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Rubber VS felt wheel bearing seals

G

gear1

Well Known Member
Has anyone experimented with rubber type wheel bearing seals? Cleveland supposedly came out with a new rubber seal about a year ago, but so far no one has them in stock. Finally in frustration, I purchased Timken seals, PN 472737 to try. They are dimensionally correct, but their secondary dust seal does not contact the spacer ring. So the next ones I will try are the Timken seal PN7486S, which are single lip seals. So far, after about 20 takeoffs and landings the #472737 seals seem to be working fine, and there is far less dirt on the wheel nut and wheel, indicating less seepage of grease . Since the seal drag is higher than the felt-type dust shields, I LockTited the inner spacer ring to the axle with blue LockTite, and drilled a tiny hole in the outboard spacer and the wheel nut so that an "anti rotation" pin could be installed to prevent rotation of the outer spacer. I will continue to report as more time is put on the seal system. By the way, SkyGeek shows a price (no stock) for the Cleveland seal #154-13000 of $33.00. The Timken #472737 seal cost about $3.00 from Motion Incorporated.
If anyone has experience with rubber seals, I would appreciate your thoughts:confused:.
 
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Timken seal #473237

An update to my post 2014:

I have been using the Timken Wheel Bearing Seal #473237 in place of my felt seals for over a year now, and 200 hours of flight time. No problems to this point with the seals. Much less dirt accumulation, and there is less dirt in the grease at the outboard end of the bearings then with the felt seals. Best of all, absolutely no corrosion of the bearings.

The only problem in installation is that the seal bores in the wheel are a bit oversize, probably due to corrosion, so I had to stretch the outer lip of the seal somewhat to get them to be absolutely tight in the wheel bore.
 
I never understood why we would stick with tech that hasn't been used elsewhere since we were ducking & covering under our desks in school, but I've been too lazy to look for alternatives.

Thanks for sharing; I'll try to order a couple before my next annual.

Charlie
 
rv7charlie said:
I never understood why we would stick with tech that hasn't been used elsewhere since we were ducking & covering under our desks in school, but I've been too lazy to look for alternatives.

Thanks for sharing; I'll try to order a couple before my next annual.

Charlie
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I think it boils down to "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". Sounds like a harmless easy thing to do if you have a mind to do it.
I am sure there are better ways to do a lot of things and this might be one of them. However, I don't see a problem with the felt and thin washers that are standard with Cleveland Wheels. They have not presented any issue on mine deserving of a departure from the manufacturers design.
 
I am considering replacing my felt seals with these. Are you guys replacing with the Timken seals on both sides or just the inboard side? The Cleveland SB only specifies replacing the inboard seal.

Larry
 
JonJay said:
I think it boils down to "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". Sounds like a harmless easy thing to do if you have a mind to do it.
I am sure there are better ways to do a lot of things and this might be one of them. However, I don't see a problem with the felt and thin washers that are standard with Cleveland Wheels. They have not presented any issue on mine deserving of a departure from the manufacturers design.
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Cleveland apparently created this seal to eliminate bearing corrosion. If Cleveland took the time to supersede the part and issue an SB, I am not sure I agree that "it ain't broke."

Larry
 
JonJay said:
I think it boils down to "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". Sounds like a harmless easy thing to do if you have a mind to do it.
I am sure there are better ways to do a lot of things and this might be one of them. However, I don't see a problem with the felt and thin washers that are standard with Cleveland Wheels. They have not presented any issue on mine deserving of a departure from the manufacturers design.
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This is good to hear. For amateur built and maintained, the molded seal just seems like another place so spend more $$. Skygeek ~$38 (154-13000) vs ~$9 for the felt. I assume this felt needs to be saturated each service or it will not provide the protection desired.
 
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lr172 said:
Cleveland apparently created this seal to eliminate bearing corrosion. If Cleveland took the time to supersede the part and issue an SB, I am not sure I agree that "it ain't broke."

Larry
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Wasn't aware of that. Do you have a link to the SB Larry? I Looked and found nothing for the 5" wheels.
 
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BillL said:
This is good to hear. For amateur built and maintained, the molded seal just seems like another place so spend more $$. Skygeek ~$38 (154-13000) vs ~$9 for the felt. I assume this felt needs to be saturated each service or it will not provide the protection desired.
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Bill - These where dry when new. Of course they pick up with grease over time. I simply put them between paper towels and pat them until the are relatively clean.
Are you reading something in Parkers literature about treating them?
Mine have 700 hours on them and I see no reason to change them. Axles, bearings, and wheels are all like new....felt has little if any sign of wear.
 
JonJay said:
Thanks. Not a SB though. I will stick with the felt until they wear out and/or I can't buy new ones anymore.
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I suspect they see problems where planes sit out in the rain or are routinely used in wet runway situations. Probably atypical for the RV community. However, I do not have a hanger and take extra steps in many areas to keep out moisture.

Larry
 
JonJay said:
Bill - These where dry when new. Of course they pick up with grease over time. I simply put them between paper towels and pat them until the are relatively clean.
Are you reading something in Parkers literature about treating them?
Mine have 700 hours on them and I see no reason to change them. Axles, bearings, and wheels are all like new....felt has little if any sign of wear.
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I believe they recommend to soak the felt in oil.
 
lr172 said:
I believe they recommend to soak the felt in oil.
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I'll look at my Parker instructions again. No matter, doesn't take long for them to get "oily".
I think it would be a wise choice considering the environment you may put your plane in. Keep your maintenance up and the grease should do its job.
I get a bit jumpy when someone says a SB exists on a part that I have been servicing for many years. ;)
Nice to know what the scoop really is.
Thanks.
 
JonJay said:
I'll look at my Parker instructions again. No matter, doesn't take long for them to get "oily".
I think it would be a wise choice considering the environment you may put your plane in. Keep your maintenance up and the grease should do its job.
I get a bit jumpy when someone says a SB exists on a part that I have been servicing for many years. ;)
Nice to know what the scoop really is.
Thanks.
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Sorry about that. I didn't pay much attention to the header and assumed it was based on the content.
 
JonJay said:
Bill - These where dry when new. Of course they pick up with grease over time. I simply put them between paper towels and pat them until the are relatively clean.
Are you reading something in Parkers literature about treating them?
Mine have 700 hours on them and I see no reason to change them. Axles, bearings, and wheels are all like new....felt has little if any sign of wear.
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Here is the passage that I thought applied.

"Inspect snap rings and grease seals for distortion or wear. Replace grease seal felts if they are hard or contaminated. Lightly coat all surfaces of the new felt with the wheel bearing grease (refer to paragraph 3.A. Bearing Grease). Molded rubber grease seals should be replaced if cracked, dried out or distorted."

Page 49 of the AWBCMM0001 maintenance manual.

I have not done this, so shall defer to those who have. An assumption was made that the light coating became a barrier to dust and debris, and water? It would seem the parts would get hot with braking then if taxiing in water they would cool and draw in any moisture around the seal after parking. It would seem that a molded seal might do the same, but less. I have new felts on hand for the change to Mobil 1 synthetic grease (PRM78).

Maybe certified applications extend the intervals and the combination of new synthetic grease and the molded seals contribute to longer life on those airplanes. For the outrageous cost of the bearings, I could see why.

lr172 said:
I am considering replacing my felt seals with these. Are you guys replacing with the Timken seals on both sides or just the inboard side? The Cleveland SB only specifies replacing the inboard seal.

Larry
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Note the "pub" refers to (wheel assembly) models that have a hub cap and that end is therefore sealed already.
 
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I do recall doing that initially now that I read this Bill. I haven't greased them since as they have plenty to go around. Thanks for the refresher. Appreciated.
I think the key, regardless of what seals you use, keep them greased, and above all, use the airplane! A rolling stone gathers no rust :p
 
The washers on my purchased RV have always been a cause for concern, do not look at all 'cupped' like they should, and in fact look like they have been 'worked' with a hammer at some point. The felts are looking a bit shagged, so last condition inspection I decided it was time for new. Then I saw prices for OEM. After searching here, I stumbled upon Craig's initial post, but can't for the life of me come up with PN 472737. I have found PN 7486S at Summit Racing for $3.97 each plus $9.95 handling. I am going to get eight for myself, but if anyone else wants some I will gladly order a bunch and then send them out at cost, honor system cash or check via USPS. Send me an email via this site.
 
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