the website to prevent users from updating both cards at one time. This was in an effort to prevent the chance for GNS cards to be corrupted. If you have the fly.Garmin Desktop app, which was taken off of our website, it is still possible to update both the Navigation and Terrain card at one time. Please remove the fly.Garmin Desktop app and install the fly.Garmin for Windows or fly.Garmin for Mac apps as appropriate from fly.garmin.com. This should prevent the possibility of future corruption. If your card is corrupted, then please call Garmin’s Pilot Operations help line at 866-739-5687 to discuss your options, and we can work with you to correct the problem. They are often quite busy, it is best to try and call first thing in the morning to avoid a sometimes lengthy wait time. There is also a call back option which is convenient, to avoid extended periods of being placed on hold in the call queue.

Thanks,

Justin
 
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