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New Catto 3 Blade Installed

KentuckyMike

Well Known Member
Yippee!!!

My new 3 blade arrived yesterday via FedX to my home. I should have shipped it to the airport. The driver thought it was a windmill. Well I guess it sort of is. I had to drop the top on the Audi to transport it to the airport.

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Before Picture with the Sensenich metal prop.

Before.jpg


After

After.jpg


The prop is truly a work of art. Kudos to Craig Catto.

I haven't had time to get speed/rpm changes but it is definitely smoother and quieter.
 
what a difference! :eek:

Wow, great looking and amazing performance.

Let us know the change in numbers and vibrations?

Congrats,

Scott
 
Don't forget to file your major change with the FAA...........................

Back into phase 1.
 
Not a major change

According to my Operating Limitations paragraph 19, fixed pitch to fixed pitch requires no paper work to anyone. Only a logbook entry before and after return to Phase 1 for 5 hours.
 
Report Back

I will also be using an o-360-A1A and am undecided on the propellor. I would be very interested in a report on the difference in TAS and vibration.

Thanks.
 
A thread deviation

I noticed that you have front end cowl straps/split covers like I do on our RV-6A. If you dimple the screw holes in the metal, countersink the cowl and use stainless steel flathead screws it works very well.

Bob Axsom
 
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I see you got the rain edges on your prop. He started doing those after I received my two blade. Where do you keep your plane - the grass strip in Vine Grove?
 
Nickel Edges

Yes Mike I did opt to get the nickel leading edges. It wraps around both sides about 3/4 to 1 inch and obviously is painted black on the back side like the rest of the blade. No rpm restrictions in the rain with the nickel edges.

Yes I am at Vine Grove, KY 70KY just south of Fort Knox, KY.

We are having a Young Eagles event this Saturday(9/17) 9 AM-Noon and a cookout beginning at 1PM on Sunday (9/18). Stop by and visit.
 
Do you like it

Have you had a chance to do some testing? Do you like it? And how did it change your plane?
I have one on order that will be shipped next week.
 
I wish I had the stainless leading edge.

Even with prop guard, the outer 3 inches of blade area gets pounded flying through rain. Just the other day I sanded that area down and painted it with West epoxy. Flew through some rain since and it seems to be holding up better than the paint did.

I may ground the airplane and send the prop back to California for the stainless upgrade. Have to check to see if that is doable.
 
I wish I had the stainless leading edge.

Even with prop guard, the outer 3 inches of blade area gets pounded flying through rain. Just the other day I sanded that area down and painted it with West epoxy. Flew through some rain since and it seems to be holding up better than the paint did.

I may ground the airplane and send the prop back to California for the stainless upgrade. Have to check to see if that is doable.

Let us know what you find out. Especially what Craig's estimate is of how long it will take.
 
I wish I had the stainless leading edge.

Even with prop guard, the outer 3 inches of blade area gets pounded flying through rain. Just the other day I sanded that area down and painted it with West epoxy. Flew through some rain since and it seems to be holding up better than the paint did.

I may ground the airplane and send the prop back to California for the stainless upgrade. Have to check to see if that is doable.

Have you (or anyone else) tried the propguard tape? I wonder if that is an adequate solution.
 
I'm curious about the spinner. Changing from 2-blade to 3-blade usually involves a handful of downtime while you fit the spinner to the prop and to the cowling. Is that the way it was, or did you prepare the spinner while Catto was making the prop?

Regardless, it looks like a good fit and a good match with the paint.

Thanks, Bob K.
 
I'm curious about the spinner. Changing from 2-blade to 3-blade usually involves a handful of downtime while you fit the spinner to the prop and to the cowling. Is that the way it was, or did you prepare the spinner while Catto was making the prop?

Regardless, it looks like a good fit and a good match with the paint.

Thanks, Bob K.

Craig does the spinner for you, you just have to do the backing plate. I have 10 hours on it on my 4 and my dad got one for his Pitts and we are very happy, I got mine in a little over a month. Excellent guy to deal with! Mark
 
A friend had Craig make up a nice 3-blade unit for his O-360-A1A-powered GlaStar floatplane. He reported that it worked like a charm, great takeoff thrust, and very smooth. It also had the nickel leading edges. You'll no doubt note that I used the past tense when speaking of the nickel leading edges. One of them parted company with the prop on climbout and pieces of it were embedded in the top side of the float. A hasty landing was made with no further harm done.

BUT... the prop owner was quick to point out that Craig was absolutely fantastic to deal with and busted his backside (and I'm sure several propeller production records) to make things right. There's no piece of hardware that's perfect. What really counts is how well a manufacturer recovers once they have stumbled. This is one instance where the manufacturer's response more than made up for the failure of their product.
 
I love the prop!

My new 3-blade is a 68" diameter by 73 pitch.
The static rpm was 2150 which I thought might be low but according to Craig it is fairly normal. At 7500 feet and 75% power the rpm was at 2650. I did a triangular course and the speed averaged at 205 mph.

The prop is noticeably quieter and smoother and I guess due to the mass doesn't shake as much during start-up and shutdown.

As for the spinner I just ordered it from Catto and all I had to do was the mounting plates. He cut the blade holes and they were perfect. Sort of a helical cut which eliminated the need for fillets. I was repainting the wheel pants and gear leg fairings so adding the spinner was not much additional work.

The edge guard is actually a nickel coating and Craig is and can install it on props shipped without it.

Overall I could not be happier with the prop and dealing with Craig.
 
My new 3-blade is a 68" diameter by 73 pitch.
The static rpm was 2150 which I thought might be low but according to Craig it is fairly normal. At 7500 feet and 75% power the rpm was at 2650. I did a triangular course and the speed averaged at 205 mph.

The prop is noticeably quieter and smoother and I guess due to the mass doesn't shake as much during start-up and shutdown.

As for the spinner I just ordered it from Catto and all I had to do was the mounting plates. He cut the blade holes and they were perfect. Sort of a helical cut which eliminated the need for fillets. I was repainting the wheel pants and gear leg fairings so adding the spinner was not much additional work.

The edge guard is actually a nickel coating and Craig is and can install it on props shipped without it.

Overall I could not be happier with the prop and dealing with Craig.

How is climb rate compared to the two blade?
How does cruise speed compare to the two blade?
Am I reading correct that this prop is smoother in cruise than the two blade?

Thanks for the feedback.
 
Prop Differences

How is climb rate compared to the two blade?
How does cruise speed compare to the two blade?
Am I reading correct that this prop is smoother in cruise than the two blade?

Thanks for the feedback.

Robert,

The climb was so good with both that I cant tell a real difference even though there may be one. What I do notice is the response seems quicker which I guess is related to mass and weight.

The cruise is a bit faster/better. I am getting a few more rpm's than I did with the metal 2 blade.

I had my metal prop balanced but I think the Catto 3 is smoother than the other prop without balancing.

I think it also looks pretty neat but that alone can't justify the cost. :eek:
 
Installation questions.

Mike,

Would you be able to share what route you took in regards to the prop extension, spacer, and crush plate? Did you have any CG issues with your change?

I'm within a day or two of ordering the prop from Craig and wanted to know if there are any major gotchas with the install. My searches here have come up with all kinds of comments, and just curious what you did. If you have the time, please post here or PM. Thanks.
 
Prop Spacer

Jeff,

The installation did require that I use a new spacer. I did as Craig suggested and called Saber Manufacturing in Texas (http://www.sabermfg.com/index.htm)

Jim knew exactly what I needed. His new spacers are really awesome. My new spacer due to needing a four inch one was the spool type and required two sets of bolts instead of the super long ones as before. He also provided a new crush plate. I got everything from Saber that Craig did not provide.

As for the CG, it did move and I just decided to go with minimum baggage limits. You could get a heavier crush plate from Saber to compensate for the lighter Catto prop. You might want to run some W&B numbers with the different prop weights you are considering to see where the CG moves to and from.

No major gotchas. It was a very simple install and as posted earlier, I purchased a new spinner from Craig and let him cut the prop slots. He does a great job of cutting them and since they are cut sort of helical it does not require the fillets my two blade did. Look at my before and after pictures and notice the difference in the size of the blade slots on the spinner. The prop has a much smaller profile at the spinner and neater looking I thought. The spinner sort of twist in to get to the proper position and eliminates the need for the filler fillets behind.
 
Catto retrofit leading edge....

Let us know what you find out. Especially what Craig's estimate is of how long it will take.

From Mr. Catto

We can only do retrofits to newer blades, only if your prop label says
Carbon/Glass.... and not just Glass.

Cost is $750 for the 3 bladed retrofit.

Regards,
Craig Catto


No mention of turn time.
 
Wait Time

How long did Craig take to do your prop, I have now been waiting 16 months as of yesterday. I ordered the prop May 28, 2010. I have talked with him 3 times, each time he said it was in Que and would take 10 weeks.


Lyle Clarkson
RV-9A Finish
 
Yeah, join the club

Mine was ordered 16 months ago, and I'm told (again) it's being built and will be done in another 3-4 weeks. It's at least 9 months overdue to my original requested date.

Dwight
 
You guys are making me worry now.

Talked to Craig about 3 weeks ago and he said about 5-6 weeks lead time.

Is your setup different then a standard setup? I'm hanging it on a IO-360 192hp... Pretty standard I think.
 
I'm in the same boat.

You guys are making me worry now.

Talked to Craig about 3 weeks ago and he said about 5-6 weeks lead time.

Is your setup different then a standard setup? I'm hanging it on a IO-360 192hp... Pretty standard I think.

RV-8 IO-360 180HP 68"x75" 3-blade. Sent payment last Thursday and was told they were cutting the props this week, and to expect an 8-week lead-time. Got an e-mail from their accounting deptartment just today confirming payment had been received and was told the prop was already "in production". Keeping my fingers crossed.....
 
5 weeks

Ordered 5 weeks ago and they sent me shipping confirmation today. 68x75 three blade. Great customer service the whole way through.:):)
 
You guys are making me worry now.

Talked to Craig about 3 weeks ago and he said about 5-6 weeks lead time.

Is your setup different then a standard setup? I'm hanging it on a IO-360 192hp... Pretty standard I think.

I think this is par for the course. Craig is a pretty busy guy and I got the same "x weeks" lead time for about a year. When I really needed the prop, I called him and let him know I was getting to the point of "really needing it" and he came through. It was the same thing with a friend of mine. I think that's just how Craig operates, and I really can't blame him in this economy. Just let Craig know when you "really" need it, and he'll come through for you.
 
I think that's just how Craig operates, and I really can't blame him in this economy. Just let Craig know when you "really" need it, and he'll come through for you.
That may well be how he operates but it certainly doesn't motivate me to want to do business with him.

From what I'm reading here, it seems like the only way to deal with him is to place your order and tell him that you needed the prop yesterday and can't proceed any further with your project until the prop arrives. If I ever decide to give him my business, that will most certainly be what I tell him.
 
Depends

No, mine was a customer order. But he's been promising it for 9 months. I told him I really needed it 8 months ago. Still nothing. Told it's finally in this batch of production, believe it when I see it.
 
Christmas came early

Six weeks and a day since ordering and sending payment, the prop has arrived. It's simply amazing.....

photo19qo.jpg
 
Catto Prop Opinion

I purchased a 3 blade prop from Craig over a year ago. My impression of Craig was that he was very busy, but very knowledgeable and eager to get my business. I believe it took about 6 weeks to finish my prop and Craig agreed to meet me at a local airport and did the install himself. The prop looked fantastic but did not perform as I had hoped. Takeoff RPM was too low and and Red Lined at 2600 RPM. I felt the issue was more on me than Craig I talked him out of giving me the prop he initially recommended (based on my HP) in hopes of getting more top end speed. Craig without hesitation offered to give me the prop I needed and let me fly the current until it was ready. When the second prop was ready he had his son drive 4 hours one way to my airport and install it.......No extra charge whatsoever! The new prop is exactly what I wanted (performance and looks). People like Craig are hard to find especially in the aviation industry I would not hesitate to buy from Craig again and would recomend him in a heartbeat.
 
Catto prop pitch

The prop looked fantastic but did not perform as I had hoped. Takeoff RPM was too low and and Red Lined at 2600 RPM. I felt the issue was more on me than Craig I talked him out of giving me the prop he initially recommended (based on my HP) in hopes of getting more top end speed.

What engine do you have and what prop specs were on the first prop and then the second prop?

I have a IO360-A1B6 200hp. The data tag says 68 x 74. at low altitude I am getting about 185kt at 2830rpm. climb rpm is about 2300. Take off and climb performance are great, but I'm looking for just a few more kts in the cruise. ~165 @ 8000 da. I think I want to pitch just a smidge higher. any thoughts?
 
My 2005 vintage Catto 3 blade (66x76) is rated to 3200 rpm -- and I believe the newer carbon fiber units are as well. It will say on the hub tag.

I know two locals here in Prescott, AZ who run them on their Pitts Reno racers at VERY high rpms--and have for years.

Craig is a very talented craftsman---and a nice guy!!

Cheers,

db
 
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I purchased a 3 blade prop from Craig over a year ago. My impression of Craig was that he was very busy, but very knowledgeable and eager to get my business. I believe it took about 6 weeks to finish my prop and Craig agreed to meet me at a local airport and did the install himself. The prop looked fantastic but did not perform as I had hoped. Takeoff RPM was too low and and Red Lined at 2600 RPM. I felt the issue was more on me than Craig I talked him out of giving me the prop he initially recommended (based on my HP) in hopes of getting more top end speed. Craig without hesitation offered to give me the prop I needed and let me fly the current until it was ready. When the second prop was ready he had his son drive 4 hours one way to my airport and install it.......No extra charge whatsoever! The new prop is exactly what I wanted (performance and looks). People like Craig are hard to find especially in the aviation industry I would not hesitate to buy from Craig again and would recomend him in a heartbeat.
See now this is what makes the guy such an enigma. That he takes orders and money for them and then ignores multiple delivery deadlines and emails/phone calls is so unacceptable that there are no words to accurately describe it. But then he does stuff like this and once again I'm thinking maybe he's worth the gamble.

He obviously cares. So why can't he learn to be honest with his customers and tell them he just won't be able to deliver them a prop for the next xx months? Why lie like he obviously does with some folks? Its like he's a Jeckll and Hyde. One guy will bend over backward for you and go above and beyond. The other will take your money, pretend your order never happened and ignore you calls.

I guess buying from him comes down to having ask yourself 'do you feel lucky punk? Well do ya?'
 
Six weeks and a day since ordering and sending payment, the prop has arrived. It's simply amazing.....

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Having my coffee with the wife.

I see this prop and let out the "ohhh, now that thing is beautiful!"

She looks over and rolls her eyes? I simple state, "now you see how I feel about going to the jewelry store!"

She all of a sudden says, "as long as you like it, thats all that counts":rolleyes:
 
You are a lucky man--she is a "keeper"!! (Both the prop and the understanding wife!)

Cheers,

db
 
CG

I'm trying to decide between a Catto 2 blade or Sensenich metal for my RV7. I like smooth but want no CG issues...what say you??
Thanks!
 
My 2005 vintage Catto 3 blade (66x76) is rated to 3200 rpm -- and I believe the newer carbon fiber units are as well. It will say on the hub tag.

I know two locals here in Prescott, AZ who run them on their Pitts Reno racers at VERY high rpms--and have for years.

Craig is a very talented craftsman---and a nice guy!!

Cheers,

db

I have the same prop, vintage Sept 2005.
Design rpm = 2800.
Red line rpm = 3200.
 
EXCELENT SERVICE!!!!!!!1

Craig built two propellers and worked with us on testing and modifying them to our exact needs. This entire process was approximately three to four weeks. Craig is one of the most accommodating, gracious and sincere people you will ever meet and he always goes the extra mile for his customers. Regards, Allan:D
 
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