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Show me your Wiring Diagrams

jamesrw2002

Active Member
Let's see your schematics!

Complements of SteinAir. Guys did a bang up job and you get a diagram for future troubleshooting!


interconnect page 1.jpg

interconnect page 2a.jpg
 
Wow I would love to have received that with my RV. Does anyone know if any company will create wiring diagrams based on an equipment list without the company doing any other work beyond that?

I'l love to get into my panel and clean things up and verify everything is done properly, this would help a LOT!
 
My panel from SteinAir shipped yesterday - will post pictures when it arrives. The final invoice listed a few hundred bucks for custom wiring instructions and schematics. If I were you, I would reach out to them and ask. If they are creating these based on an hourly rate, and your panel has off the shelf equipment, they can probably generate one for you at some reasonable fee.
 
Wow I would love to have received that with my RV. Does anyone know if any company will create wiring diagrams based on an equipment list without the company doing any other work beyond that?

I'l love to get into my panel and clean things up and verify everything is done properly, this would help a LOT!

Midwest Avionics in Lee's Summit Mo did mine- Full disclosure, I had him build the wire bundles as well, but originally we had discussed him just doing the schematics based on which making boxes I wanted and he was cool with that.

Levi Self is the owner. He's a former Garmin guy.
 
I'll reach out to both companies and see what they can do. Might even have harnesses built and just gut the existing bundle. Ultimately I'd like to get the panel wired clean enough that it would allow me to remove it for service instead of getting under it or trying to access from the top.

Toying with a couple upgrades (430W to 650Xi and possibly swapping the G5s for a portrait G3x) - Once I make my mind up it'll be time to pull the trigger.
 
... Ultimately I'd like to get the panel wired clean enough that it would allow me to remove it for service instead of getting under it or trying to access from the top. ...

Strongly recommended. My panel is much smaller (RV-8) but it comes out easily and I can access everything while the panel is sitting in my lap. I still have to plan what I'll do so I have tools and stuff within reach, but much better than pulling the seat and laying on my back.
 
No, guys, wiring diagrams are not what you want. They're too detailed.

What you almost always want is a tabulation of what port on what device goes to what port on another device; and what settings go on each port. If you have a wiring diagram, you end up tracing wires on a big drawing to figure out the connections rather than just looking up the connections.

Other details can be in the tabulation, also.

KISS (you know what that stands for)

Ed
 
No, guys, wiring diagrams are not what you want. They're too detailed.

What you almost always want is a tabulation of what port on what device goes to what port on another device; and what settings go on each port. If you have a wiring diagram, you end up tracing wires on a big drawing to figure out the connections rather than just looking up the connections.

Other details can be in the tabulation, also.

KISS (you know what that stands for)

Ed


Yes yes and yes!
 
Wow I would love to have received that with my RV. Does anyone know if any company will create wiring diagrams based on an equipment list without the company doing any other work beyond that?

I'l love to get into my panel and clean things up and verify everything is done properly, this would help a LOT!
Yes Steinair will do just the diagram for you if you wish, that is what I went for and did all the rest myself.
 
An Example?

Ed W,

Do you have a "list of pinouts" document you would share?

I'm building my own harnesses and in the middle of creating two documents, a wiring diagram and list of pinouts spreadsheet. The pinout spreadsheet is essential. But I'm also finding the diagram useful for visualizing the overall system, getting a sense of which bundles go to which units, and documenting where shield grounds terminate.

I'd love to do it all with a spreadsheet and you've got me wondering if:
a. you have a format that does all of this or
b. the spreadsheet is sufficient for someone that's done this before but a diagram, at least on paper, is going to be useful while learning. I am only an egg.

Thanks,
Bob
 
I created this schematic document to design (and later, document) N12VD's electronic gizmos. Page 1 is an overall block diagram of the system. Page 2 is the wiring harness, including bulkhead passthroughs and connectors. Page 3 is the CANbus layout. The rest of the pages are wiring schematics for each subsystem.

All 400 circuits are labeled with an alphanumeric name, and those labels are attached to both sides of every wire run in the plane. Connector pinouts are called out in this doc as well. Having this doc ahead of time made building the wiring harness and connecting everything very simple and straightforward. I think I only had about 5 circuits wired incorrectly, mostly Tx and Rx lines switched, and no smoke upon first power-on.
 
N890GF Wiring Diagram

I made my wiring diagram using Google's draw.io (diagrams.net). It was really nice to visualize everything and to have it in digital form allows me to zoom in on things. Definitely helps to check things in the diagram and then in real life to make sure things make sense.
 

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I'm going to subscribe to this thread because of the innovative way you have put the components and wiring in a visual format for us to see and use. These overall system schemes, at first glance, appear to be blocks with threads and those are the black and white ones. Wow when the colored ones show up, well what can I say. Just impressive that you shared this info.
Thank you
 
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All my electrical files are here.

In folder 1) top level schematics is:
  • "Elec Schem N1921R Z101..." is the top-level power schematic.
  • "Elec Schem N1921R Avionics" is the Dynon-centric avionics stuff. I don't draw every wire but rather create lists of connections at devices as I read the installation manuals.
  • And more.

In folder 2) engineering basic stuff is:
  • "Failure Analysis N1921R..."
  • "Load Analysis N1921R…"
  • And more.

I'll fill in missing info and rev the schematics as I wire the AC.
.
 
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Beautiful work Ryan. Really well done compared to my hand written chicken scratching.

What program did you use to create it?

Thanks, Laird

I used a program called eDrawMax. Not too expensive and pretty easy to learn. I chose it because they offer a free trial, and also have a version for Mac.
 
Nice wiring diagram

Really nice work you did there. You have some time put into those drawings. Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I'm going to take a look at the eDrawMax program. Looks good if it's easy enough to learn.

As far as comments regarding wiring diagrams vs schematic diagrams, they are different drawings. Sometimes you need both. Schematics show your circuits and wiring diagrams show how they link together. Often times it's a hybrid drawing. I'm using KiCad to draw up some schematics. It's an open source drawing program (free) specifically for electronics. It is relatively easy to learn but it doesn't look like its as versatile as eDrawMax.

regards,
Dave
 
All my electrical files are here.

In folder 1):
  • "Elec Schem N1921R Z101..." is the top-level power schematic.
  • "Elec Schem N1921R Avionics" is the Dynon-centric avionics stuff. I don't draw every wire but rather create lists of connections at devices as I read the installation manuals.

I'll fill in missing info and rev the schematics as I wire the AC.
.

John’s work is fantastic. He has helped me immeasurably!

Thanks again John!
 
Low-tech

Am I the only one who does it this way? Maybe just the only one not too proud to show my low-tech version.
 

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Nope.

I have several just like it for another business I had. They weren't as complex but they did look essentially just like that.
 
Am I the only one who does it this way? Maybe just the only one not too proud to show my low-tech version.

NOPE!!

You are not alone. :)

Been going through some handwritten notes from years ago for work on upcoming panel upgrade.
 
Am I the only one who does it this way? Maybe just the only one not too proud to show my low-tech version.

Yours is very high tech compared to what I used during the build.

img_4474-1024x498.jpg


Huge version here:

http://www.rv8.ch/wp-content/uploads/2018/10/img_4474.jpg

I did my nice drawings later for the POH/AFM.
 
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Mines the same!

Randall,
Mine is exactly like yours, as I built most of mine in the Jurassic , Pre-computer savvy age. It is easy for me to read, I have made revisions, ect. I always planned to make modernized version, but really no need. Kind of proud of my "napkin sketch " diagram! I'm currently installing my ADSB GDL-82, G5, and GMU11, and they will get the same treatment.
 
Mine is drawn by hand too except it is on many pages in the build logs. A page for each component, flaps, com, mags, etc.
 
well

I started do it this way, but the Garmin G3x just got too confusing. so i learnt Visio; still wish i hadn't had to learn that thou because it is a little painful to use.
 
Here is an example of my diagrams. They are the same format as Garmin uses in their G3X documentation, all done in Power Point. Once the individual diagram blocks are built up, it is a matter of copy and paste and relabel.

Slide10.jpg
[/url][/IMG]

Here is the location of the full Power Point file on Google docs if you want a copy:

https://docs.google.com/presentatio...ourcekey=0-AGB7m9i66jiYM7a5hZOpfg#slide=id.p1

Here is the thread I posted on how I constructed the entire electrical system:

https://vansairforce.net/community/showthread.php?t=152279
 
Mine are here. They are for my day VFR RV-3B.

It will have external lights and an autopilot, but only one EFIS, battery or alternator. The EFIS and related accessories are Dynon, the com radio is Trig. It has ADS-B. Instead of the Dynon network hub, it uses Gil Alexander's most excellent kit hub.

The schematics were drawn using the free Graphic program on a Mac.

Dave
 
Here is an example of my diagrams. They are the same format as Garmin uses in their G3X documentation, all done in Power Point. Once the individual diagram blocks are built up, it is a matter of copy and paste and relabel.

Slide10.jpg
[/url][/IMG]

Here is the location of the full Power Point file on Google docs if you want a copy:

https://docs.google.com/presentatio...ourcekey=0-AGB7m9i66jiYM7a5hZOpfg#slide=id.p1

Here is the thread I posted on how I constructed the entire electrical system:

https://vansairforce.net/community/showthread.php?t=152279

For the benefit of those of us not familiar with the garmin diagrams, what do the various numbers represent?
 
Power & Ground Wiring

leok,

You show multiple independent power feeds to GTN 650 as if it had redundant power inputs like G3X but it does not. Power from a single source should go to both pins 19 & 20 on connector P1001. A single pin cannot handle enough current so Garmin uses both pins 19 & 20 simultaneously. Same goes for ground wiring. Both pins 77 & 78 need to be connected to ground. The installation manual has a typical installation interconnect figure that would be good to review.
 
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I like the pin-out tables from the manufacturers' documentation for installation. But, once its all put together and you have a gripe, it handy to have a 'functional' wiring diagram for the system. Besides, doing this before diving into the install helps me to resolve differences in terminology between manufacturers, and helps to visualize how its all gonna go together.

It gets pretty complicated if you try to show all the interconnecting wiring between say, a GTN750, a fancy audio panel and an EFIS display. But, a 'functional' diagram just breaks it out by system (i.e. Com 1, Nav 2, GPS 1, Starter, etc...).

Here's one of my wiring diagrams (I'm just starting on this part so, this is the only one I'm ready to share):

51898459072_892dc5f298_c.jpg
 
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not just P1001

from post #34 said:
leok,

You show multiple independent power feeds to GTN 650 as if it had redundant power inputs like G3X but it does not. Power from a single source should go to both pins 19 & 20 on connector P1001. A single pin cannot handle enough current so Garmin uses both pins 19 & 20 simultaneously. Same goes for ground wiring. Both pins 77 & 78 need to be connected to ground. The installation manual has a typical installation interconnect figure that would be good to review.

Note this applies to P1001, P1003, and P1004 of the GTN 650/750. In the case of the comm, P1003, three terminals are used because the comm draws more current.
.
 

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Hmm. If it's a functional diagram, do you need to show the power and ground wires?

Also, if pairs of pins need to be connected together, you could show that right at the box, not at a distance.

For what it's worth...
 
Hmm. If it's a functional diagram, do you need to show the power and ground wires?

Also, if pairs of pins need to be connected together, you could show that right at the box, not at a distance.

For what it's worth...

For the first question, the idea was that if there's a gripe on COM 1, I could look at one diagram and get a quick visual on how COM 1 is wired. I'm comfortable with wiring diagrams. And, with so many different ways to handle terminations, I try to keep the diagrams looking like the way I expect to see the physical wires in the airplane. It may not meet all the professional technical standards. But, I hope it does at least make sense. And, as far as that particular diagram goes, I was very unhappy with the documentation from Dynon for the SV-COM-X25 radio system.

As for connecting pins together: I was never 100% clear why a piece of gear would have two power pins and two ground pins that just get connected together. But, I thought I'd read somewhere years ago that the idea was to have both wire runs terminate at the source/ground stud.

I'm not an engineer, draftsman, or technical writer. I'd love hear any suggestions you have to improve my project.
 
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redundancy and connector current capacity

N804RV said:
.
.
.
As for connecting pins together: I was never 100% clear why a piece of gear would have two power pins and two ground pins that just get connected together. But, I thought I'd read somewhere years ago that the idea was to have both wire runs terminate at the source/ground stud.
.
.
.

Two reasons for dual (or triple or more) connections that I know of:
  • Redundancy:
    • For instance B&C shows dual ground connections for LR3 and SB1 regulators, one to connector and one to stud on regulator case.
    • My FMEA for the electronic fuel injection I am installing leads me to install redundant grounds for both the computer and the driver sections of the ECU.
    • Grounds are independent where they connect to the aircraft.
    • Failure of one ground is benign in flight and not detectable at preflight so physical inspection at annual inspection is called for.
  • Connector pin/socket current capability:
    • Avionics manufacturers use multiple pins for power and ground due to current capacity limits of individual pin/sockets. These are not diode OR’d unless specifically stated in the installation manual.
    • Ref Bob Nuckolls Conducting High Currents through D-Sub Connectors, the size 20 (awg max) pins used in D-sub connectors can share a load better with pigtail wires added as resistors to balance the load through the pins, 12” of 22 awg or 20” of 20 awg.

BTW pin/socket current capability is not a set number. Like wires in a bundle, multiple pins carrying current in a connector generate heat and reduce rating.
.
 
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leok,

You show multiple independent power feeds to GTN 650 as if it had redundant power inputs like G3X but it does not. Power from a single source should go to both pins 19 & 20 on connector P1001. A single pin cannot handle enough current so Garmin uses both pins 19 & 20 simultaneously. Same goes for ground wiring. Both pins 77 & 78 need to be connected to ground. The installation manual has a typical installation interconnect figure that would be good to review.

Correct. Most of the Garmin devices have two power/ground pins for redundancy and so can source from two different locations such as maim/back up power busses. Either or both can supply the power separately or together (for a seamless transition if one source is lost)

So far as I am aware, only the GTN 650/750 has multiple pins to carry the full current load, so requires all legs to be live at the same time. Therefore, only one power source (such as a multi buss system) can be connected. I chose to run separate wires back to the main buss rather than tie the pins together with a splice or jumper. The power wires tie together at the buss.

Running power as if the power sources were redundant was an error I caught early enough in the diagram stage to correct without needed to rewire anything. I did add e-buss power feed through diodes as a redundancy, but don't recall if I ever updated the drawing to 'as-built' status on this item.
 
Since my skills do not include computer programs for laying out wiring diagrams, my method is decidedly old school: pencil and paper

If you see anything worth changing, pipe up, please.

View attachment 23125

I strongly recommend you use an EngineBridge or EICommander so that you will know what's happening on your pmags, and for ease of adjustment.

https://www.enginebridge.com/product/eiwifi/

https://eicommander.com

For the wiring, I think you need a way to apply 12v when the mags are grounded in order to do the timing. There's a great thread on this, and here's my wiring diagram:

https://vansairforce.net/community/showpost.php?p=1403570&postcount=55
 
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I strongly recommend you use an EngineBridge or EICommander so that you will know what's happening on your pmags, and for ease of adjustment.

https://www.enginebridge.com/product/eiwifi/

https://eicommander.com

For the wiring, I think you need a way to apply 12v when the mags are grounded in order to do the timing. There's a great thread on this, and here's my wiring diagram:

https://vansairforce.net/community/showpost.php?p=1403570&postcount=55


Just a friendly reminder, the 6cyl Pmags are being installed in more aircraft daily. These products aren’t supported on the 6cyl Pmags, at least not at the moment.
 
I strongly recommend you use an EngineBridge or EICommander so that you will know what's happening on your pmags, and for ease of adjustment.

https://www.enginebridge.com/product/eiwifi/

https://eicommander.com

For the wiring, I think you need a way to apply 12v when the mags are grounded in order to do the timing. There's a great thread on this, and here's my wiring diagram:

https://vansairforce.net/community/showpost.php?p=1403570&postcount=55

Your diagram is similar to mine, I think, with four differences:

1. Yours is significantly more professional and easier to read

2. Your switches are between your breakers and the Pmags, while mine are after the breakers (either way is recommended by EMag). The only reason I put the switches after the breakers is so if the switches ever failed, the Emags would still see power, albeit redundant since they have internal power.

3. It looks like you have a separate switch for testing (maint) the internal power of the Emags when the 2TL1-10's are in the center position. I tried to incorporate this feature in the center position of the 2TL1-10's by not having anything connected to those poles of the switch. Basically, the same as your setup but no separate switch to turn off ship power to the Emags. I like the LED for determining if the maint circuit is closed, although wouldn't this mean the LED is always on unless the test switch is opened? Obviously, my wiring diagram skills are supremely limited so forgive the question since I probably just don't understand what I'm looking at.

4. And, the most significant difference: In the up position (probably upside down, as drawn, but no matter) the P lead is killed (grounded) but the Pmag has +12v power when the (maint) switch is closed. Mine can't do this. This is the part I don't understand. Why do you need this ability? It's because I don't understand how the Pmag works.

Thanks for the tip on the EngineBridge. I will definitely look into that.

S
 
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Bypass VPX for P-mag power and use a switchable breaker
Use straight on-off switch for mag switch
Ground to engine rather than firewall
Remove the jumper with a new engine

Pete
 
Bypass VPX for P-mag power and use a switchable breaker
Use straight on-off switch for mag switch
Ground to engine rather than firewall
Remove the jumper with a new engine

Pete

Mine have been running this way for about 10 years. I don't have a VPX, and since the plane already had an old school key switch, that is what is used for the P-leads and start.
 
Bypass VPX for P-mag power and use a switchable breaker
Use straight on-off switch for mag switch
Ground to engine rather than firewall
Remove the jumper with a new engine

Pete

A friend bought an rv7 that had the electronic ignition wired through the vpx. His instructor was fiddling with the vpx, seeing how it worked while on downwind and he managed to to turn it off and the engine quit. They were able to get things relit but decided to make a few wiring changes after that. I guess the lesson learned is that ignition should be considered holy and should not be tainted by any other system. Sorry for thread drift.
 
Standing on the shoulders of others

Boundary Conditions:
Electrically dependent aircraft
EFII (came with Titan Engine)
Monkworkz Back-up gen

This is my proposed single-line functional diagram; no connection points, wire sizes, etc. Only power distribution architecture.

I've bugged a lot of people and I appreciate all of their help. If anyone sees any discrepancies, let me know. I was always a believer but now I've been fully baptized in the Froehlich church of redundancy and symmetry. This is 99.99x% his knowledge and experience. I've stated before, this or similar architecture is appropriate to more aircraft than is initially obvious; even legacy Fuel and Ign aircraft. I believe the redundancy pay for itself in relatively short order by not purchasing dedicated expensive device back-up batteries. Anyway, have at it. Constructive advice would be appreciated.
 

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