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Igniting the Spark

it is there or not

I have always had the "spark". My mother relates how i wanted a "flyer's license" when I was a kid. No one else in the family had any interest. Got my PPL at 36 years old.

I am married to a wonderful girl whose father is career aviation maintenance in the navy. Loves everything aviation but never had money to get license.

His oldest son, took a few lessons then dropped. His youngest daughter, my wife, actually made it all the way though PPL but dropped after a short time. My daughter soloed but never wanted to do book work.

The "spark" just wasn't there. I notice even today that I always look up and my wife never does.

I think it is a personality trait (flaw?). Challenge, seeks novelty, curiosity, analytical are the defining characteristics of potential pilots.

The world is changing, more regulation and more cost with less freedom to experience simple flight for the sake of fun will be difficult to overcome.

BUT... there will always be a few who can not not fly.
 
Too many easier choices?

When I look at the number of motor toys people have it makes me wonder. Anyone can ride a quad or a jet ski. Flyin' is hard. Like math. Too much to learn. Pilots who learned in the 50's & 60's had it easier. Cheap & seemingly less difficult. I've known ranchers that brought home cubs in the old days and taught themselves on a 2 track using the 10 page Piper owners manual.
I actually think a big part is airports and accessability. Little municipals & grass strips have disappeared. Airports keep moving further out, get bigger, and now are all locked down. We've slowly distanced general aviation activity from the public.
Another issue is social separation. As the average plane and it's upkeep get more expensive, the average owner has more money also. This distances the normal working guy. The rural crowd is much more accepting of GA than urbanites. Rurals still see flying as a somewhat common activity and accept that it has practical uses. They also mix rich & poor more readily. Urbanites on the other hand see it as something only for rich guys and playboys. Why? Because an average income country boy can own and fly much easier than the average urbanite. As the population shifted to the cities, the attitudes shifted with them.
Summary: Airplanes need to be cheap, easy to fly, easy to keep, easy to get to, and have more utility. By more utility I mean something to do at the destination other than spend all your money trying to get off an airport that's 15 miles from town.
Y'know the camping movement and the birth of motels was born from the automobile and modern roads with advocates like Henry Ford (remember kingsford charcoal). Is it possible to do similar with GA?
 
Young eagles works, or at least a version did for me

When I was 10 (in 1980), some guy volunteered to take our Cub Scout troup up in his 172. I won the right seat for our group, and I was hooked the moment we lifted off.

Unlike many here, I only built a few models, mostly snap-together with bottle rockets to propel them upwards before exploding, then snap back together and do it again. But the spark turned in to a spot at the Air Force Academy. Unfortunately, a shoulder dislocation 3 weeks before starting Basic Cadet Training ended that dream. Cutbacks in pilot slots meant ROTC wasn't a good option, and I wasn't going to go through the whole application process again, so I moved on.

Fast forward 15 or so years, with a bit more disposable income, much to my wife's surprise, I announced I was going to get my pilot's license. Despite an engine failure as a solo student that resulted in an upside down 150 in a muddy field, I got my PPL, then started building an RV.

I've flown about 12 Young Eagles so far, including one today. To me, that is the least I can do to repay that original favor.

After her first ever flight, one 13 year girl told me in no uncertain terms she was going to be a fighter pilot. Maybe she will, or maybe she'll just get her PPL in 20 years or so...
 
It is not about seeing how many kids YE can fly, it should be about mentoring kids that want to fly.

In terms of lighting the pilot spark, I agree, but.....

Flying 75 kids on a Sat afternoon is not the way to do it....

.....I've found a big Young Eagles Day offers dividends well beyond making new pilots.

For example, like many small airports 08A is under constant pressure from the industrial park and residential development types. Our airport support group has taken to setting up a table at YE events and inviting parents to join.....and they do. For them the YE event is very positive introduction to their airport, and from that day onward they defend it.

Consider the kid who had a very good time in the back seat on a YE flight, but leaves the airport with no pilot spark at all. Ok, it was a carnival ride of sorts but he or she had a positive experience. Fast forward a few years. Now that kid is a voting citizen, or (equally important) the young spouse of someone who wants a pilot's license. The positive experience they had long ago at the airport sets their viewpoint as adults, and let's face it, we cannot long continue our pilot activities without airports and supporting spouses.

Just two examples, but you get the idea. Let's keep flying those kids.
 
One small step for man...one giant leap for mankind

If I had to point to one thing ...that would be it...lunar lander mockup cockpit made out of boxes in the basement...switches paper instruments and all. That was fun! (12 years old)
Next...national geographic with the 1-26 on the cover? Delivered papers...got my glider ticket.
Worked on a dairy farm...that paid for my PPL...
**** ...fuel crisis 1974. Line ups at pumps OPEC...decided that the Airline transport ticket might not be wise....off to university to learn how to design em instead.
1980. Lucky me...DASH-X program starting at DeHavilland...turned into the Dash-8 while I was there...
1984...stupid me....found the post design paperwork realllllly boring..switched to the newly minted PC industry.
Fast forward 2006....tail kit of my RV8 arrives.
Fast forward to this week.... It's first flight time!!!

Only this time, the cockpit isn't made out of boxes.

What a ride!

Chris
 
Spark

My Dad sparked the interest in me for aviation. He was a WWII pilot, built models, would point out airplanes flying around our house. He worked at Convair 30yrs now Lockeed. I wish there was one B36 still flying.
I would have started flying younger just did not see or have a pathway into aviation.
I got PPL at 38 yrs. Took that long to have the disposable income. Now I have 4315 hours in my log book. I have encourged a dozen people to get their PPL. All adults. Kids do not have the money, but some do have the spark.
 
Ann Can Fly!

[/QUOTE] {Did anyone else ever have a copy of ?Ann Can Fly!? in their house?}
Paul[/QUOTE]

Sure, didn't we all? I wonder how many Cessna 180 kits Monogram sold because of that book? I know they sold me a few! (they sure broke easily!)

Amazingly, I recently saw a copy of that book in the waiting area of a local car dealer, in pristine condition.

George
 
For me there was no spark per se, other than I hve always loved machines that move since I could comrehend them (like 1-2 yrs old). That said, I have always wanted to fly, just like I always wanted to drive. Unfortnately, airplanes were never within my familie's reach financially. I was around them due to my dad being in the Air Force, I just never went up in a small plane. When I was about 24 I got my first ride in a small plane, a Globe Swift. A that point I actually seriously considered getting my liscense, so maybe that was the spark moment, but it was out of consideration financially. I am now mid forties and finally getting it, and plan to build soon.

I don't think the sprk is the issue, though. Relative to all of the other things that one can do, it is just tremendusly expensive. I know several people who have "always wanted to get their liscence", but don' due to financial reasons. One of the big ways this hits is one spouse may want to, and they may even be able to afford it with the right sacrifices, but the other spouse is just not willing to participate in the necessary sacrifices. If you could buy a decent plane for $30k (that isn't 30 years+ old) and rent indoor parking for about $100 a month, I bet there would be MUCH larger participation.

Tim
 
When I look at the number of motor toys people have it makes me wonder. Anyone can ride a quad or a jet ski. Flyin' is hard. Like math. Too much to learn. Pilots who learned in the 50's & 60's had it easier. Cheap & seemingly less difficult. I've known ranchers that brought home cubs in the old days and taught themselves on a 2 track using the 10 page Piper owners manual.
I actually think a big part is airports and accessability. Little municipals & grass strips have disappeared. Airports keep moving further out, get bigger, and now are all locked down. We've slowly distanced general aviation activity from the public.
Another issue is social separation. As the average plane and it's upkeep get more expensive, the average owner has more money also. This distances the normal working guy. The rural crowd is much more accepting of GA than urbanites. Rurals still see flying as a somewhat common activity and accept that it has practical uses. They also mix rich & poor more readily. Urbanites on the other hand see it as something only for rich guys and playboys. Why? Because an average income country boy can own and fly much easier than the average urbanite. As the population shifted to the cities, the attitudes shifted with them.
Summary: Airplanes need to be cheap, easy to fly, easy to keep, easy to get to, and have more utility. By more utility I mean something to do at the destination other than spend all your money trying to get off an airport that's 15 miles from town.
Y'know the camping movement and the birth of motels was born from the automobile and modern roads with advocates like Henry Ford (remember kingsford charcoal). Is it possible to do similar with GA?

While I agree with most everything you say, we can't go back to the 60s, and somehow I don't think most of today's kids would want to, anyway. They are not as attracted to simple and easy as you might think. Even today's cars are far more complicated than they were then. Most kids understand my GPS, maybe better than I do. They all understand the glass panel at a glance, or with a quick explanation. Less expensive is important, but even that isn't always the problem. And they certainly are used to more regulations than we were!

Like others have said, pick those who have the spark (easy to spot) and teach them something. Give them an extra taste. Make them work (that will weed out those who really don't get it) and watch them grow. I KNOW it works; I am doing it. The only thing it takes is time (and maybe a little money.)

Bob
 
Jump seat rides

Like Paul my interest was hard wired at birth. My grandfather learned to fly in 1927 in DH-60 Gypsy Moth at Parafield Adelaide, Australia. He just assumed I would follow suit and I had no intention to disappoint.

A bit over a decade ago, I would invite interested kids to inspect the flight deck on the longer overwater sectors. The line often went back deep into the cabin with the flight deck door wide open. After the same chat 20 or 30 times you would recognise a kid and ask ?haven?t I seen you before?? Other times I would pick a likely candidate before the flight and invite him or her to ride in the jump seat. It was great.

Anyhow, then 9/11 happened and that was the end of that. However many of my current F.O?s tell me that it was just such a cockpit visit that lit the fire of passion in them which defined their future in aviation.

So we can?t do that now. These days I make a point to standing in the galley after the flight and steering youngsters into the flight deck so they can at least see the office. It?s not the same but it?s better than nothing. I do however sometimes see the light come on for some of these kids. :)

We need to never give up. If a kid is hanging about at the airfield. Don't call the cops. Call him / her over and sit them in your seat and point at things. When you see that fire light up it's inspiring.

Gerry in Oz.
 
It started early

I think there is a pattern I'm seeing here. There is a certain fascination that most of us here share from a very early age.

In my case, growing up in the early 80s in Los Angeles, we had plenty of friends who worked at JPL and Edwards so there was always airplane and spaceship talk. My mother now tells me that at age three, I'd read a "New True Book" about airplanes and had tried to hold my arms out in a curved fashion (read camber), ran as fast as I could and started weeping uncontrollably because I couldn't take off no matter how hard I tried. My dad, a mechanical engineer would drive me to El Monte airport and stand with me while I'd peer through the fence and watch airplanes go by.

Then came the balsa models and White Wings - a simple yet elegant set of gliders made of stiff paper and balsa that flew exceptionally well if you built them right.

I'm from India originally. What I recall from the Pan Am days back then was that crossing the Pacific in a big 747 (going from CA to India), at age 5 and 6, I'd spend more time in the cockpit rather than in my seat. The pilots took a great deal of time to explain everything to me and made me feel welcome.

After moving back to India in the late 80s, I spent a lot of time building model airplanes (most never left the ground) but the fascination never went away. Moving back to the US in early 2004, I knew that if I had to get my ticket, now was the time. My dad gifted me some money for my first flying lessons which I ended us using for a flight in a Waco biplane. The spark was always there - everything else hadn't lined up. Finally, in 2008, a colleague who had his PPL and a nice Cherokee 140 took me up for a ride. Everything fell in place. For my 30th birthday that year, I started my lessons and got my PPL in just under a year in 2009.

In the time before getting my first BFR last month, I have introduced flying to several people. Three of them already have their PPL and two more are working on theirs. None are Young Eagles. The way I'm trying to do my part to fight the decline in the pilot population is to work with people that have an interest - maybe one that they had long given up as not possible, one at a time.

I usually find perfect weather days and take people up to enjoy something as gorgeous as sunrise followed by breakfast at a place that would normally be a day trip. This does a couple of things. First, it gives them a spectacular view that very few people ever get to experience. Follow that with the practical aspect of going off to places that would normally be long day or weekend trips in a few hours. Usually, on the way back, I have my guests (if they are still as pumped) to take the controls and make some gentle turns. The final cherry on the pastry is when I have them make a radio call to ATC. I tell them exactly what to say. A lot of non-aviation types I have found, find the piloty words like "roger" and "7-3-Whiskey Tango" very cool and making them part of it all gives them a sense of mentally transcending those ever so common high fences around airports these days. Suddenly, in one morning, with an hour and a half on the Hobbs, I've converted a person from being outsider looking in through a fence, to being a part of the fraternity. Most importantly, it makes them believe that yes, they CAN fly an airplane AND do cool things with it to boot.

I don't charge people for these flights and needless to say, in a rented airplane, it isn't cheap. But I pick people that have potential. They already have to have the spark. Although they are outside the fence, they must at least be looking in. Then, I can hand hold them all the way in.

About regulations: I know many people complain about regulations. I know they're tough. But it could be worse - a lot worse. Whenever I travel overseas, I try and do some flying wherever I go. The most recent was in India. After seeing some of the hoops people have to jump through to enjoy a short flight, and to compare it to the US where we still have the right to fly from coast to coast without as much as a radio, I think we complain too much. I'm not suggesting that we stop jealously guarding the freedoms we have left. What I'm saying is that let's cherish what we have - no other country even comes close to what we have here. Many bemoan TFRs and getting briefings. If I look at this from my own perspective as someone who is a post 9/11 student pilot and a non-citizen at that (yeah - I had to get finger printed to do anything beyond an intro flight and have to do it again for my instrument ticket), I have always known TFRs and have accepted that I will always get a briefing before every flight. It doesn't bother me as much because from my perspective, its always been that way and I know no different. Most non-pilots I talk to are still amazed when I tell them that even in this day and age, I can fly without filing any paperwork or flight plans whatsoever in VFR weather.

I also don't think money is completely to blame. Yes, it does make it expensive but if the desire is there, we find a way. Something else becomes secondary. When iPhones first came out, they were north of $300 a piece yet I found so many people that made $10/hr and worked part time go out and buy them. That is an extreme case but it illustrates the point. Apple made them want it bad enough and they found a way - even if it meant skipping other basic necessities while camping outside an Apple store all night.

I think it is a thorough failure of marketing. We are very good at selling aviation to those like us who don't need selling. We are terrible at selling to those outside. I moved to Milwaukee, WI a month before Airventure and for the size of the event it is, I saw just one TV or other ad for it outside of the aviation literature most of us subscribe to. We have to bring non-pilots in - not just tell each other how cool airplanes are.

Ultimately, we have to find ways to make flying "sexy" again. It has to be about the experience and the possibilities. Oh - and shiny glass panels help!
 
Like most, I've been interested in all things flying since before I can remember. Due to health issues, in particular migraines that affected vision and wiped me out quick time, I knew as a teenager that I would never be able to fly for the military or commercially, so pursued an alternative career path. Study, career, wife, kids, mortgages etc have all conspired to limit my exposure to active flying. But, having outgrown migraines a number of years ago, now with "amost grown" kids, more financially secure, I've taken to both training for PPL (expect first solo within next month or so) and also building an RV-8.

But, referring to Paul's original thread title, Igniting the Spark, I've tried a couple of times to do just that, in my own fashion: several times I've phoned local high schools and offered to let a teacher bring a small group of students (engineering / metalwork / aviation studies or whatever is appropriate) to my workshop and see a "real life practical" application of what they are learning about ... and hopefully expose the students to stuff they might not have otherwise even known about, and perhaps inspire a few members of another generation of aviators and aircraft builders. Sadly, despite a number of calls, leaving messages etc, only one teacher bothered to call me back. And despite initial interest (he himself holds a PPL, but not current), that was the end of it. Somehow it was just all too hard for them to organise. So, for now, I'll focus on flying training, building, and hopefully take another approach at the end of the project, and give rides.
 
One of the biggest reasons I go to airshows/flyins is to pass the torch. Yeah I like talking RVs and aviation with all of you, but the main reason is so I can talk to kids and raise interest.

Perfect example:
I requested to fly into base for the centennial of naval aviation celebration. Prior to my arrival, I made sure that Allie (my purple alien) was ready to go and put her on my back seat. Every time a kid went by and saw the alien, it was exciting for them. It got the conversation going. I probably put over 20 kids in the front seat, answer all their questions and told them one day they could fly too.

I had a 4 year old kid that took off running and got tangled on the ropes. His dad screamed at him not to go near the plane but I talked his dad into letting him inside the plane. Dad took a few pics and told me thanks. When it was time to get the kid out, he told me ?I am about to drive it?. I told him one day he could but he needed to be able to see outside and move all the controls for safety reasons. I picked him up out of the cockpit and he threw his arms and legs out and started ?flying?. Apparently it must have been an interesting exchange between the kid and I because we had an audience.

My wife and I don?t have kids. And I don?t know how powerful of an experience that was for the kid (it was for me). But I can tell you that every single time I do that, my mind goes straight to my childhood and the root of my aviation passion.

Pass it along. Aviation is a form of expression that everyone should experience at least once in their lifetime. Some of us are lucky enough that we can do it for a living.

IMG_1631.JPG
 
I got a YE 'Spark' Story for you...

My mom was in the Army stationed at McDill in Tampa during WWII. She married an Army Air Corpsman right at the end of the war and the two of them owned a Waco YOC like the one Jeff Skiles flew at OSH this year. Man I wish she had kept that plane... anyway, she got her pilots license shortly afterwards. She used to leave me little notes with airplanes drawn on them, so I guess I got my 'passion' about flying from her. I was one of those kids who always looked up when a plane would fly over too (and I still do...)

My experience with the YE's:
After I got my private ticket right around the time of 9/11, and with about 80 hours of total flight time in my logbook, I volunteered to do a YE day at Orlando Executive. I thought this would be a good way to get some kids interested in flying. Well, the first group of 3 kids were a blast, flew them over Disney (with permission, of course) in a rented 172 and then back to get the next bunch of kids. I figured this next bunch would be just like the last, eager to get a look at Micky Mouse from 2000', but boy was I wrong... shortly after take off, the 8-yr old sitting next to me grabbed the yolk and started 'helping' me fly the airplane, sawing back and forth on it like he was playing the trombone!!! After a 'stern statement or two' about not needing any 'help', we continued the flight to Disney and after 20 minutes or so of 'no help', I thought I had him convinced not to do that again. Well, on the way back, short final at about 200', landing in a pretty stiff cross-wind, little Glenn Miller grabbed the yolk again, this time he was 'gonna help me land the plane'... Yikes!

As if that wasn't enough excitement for me, after a few minutes on the ground getting my wits (and my knees) back together, I took the next bunch of kids out. This group was a couple of brothers and their dad, the oldest boy, a 15-yr old, knew more about Cessna 172's than I did because he'd been flying MS Flight Sim for the last couple of years. I mean he was quoting Vso, Vs1, etc. etc. etc. Cool, this is what YE's should be, he wanted to know how different it would be to 'fly the real thing', so I told him I'd let him fly straight and level a bit when we were on our way back. About a minute after I let him touch the controls he turned white as Casper, and about 15 seconds later he was puking up whatever hot dogs and waffle cones they were serving the kids on the ramp at Executive... that's not the kind of 'spark' I was looking for...:eek:

sk
 
a tale of two borthers

Many who read VAF regularly have contributed to the various "spark" threads. I thought a little "current events" might keep us all motivated. One facet of the "Friends of the RV-1" is its long term support for Eagle's Nest projects - there are now two RV-12 student built projects underway (and plans for more).

I got an email from Bob Kelly and wanted to share it here ...

a tale of two brothers

have a great weekend !
 
Love the alien!

Prior to my arrival, I made sure that Allie (my purple alien) was ready to go and put her on my back seat. Every time a kid went by and saw the alien, it was exciting for them. It got the conversation going. I probably put over 20 kids in the front seat, answer all their questions and told them one day they could fly too.
IMG_1631.JPG

That's a great idea, Axel! Thanks for sharing it.
 
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