Wrong Nutplates in Quick Build Fuselage

I started working on the Seat Floors this morning, and so far I have found 4 occasions where the wrong size nutplate was installed and I have suspicions on a few more, but I haven't gotten to them in the plans yet. Is this typical quality for the Quickbuild stuff, or is this rather rare? Frustrating when you spend an hour trying to figure out why the bolt won't bite the thread. I sure hope the term "quickbuild" isn't going to be synonymous with "fast food" ... quick but low quality...

my quickbuild

I did not have that trouble with my 9a quickbuild fuselage. The only wrong-
size nutplates in mine were the ones I put in.
RV9A Bill

Good Quality

I have had experience with about 33 QB kits from Vans and never had that problem. I Hope you will not be disapointed with the rest of your build. These are great airplanes.

Foster,

I found one mis-sized nutplate in my fuselage (a #6 instead of a #8). Rather than replace it, I just used a #6 screw in that particular location.

The only other minor workmanship issues involved 1). Negative edge-distance for a couple of the belly skin rivets where they attach to the longerons, and 2). The F-810A aft bulkhead not fitting the top skin very well. (I ended up making a new F-810A. It was fun! )

Out of the thousands of steps and processes involved in building the fuselages, I've come to feel this is a pretty good ratio. At the time, I remember being slightly surprised -- but in retrospect, none of these issues were even close to showstoppers. I think the cost of the QB is well worth it.

.

Follow up

I was pretty annoyed in my last post, and in reading it, I figure I should follow-up with some more details. Two of the platenuts that are used to bolt the control support via an AN3-5A bolt were not correctly sized, they were for a #8 screw. The same problem arose with the two platenuts in place that are used to attach the Flap Weldament to the Fuse. Again Nutplates for #8 screws were used instead of the #10's needed to accomodate AN3 bolts. Further investigation revealed 5 more platenuts!!!!!!!! that follow the above described problem of #6 instead of #8. All in all, am not very pleased with this... I have replaced all or the platenuts I believe to be in error, but I will post if I find more.

The rest of my fuselage looks great, but these minor flaws are just disappointing, but nothing more. I'll call Van's on Monday just to give them a heads up I guess.

bach33089 said:

The rest of my fuselage looks great, but these minor flaws are just disappointing, but nothing more. I'll call Van's on Monday just to give them a heads up I guess.

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I'd definitely give Van's a call, just to let them know they had a quality slip-up. In general, I have found the QB's to be outstanding - but I know that I have occasionally found the wrong sized nut plate mixed in with a bag of the right ones - perhaps some unlucky builder at the factory got a bad handful , and then YOU got unlucky by having that fuse....

Having finished our 7 and just taken delivery of our 8 kit, I can confirm a marked difference.

There is another major factor however - our 7 was a Czech assembled kit and the 8 is a current Bonanza Phillipines assembled one.

If I had not already seen the Czech one, I would be mightily impressed with the current one but there are several scrapes, rivet slips, lumps and bumps in panels. Also there are several screws that are either mashed in so tight that they are virtually impossible to remove, or the heads have been wound off on assembly - Baggage floor and undercarriage covers.

I know that the Czech ones were a lot more to produce, they also had a full epoxy primer interior paint on delivery as well.

I guess commerce and economy won the day.

I will pay attention to the nutplates as I progress

Lets be honest here. It likely took you longer to gripe about the wrong nutplates here than it should to replace them and move on. You guys are spoiled!

I had same problem

I recieved my QB in September and had the exact same problem. Notified Vans. Wasnt to timeconsuming to replace but you will find others. I also was missing a piece in the throttle cable mount. Vans has been great about sending replacement stuff. The biggest problem I have gotten into is the lack of proper rivets. Both wings and fuselage. I am not sure they have figured out the proper requirements for the Quickbuild as the print call for rivets that have either not been included in the parts lists or fall short of req. amt. Again, Vans is great ! All you have to do is call and they will send them immediately. Suggest each step you make sure you have the proper amount of required rivets (dont just check to see that you have a bag).
Thats my two cents if it helps.

bach33089 said:

I started working on the Seat Floors this morning, and so far I have found 4 occasions where the wrong size nutplate was installed and I have suspicions on a few more, but I haven't gotten to them in the plans yet. Is this typical quality for the Quickbuild stuff, or is this rather rare? Frustrating when you spend an hour trying to figure out why the bolt won't bite the thread. I sure hope the term "quickbuild" isn't going to be synonymous with "fast food" ... quick but low quality...

Click to expand...

Friends new QB had the same issues...

Wrong sized nut plates and wrong rivets in the main gear area. . . He sent vans a detailed description of the issues and the days of corrective measures. They need to know this so that they can address QA issues they may have.

rocketbob said:

Lets be honest here. It likely took you longer to gripe about the wrong nutplates here than it should to replace them and move on. You guys are spoiled!

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Probably very true, but it is very annoying that after spending $5180 on the quickbuild option, the construction was not done correctly in its entirety. For that kind of money I could go buy a Rolex, and I bet it would be perfectly constructed... That said, I am having the time of my life building this airplane, and this was just a bump in the road, nothing more! Thanks for the help, condolences, and advice!

bach33089 said:

... I have found 4 occasions where the wrong size nutplate was installed and I have suspicions on a few more

Click to expand...

Same here. I picked up my RV-8A QB fuse at Van's in December so it's about as current as they come. The 10-32 nutplates for mounting the F-837-1 Aft Control Mount had 8-32 incorrectly installed.

Also, the F-805B floor support angles already had nutplates installed but not the required F-805-F-1 spacers so the nutplates had to be drilled out and then re-installed with the spacers.

And when fitting the vertical stabilizer I came across 4 rivets on the F-811E bulkhead and F-712 tie down that were in the wrong holes (bolt holes).

Later while assembling the Throttle Quadrant Cover I found my kit included no F-864E-1 Cable Anchor nor the AA6-187 stock to fabricate it. Upon request Van's sent it to me although I had to follow-up to get the billing straightened out.

Like you, I find the quality issues disappointing and chafe at the extra time required for these items after spending over $5k for the QB kit. When I called Van's about these items I got the impression that this was the first time they'd heard of these things but I think we all know differently. So I've spelled them out in detail above in an effort to help others. Conversely, I'd like to know of any other "surprises" I should expect to run across if others would post their findings.

A QB is a real time-saver for a first time builder. Not so much for repeat offenders. My RV-6 was a QB that took me almost 5 years. There were some mistakes, which took me time to fix, but overall, it saved me a lot of time. My next one, a match-drilled RV-8 was not a QB and it took 2 years. The QB fuselage would have been a 5K option, but I had my standard fuselage to QB stage in two months. It cost me 2 months, but saved me $5K, and I'm sure I ended up with a better fuselage. Bottom line is, if you are building a QB and find mistakes, make sure you tell Van's about it. I had mistakes on my -6QB eight years ago and they still happen. Good luck with your project. Sounds like you are a careful builder and will love the airplane you end up with.

I have also had the following issues with my June 2010 QB fuselage.. Incorrect nutplates for aft control column mount, tailwheel weldment and rear bulkhead should be flush, but there is a gap of 1/8" or more between the parts, needing a spacer plate made up, and longer bolts. Also the rivets under the outboard gear wear plates weren't flush, and had to be removed in order for the wear plates to sit flat (Checked with Van's on this one, they said to leave the rivets out..).. Quite a few bad shop heads, scratches etc.
BUT - On the whole, it is very well made, the skin lap joints are perfect, the bulk of the riveting is A++, the time saving is huge and the build quality looks much better than any Cessna I have seen.. I am a happy customer!

"The 10-32 nutplates for mounting the F-837-1 Aft Control Mount had 8-32 incorrectly installed."

Joe, I have the same issue. How did you buck the aft rivet of the forward nutplate for the F837? I can't seem to get anything between the nutplate and the F805B support angle? Thanks,

Skyking902001
RV-8 QB

skyking902001 said:

"The 10-32 nutplates for mounting the F-837-1 Aft Control Mount had 8-32 incorrectly installed."

Joe, I have the same issue. How did you buck the aft rivet of the forward nutplate for the F837? I can't seem to get anything between the nutplate and the F805B support angle? Thanks,

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I'm not following you, Skyking902001 (if that is how you like to be addressed). I found no obstruction to riveting the F-837's replacement nutplates and the F-805B support angles are not involved. I squeezed rather than bucked all these nutplate attach rivets.

Now the nutplates in the F-805B floor support angles are a different deal. (Maybe you're confusing my second point with my first.) Those nutplates need to be drilled out to incorporate the F-805-1 spacers. The plans show riveting through the F-831-1 floor, through the spacers, and through the floor support angles to rivet the nutplates. I chose /not/ to rivet through the floor and will count on the screws in the nutplates to secure the floor. (I think RV-8A builder Mike Elliott clued me in to that idea.)

Does this make sense? Or am I not understanding your question?

--
Joe

RV-8 QB

Joe, thanks for reply--probably my original post was not very clear. What I am referring to is the F805B-R-1 floor support angle that runs from the edge of fuselage to the center rib. (the same angle that has 4 nutplates that need removal to incorporate the F805-1 spacers). Just forward of the inboard end of this angle sits a nutplate that the front hole of the aft control mount ties into. I can barely get my little finger between this angle and the aftmost rivet of that nutplate. This is the rivet I'm wondering how to set. If this does not make a lot of sense, I'll get a pic tonight and post. BTW, although I have found some minor "inconviences" in the QB fuse & wing, it has probably saved me at least 18 months (probably more) of build time. I'm sooo ready to fly!

Steve
Skyking902001
RV-8

"Nutplate" rivets from GAHCo. It's a pulled rivet specifically for this task, and works great.

I think every builder has ended up installing the wrong nutplate at times. It's very easy to get them mixed up if one happens to fall into the bin for another type or when dealing with Van's little brown bags that have different types. It is not too surprising to me that the QB factory would make the mistake -- especially if they don't actually run hardware into the nutplate.

Drilling out and replacing a few nutplates is the least of your worries in seeing this airplane through to completion. Yeah, you paid for it to be done right (and I completely understand your frustration), but in terms of build errors this one is insignificant and quite easily remedied.

F-837-1 Aft Control Mount and

skyking902001 said:

What I am referring to is the F805B-R-1 floor support angle that runs from the edge of fuselage to the center rib. (the same angle that has 4 nutplates that need removal to incorporate the F805-1 spacers). Just forward of the inboard end of this angle sits a nutplate that the front hole of the aft control mount ties into. I can barely get my little finger between this angle and the aftmost rivet of that nutplate. This is the rivet I'm wondering how to set.

Click to expand...

Steve,

I'm still having trouble visualizing your dilemma. Could this be different in the RV-8 vs. the -8A?

In my RV-8A fuselage there's plenty of room between the nutplates for the F-837-1 Aft Control Mount and the F-805B-R-1 Floor Support Angle.

I see the light!

Joe, thanks for the pics! I finally see the light--I was thinking the aft control mount was one nutplate farther forward--thus the interference in setting the nutplate rivet. You saved me from removing the wrong nutplate! This would have become evident later when I began installing the control weldment. Thanks again for the heads up!

Steve