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Sim Eng Failure after T/O

Yikes

There was another post on this same subject maybe 6 months ago. At the time, I decided to go out and practice, first starting with pretend hard decks above the field, and eventually working my way down to actual deck conditions. I got pretty good at them, and my confidence was way up at deck plus 700'. Only trouble was I did them all to the left, ie, forgot to practice them to the right.

But that was 6 months ago. After reading all this, I decided I needed to bone up on the procedure, and this time trying them also to the right. One of the guys here talked about "zooming" to the end of the runway, then using inertia to zoom up to altitude---enough to make your turn and get back. I dunno:confused: I didn't have much luck with that. I ran out of airspeed way too quickly for the small amount of altitude I gained. And then, and I really hate to admit this to y'all, but on one to the right, the wing got to low, the beast was shuttering and I darn near bought the farm. Obviously I hit left aileron, which I guess can make the situation worse, and probably stood on left rudder. Probably released a smidgen of back stick too. Anyway, its embarrassing to tell, but I'm here to type it.

Have I got that right? Left aileron, and if no left rudder, would it stall that low right wing quicker?
 
donaziza said:
There was another post on this same subject maybe 6 months ago. At the time, I decided to go out and practice, first starting with pretend hard decks above the field, and eventually working my way down to actual deck conditions. I got pretty good at them, and my confidence was way up at deck plus 700'. Only trouble was I did them all to the left, ie, forgot to practice them to the right.

But that was 6 months ago. After reading all this, I decided I needed to bone up on the procedure, and this time trying them also to the right. One of the guys here talked about "zooming" to the end of the runway, then using inertia to zoom up to altitude---enough to make your turn and get back. I dunno:confused: I didn't have much luck with that. I ran out of airspeed way too quickly for the small amount of altitude I gained. And then, and I really hate to admit this to y'all, but on one to the right, the wing got to low, the beast was shuttering and I darn near bought the farm. Obviously I hit left aileron, which I guess can make the situation worse, and probably stood on left rudder. Probably released a smidgen of back stick too. Anyway, its embarrassing to tell, but I'm here to type it.

Have I got that right? Left aileron, and if no left rudder, would it stall that low right wing quicker?
Click to expand...

If you got the airplane into buffet I would instantly unload the aircraft to get the entire wing flying while adding power. Ball should be kept in the center and ailerons neutral until the wing is fully flying. Then roll to the horizon and begin a smooth pullout as AS rises.
If it were a true engine out then all the same applies except adding power and obviously at that point a controlled crash is the best outcome.
Did you get either a stall or AOA warning before buffet onset?
G
 
Oh yeah----that's what I meant by "the beast was shuddering" I was about 45* right bank, nose low. Did everything you said, and added power and flew out of it. I'll have to go out and try to duplicate this again, but at 5000' instead. I was always a "land straight ahead guy" too, but at the end of my airport and 45* left or right is nothing but commercial buildings.
 
i will make another statement on this and with the accident of the RV10 more thought
Mike Stewart is correct and unless you have practice doing turns along a runway at low altitudes and sharp turns. higher descend rates is something these guys are very good at. We are not. we dont practice like Mike and Jerry and the other folks who fly fast and close to the ground. it is a bit unnerving the first few times you go down a runway Banking 45 degrees left and right down an air strip

acrobatic pilots get use to this stuff and having the ground come rushing up and them practicing all the time keeps them sharp

another thing to practice if you do a lot of night flight over woods and unlit spaces is to practice oscillating stalls. there have been many pilots in light aircraft who have used this method at night to mush into the terrain. letting the wings take a lot of the impact
In a cessna 172 it will come down at about 500-600 fpm at about 45 indicated
FYI
 
sorry smilin' jack,

while it may be an option for a cessna, oscillating stalls are a guarantee for disaster in an rv!!!! please don't even think about it!

stay safe!

regards,
bernie
 
stalls

In the four seat Cherokee it is not a stall. Full flaps and full nose up trim and the nose simply bobs up and down, airspeed very low but no stall. Probably would not work in most airplanes and probably very dependent on a mid range CG.
Yesterday or the day before an Instructor with two students on board, four seat Cherokee, landed on a very busy city street near John Wayne Airport (SNA). There doesn't appear to be a scratch on the airplane. Nice job.
 
Maintain Control

Arlen said:
Two points:

First, in the "impossible turn," there is said to be a tremendous "ground rush" effect when in the steep bank descending turnback attitude ----> MANY competent pilots feel compelled to pull up....and then it's all over. You can't simulate that ground rush at 3000 feet.

Secondly, in the straight ahead (or few-degrees-left-or-right) emergency landing: airplanes that land under control, without stalling, with wings level....usually have survivors on board.
Click to expand...

Of everything posted on this subject, this is by far the MOST IMPORTANT point. You simply MUST maintain CONTROL. You MUST keep the aircraft above stall speed and, in the RV, you should avoid the low speed, high rate of descent regime - usually less than 60 knots.

Loss of CONTROL at low altitude is the big killer in general aviation. The immediate turn back to the runway is a perfectly viable tactic. But, we must all remember that saving the airplane isn't the objective. Don't trade those last few, precious knots in an attempt to make the runway. Accept your fate, keep the airplane under control, AVOID THE BIG OBSTACLES, and bring her back to earth under control. Any landing you can walk away from . . .
 
Bernie,
I will respectfully disagree. In my RV7 I can do oscillating stalls and both the rudder and ailerons are both still effective in the stall. My indicated airspeed is approximately 54mph and my rate of descend is 650 to 700 Feet per minute.

I have done this from 3000 feet MSL to 1500 feet msl. The RV shutters alot from the buffeting. but it is totally controllable. She pitches up and down quite a bit... but my whole point was.. if your coming down with no power at night.. what is better 85-90 glide and 500 -600 feet per minute or 53 mph?

Like any thing you attempt in an aircraft. You must practice this stuff. Be able to do it on the guages if your IFR .There are a lot of normal pilots out there where the last time they did a stall was for their private pilot certificate. I see it all the time in Biennial flight reviews I see normal pilots who have told me they never practice stalls with excuses like. I only fly from point A-B. Why should I ?

Just my thoughts... Your choice... I have made mine.


Jack
 
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