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Painting Poll

Who painted your aircraft

  • Unpainted

    Votes: 19 8.6%
  • Myself

    Votes: 85 38.6%
  • Professional painter (non aviation shop)

    Votes: 30 13.6%
  • Pro painter aviation shop

    Votes: 86 39.1%

  • Total voters
    220

Vlad

Well Known Member
I flipped all seven pages on RV painting here on VAF. All 7 of them first dated 2005 do not have a poll. I would like to have general idea how many painted their aicraft themselves and how many outsourced to a pro. Comment if you wish.


1. Unpainted
2. Painted myself
3. Painted by a pro (non aviation shop)
4. Painted by a pro (aviation)
 
A friend who really knows what he's doing offered to teach me how to paint Stella. A few things became obvious very quickly:

1. you need a very clean, very well lit environment
2. you need practise
3. you need talent

I had none of the above:D
 
Research

Researched it to death. Watched vids, looking into all the diff paints, stewart system etc etc. Talked to lots of builders who had painted themselves, and found that the materials would cost at least half what a quality "good deal" pro job would cost. Saw some nasty home done jobs and read lots about builders who had tried hard and made a mess and where not happy to the point of reshooting the parts. So....figured it was one area (like building the engine) that I wanted a pro.

Been happy every since...and going to visit the painter....was amazed at hom much time and work it is. CRAZY, and they knew what they were doing and had great tools and facilities.
 
A friend who really knows what he's doing offered to teach me how to paint Stella. A few things became obvious very quickly:

1. you need a very clean, very well lit environment
2. you need practise
3. you need talent

I had none of the above:D


Disagree with Concertmeister on points 2 and 3 :D
 
I am painting my -10 right now. Its not anywhere near being perfect but I purchased a good quality gun and that helps a lot. Just like building the plane, I am finding the painting experience to be very rewarding.
 
I plan to paint mine one day, but before I do I will shadow a professional for a few hours to get an idea for technique. I will then by an old car or two in need of paint, do the prep, paint and sell. Only then will I feel competent to do my own plane.
 
I'm with Rick on this one. It became quickly apparent when I was priming, I wasn't going to do the top coat. I made a deal with a local auto painter, who has a grass strip and three of his own aircraft. The last is a Fokker triplane that he is just finishing. I supply the materials and assist with the grunt work and he paints. I spent about $3,500 on JetGlo/AcryGlo paint and just under $500 for materials (sandpaper, tape, paper, masks, etc). Then add labor on that.

Painting isn't inexpensive, regardless of which way you go.

Bob
 
At home paint shop/booth

Vlad, as you know, I did it at home. You can do it too. I'll lend you my HVLP paint system and fresh air system. Find a place, build a booth, take the wings off, make a rotating wing stand and go at it. Oh yeah, like me , be happy with a 30' paint job. Looks good from 30 feet. :D

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And of course, let the parts dry in your apartment......

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I had painted many cars in my young days. Show quality takes a fair amount of effort, daily drivers only a little less.
So when I during my RV build I always figured I would paint it myself in my garage just like always. Problem was materials and techniques had changed over the 25yrs. I talked with Corky, a local auto painter, he was willing to get me the info I needed. As I progressed down this road, I realized my old guns needed replaced and I would need to build a booth. Chad Jensen, before he was a EAA superstar:D, helped me put my paint thoughts on paper. I showed this picture to Corky and asked him if I could rent his spray booth. He said Sure, but i love that look...so how about I cut you a good deal and we work together. He wanted to be part of this project. perfect! I got to part of the process, he had the facility and the talent.

Don't kid yourself if you think painting will be easy. I washed, sanded and scuffed her 3 or 4 times. Here is after the first scuff.
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Laying out my simple stripes took me almost 5hrs
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Yellow and purple done, getting ready for green
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TaDa.....$2600 in materials, and a couple hundred man-hours of effort. Oh yeah, this is how it came out of the gun, no cut and buffing for us
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ps...I know a good painter.;)
 
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Vlad, take it to Tuscaloosa and "be done with it" -- you'll be very happy with the end result.. and looking at your travels, that'd be one of the shorter hops for you :)
 
Very very rewarding for me and I get to say I did it. Not done yet but so far it is turning out to be a 12 inch paint job. 90 percent preparation, 10 percent actually spraying. Actually, for me, the newer materials are easier to use. My biggest challenge so far was keeping dry compressed air here in humid Louisiana. My wife's cousin, a professional auto painter helped me get that together. If you have any questions about putting together a good air system message me. Good luck if you decide to paint yourself.

Bird
 
I painted my Pitts 30 years ago. It turned out OK, but I promised myself I would never paint another plane. When my -10 was ready for paint, I kept my word and took it to Grady. The pain of writing the check was less than the agony of prepping/painting for weeks on end.

Jim Berry
RV-10
 
get a neighbor who owns a body shop

My next door neighbor owns a body shop in Aspen. In looking at colors, he gave me the Range Rover, Porsche, and BMW charts. He is a good neighbor to have!!He said I could prep it and his guys will spray it for me if I want for $25 an hour or I could use his booth. With a plane, you can do all the parts at different times and then put it together. That makes it easier to transport to a painter. I have done several cars and as long as you don't mine color sanding, you can get a pretty good job. The chemicals are what scares me now. The big tip is DO NOT SAND WHERE YOU PAINT! I agree with those who say it is rewarding to paint it themselves. I am still not sure if I will just have the guys paint it for me or do it myself. My neighbor will also buy the paint and other materials for me at quite a savings over retail.
 
Vlad - as you know, I had mine painted at a professional shop. I think everyone would describe it as a 5' paint job (at less than 5' you can find some imperfections). There were two reasons for having it done. The biggest reason ? I was not comfortable disassembling the plane. With some recent experience, I am comfortable with the processes but without disassembly, I would not tackle an airplane project.

If you are serious about painting your airplane for the experience, I'd be happy to talk about the process. If you're doing it to save money, you should talk about Jim Russell.
 
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I did not participate in the poll as there was no in between.

One paint shop in NC wanted $10K, another wanted $7K. I had started polishing and decided I was not ever going to finish. I decided to paint the plane myself.

I have all the fiberglass finished and will paint the rest next spring after pine pollen season. I am using the HVLP Citation system and like the results very much. The only down side to this system is that you get to drag two large hoses around, and I feel like I am constantly tripping on them.

Another other draw back is that it appears next to impossible to shoot paint upside down (fus belly, underside of wings, etc). My buddy just invested in a high end SATA 3000 gun. Wow! what a gun. I will be using that gun for at least the underside stuff (3M makes disposable adapters/cup/liners that fit the gun that allow for true upside down painting).

I am using the PPG DCC Concept line of single stage polyurethane paint, PPG K38 primer on the fiberglass, and DPS3055 V-Prime primer on the aluminum.

I have made good friends with my local PPG distributor as I/we are painting 3 RV aircraft. The volume of paint we buy is huge compared to the pints and quarts that an auto body shop uses. Because of the gallon sized increments we purchase, we are getting jobber prices.
 
I'm doing my own paint. As imperfect (under statement) as it may be, I want to be able to say I did it myself.

It was getting a little cool up here which caused a few extra issues. I ended up with some orange peel which bothers me. I have a buffer and have color sanded and buffed the paint . It takes some effort, but it turns out pretty nice when it's finished.

I'm working on the checkerboard rudder today, which is making life a little interesting.


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Hi all
Saturday MN Wing membe Scott Elhardt gave a talk to our builders group on the process he used in painting Luis beautifully RV8 himself. Here is a link to his PowerPoint presentation:

http://www.mnwing.org/page37/page37.html

Personally, after having 3 other airplanes painted in my lifetime, I felt that i would just save and save until i could have my new RV7 painted at WipAire here in St. Paul. Not cheap but it was well worth it.
 
Thanks Gary

I'm in the process of trying to paint myself. I just don't have the funds to have it professionally done. I built a temporary booth inside my garage to keep the overspray down to a minimum. I'm trying to teach myself how to spray currently with priming the parts. I was trying to use a cheap Sears siphon gun to prime with but its not working out.

I bought an air system to protect my lungs that I intend to sell on here down the road once I am sure I won't be painting anymore.

Gary I appreciate the pictures you posted so I can see the detail of what you did. I am copying your scheme but will use blue where you have the red.

If it looks good from 10 feet thats fine by me. I have more time than money.

When my daughter is at school I move the fuselage to my house garage to get it out of the way to free up the booth and keep it out of the elements. I don't spray anytime rain is forecasted and wait a day or two following a rain.
So what if it takes some more time to finish the build. Its suppose to be all about the experience anyway.
 
Painted it myself

I just did a presentation on my painting process for our Minnesota Wing on painting my RV-8.

The link is here - http://www.mnwing.org/N32SEPaint.pdf

My results were really good and I'd do it again. My costs ended up about 1/3 of the numbers that I heard from the group compared to having it professionally painted.

My paint booth is in this thread - http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=86145&highlight=booth

I think if you built it, you can paint it if you want to.
 
I have painted several planes and cars using all kinds of paints. I personally find that basecoat/clearcoat types give the best results for the least amount of experience.

The basecoat can be put on rather rough, as long as you don't make runs. It will look rather flat by design.

The clearcoat can just about be put on with a hose. Runs can be scraped off and then buffed out. This is how many (all?) car painters do it.

However, if you're a bit skilled, and you will be by the time you do the clearcoating, you can put it on relatively thinly (compared to what a car painter would do) and still have plenty to buff to a great shine.

If you're really good, or lucky, you won't even need to buff it. I like that, because I hate sanding and buffing.

If you notice, above there is a warning about using a car painter from your local body shop to paint your plane. They have no qualms about adding a LOT of weight to your plane in the form of very thick paint. Even if you explain how important it is (esp. on control surfaces), they will hose the paint on with reckless abandon. I've seen it many times.

And all of that paint costs money too!

YMMV. Follow the mfg. recommendations and don't mix systems.
 
I painted mine and am very pleased with the results, but it did not come without plenty of research and practice.
I had never painted a car/plane before, but I had also never built a plane before, so what the heck.
Be advised, the cost of quality paint can be eye-opening!
After researching the options, I went with basecoat/clear-coat for the reasons previously mentioned. Easier to fix.
Base is stupid simple to shoot. Shoot for coverage and don't flood it. I will look like ****/dull, but the clear fixes that.
Practice on junkyard hoods or trunk lids until you have the gun and yourself dialed in. Black is cheap(er) and shows your mistakes. Red/yellow $$$.
Use a light colored primer for light colors. Yellow over dark primer is a recipe for disaster.
Don't sand the basecoat.
The nice thing about base is that it is easy to remove if you really bugger it up. Lacquer thinner will take it off.

autobody101.com is a good place for general info.

If you feel bad about your paint job, just go look at some new cars. Ooof.

The big question I have for Vlad is: How in the world are you going to live without a plane for a couple of months?
 
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snip...


The bit question I have for Vlad is: How in the world are you going to live without a plane for a couple of months?


I don't know Mike. I removed tank for repair and second week without flying I go crazy. Good thing I work in right place we have excellent in-house psychiatrists :D
 
30 footer?

Vlad, as you know, I did it at home. You can do it too. I'll lend you my HVLP paint system and fresh air system. Find a place, build a booth, take the wings off, make a rotating wing stand and go at it. Oh yeah, like me , be happy with a 30' paint job. Looks good from 30 feet. :D

You might be "Saving too much money" with the 30' paint job... When you sell it (and you will someday.), your buyer will be seeing it a foot from his nose. I would consider that seriously. Just sayin'... YMMV.

.
 
Waterborne?

In one of the recent car magazines, "Rod & Custom" I think, they talked about waterborne paint and I wonder if anyone has painted an RV with it...

.
 
Ok a little closer than 30'

You might be "Saving too much money" with the 30' paint job... When you sell it (and you will someday.), your buyer will be seeing it a foot from his nose. I would consider that seriously. Just sayin'... YMMV.

.

Jerry, my -6 actually came out better than the 30' paint job I referenced but it sure is not show quality. I think Vlad would be OK with a similar job.... he has seen mine up close and personal... ;)

Vlad, OK you are right, leave the wing/fuse fairings white. They have grown on me :D
In addition to the previous equipment I offered, I also have the entire booth set up you can borrow (sans the plastic of course) You can get it all in your -9a next trip if you decide to do it yourself.

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BY FAR the hardest part is coming up with a paint scheme. You want it to be unique, look good on the relatively square lines of the RV, and have colors that really stand out. Me, I just stole the HondaJet scheme. Even my N-number supports that, although that's not what the letters stand for.

I had painted a few cars in my day, so I knew what I was getting into. Helped my hangar neighbor build an awesome paint booth using a big 240V axial blower he found on ebay. Used lights on the ceiling, walls, and even an 8' fluorescent on the floor, wrapped with a sleeve of clear plastic. An automotive creeper works well for the bottom.

For laying out the scheme, I started with drawing the scheme in AutoCad (works great for that application) and used an LCD projector to project the lines on the airplane and then applied striping tape along the lines. Made paper patterns off that, so that I'd have something in the booth to use for layout on the "big day" and also to be able to have the RH and LH identical (used the same pattern on both sides).

Finally, validated colors on a leftover carb air scoop and validated scheme on an RC model RV-7. From that test piece, I ended up changing 2 of the 3 colors (oops) and changed the silver stripe layout.

Used PPG base/clear and after 6 years, it's holding up great.

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Painting can be the most satisfying part of the project.

You know how sometimes you finish an assembly, and just sit and look at it for a while?

You do that a lot when you paint.

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I am a licensed aircraft engineer and paint aircraft and various components as required as part of my overall job at work. So stripping and painting my rv at home in my shed seemed like a no brainer. I had no problems with the primer but nothing but dramas with the white base coat . Repainted and sanded back flight controls 3 times until I worked out my compressor couln't keep up with my hvlp gun I usually use . This gave me a dry spray at first pull of trigger then too wet as pressure backed off. Got conventional gun problem fixed sprayed wings on first coat little bush bees decided that they would land on the wet paint . So waited for paint to dry and wiped them off re cleaned surface , at least I thought I did , until shot next coat and realised had contamination on wings . Sanded both wings back to primer , reprimed and shot base again now the weather got humid and even though I had water traps a bit got through but picked this up straight away so no real drama. Decided to bring compressor inside shed and turn aircond. on stops humidity but now there is too much dry overspray in the air and on the second coat dust finds it way on to the surface . At this stage I am not happy with the result as unfortunately I am judged on the result Due to my occupation by my peers. Solution decided to take the plane bit by bit to work and paint in a more controlled environment. Was going to set up and extractor fan at home but was concerned about overspray being blown over to the neighbours. Anyone can do their own paint job with a bit of practice but you need quality equipment and a good clean well lit environment . Paint is too expensive to do things more than once. I tip my hat to all doing it themselves at home good job . Cheers Mick.
 
Just remember 90% of the time invested in your paint job has nothing to do with paint and everything to do with prep. I have seen a lot of "really nice" paint jobs start to peel and lift after a few years.
My painter spent about a week in prep; acid etch/alodine, sand, clean, prime and mask. The actual painting took very little time.

I am very impressed with those that take this daunting task upon themselves and manage a good result.
 
The poll left out the option that I used.

A friend that has painted before but is NOT a professional painter.
 
In one of the recent car magazines, "Rod & Custom" I think, they talked about waterborne paint and I wonder if anyone has painted an RV with it...
.

Talk with Greg Halverson. You can pm me for his number if you like. He is a local, Vancouver, builder. He painted his original build (sold and no longer in the area) and painted it with such a product. However, that was a long time ago, so not sure how relevant it would be. As I recall, it had it's plus's and minus's.
 
Painting is a 100% exercise is deferred gratification

1. Preparation is tedious and exacting
2. It takes way more time than you think
3. I generally dislike (hate?) every minute of the work
4. Runs and sags and orange peel can all be repaired. Professional painters have them too. Just not as many. See DanH posts for repair techniques - no one can argue with his final result.

Only the individual can determine if the end justifies the means. It is always a question of how much you value your time against the money it costs to pay someone else. A professional will be able to fit more hours in a given time frame than someone who has to work for a living.

When I found out the siding on my house would have to stripped or the hi-tech stain manufacturer would not guarantee his product - I knew I couldn't afford to hire the work done. The process involved pressure washing, stripping (sometimes 2x), pressure washing, brightening, two coats of stain and one coat of clear coat. 225 hrs. have been invested to date, much of it on ladders 15' - 30' AGL. I hated every minute of it, but loved the result.

Before:

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After:

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I plan on painting the plane myself since I wasn't the Powerball winner. I painted my first car almost 40 years ago. It was one of the most difficult, time consuming and frustrating things I've ever done. It was also one of the most rewarding. The paint is what everyone sees after all of your hard work.
 
I have the emp and wings painted, a lot of work and sanding but worth it. getting the clear coat wet - no runs was the hardest part for me.
 
I took the hardest 'paint yourself' way but in different steps due to construction process, money available, temperature. So that's what I did :

- painted light grey the fuse belly after putting the gear on, fuselage inverted - my shop (summer)

- painted the back side of fuselage (AFT rear seat) with blue - my shop (summer)

Early morning, no wind, water on the floor for the dust, I covered everything in the shop.

It's very hard to mantain the dust away from your fresh job, the uncontrolled curing temperature don't help a nice work ..... it's acceptable.

Second step.....

I knew a guy that owns a professional car paint shop, just 2 miles from building site. So for the rest of the project I rented his oven and did the job myself, I'm happy in general for the result, it's my perfect idea between homebuilding, cheap and quality.

I spent about 800 usd for consumable and oven rent (it was winter) in 10 days working.

After 10 hours of flying I wanted to paint the cowling but my grey color was too old (dried); a colour shop had prepared for me another mix but ... not matched with the original (you can see it into the VAF calendar) was not funny but another lesson was learned :rolleyes:

Now all colours in my 8 are the same :)
 
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I painted myself too, total cost about $1500, shrink wrapped my carport, installed an extractor fan etc.

The job turned out very well, you can see results here, as others have said, preparation is 90% of the work.

http://www.mykitlog.com/users/displ...e&project=535&category=2103&log=144158&row=24

Its very satisfying to see the results at the end of the day, you will make mistakes, but you can fix them, the total job took me about 2 months.

Cheers
Eddie
 
Can I vote twice? I painted my own but it's also what I do for a living.
 
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RV Dealer

I found a great solution, but not sure how many like it there are out there. The largest Recreational Vehicle dealer in town has a 50' state-of-the-art paint booth and had just recently painted an RV-9A for the owner's father. The store owner is also an avid pilot but not a builder or experimental guy. Anyway, after talking to several auto shops in town (2 of which had done planes and were willing to do mine), I ran into the RV shop painter and he said they might be able to fit me in. Long story short, they did a great job, half the price or less of what I'm reading people are spending to paint their -10s (they let me provide the grunt labor, of which there is a LOT), and we painted most of it between Thursday night and Sunday night. We finished a few of the misc pieces within a week. Bottom line, I got a professional paint job with top quality paint for just under $5000 and I got it done within about a 10 day period...couldn't be happier.
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I wanted a paint job that was professional quality, bright (i.e., visible), unique, and as inexpensive as possible. I was very happy with the results.
 
Outside....

I have painted several auto's and about 4 airplanes and hated the work on every one of them.

Having said that I don't really see any other way to get the results I wanted.

The -10 was painted outside with no paint booth and into the night holding a light.......

The idea was to prep in the evening with the night temperature in the low 40's and then start painting first thing in the morning before the bugs start moving and without a paint booth if we mest up 1 coat we could probably sand that back off and redo it in way less time that we could build a paint booth so we took the chance.

It worked fairly well but due to some of the coats having to be applied in specific time frames from each other we ran into the night one time.

I think we only had to redo about 2 different coats.

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Designer, Masks

I would be remiss not to credit John Stahr with developing my design. He does amazing artwork in the paint booth but was too far away and I did not want to assemble, disassemble, paint, reassemble. However, he also will help you develop your design and provide many renderings based on conversations with you and pictures you can send him of paint schemes you like. Very trouble free and a fair price.

I also used paint masks for the N number and text on the tail. The N number was a multi-layer mask that worked really slick - from a local sign shop. It's pretty standard stuff, I believe.
 
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