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  #31  
Old 03-20-2021, 07:23 AM
Walt's Avatar
Walt Walt is online now
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Dallas/Ft Worth, TX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skykingbob View Post
So Walt....what are your connectors of choice?
1) no connector whenever possible
2) Amp butt splice
3) D-sub
4) CPC
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EXP Aircraft Services LLC
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  #32  
Old 03-20-2021, 07:51 AM
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9GT 9GT is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Southern Michigan
Posts: 2,105
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When we built the Cozy MKIV, Blue Mountain was first in the game with an electronic CB power distribution module board. It had a 1/4-20 lug for the power in and those green Phoenix connectors on the board for circuit connections. In addition to a couple of the circuit breaker self destructing, those Phoenix connectors were an early source of electrical gremlins with the clamp down screws vibrating loose even when torqued way down. We solved the problem by using a dab of blue Loctite on the clamp screw threads. Even the nut on the 1/4-20 lug bolt would come loose with a lock washer. We used the green wicking Loctite on that. I don't like using Loctite on electrical connections but in this case we ran out of ideas. I think those screws that have a key cut in them with the plastic(?) insert for locking the screw in would help. This image is an example I am thinking about:
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David C.
Howell, MI
RV-10: #41686 Under Construction
RV-9A: #90949 Under Construction
RV-10: #40637 Completed/Sold 2016
Cozy MKIV:#656 Completed/Sold 2007
"Donor Exempt" but donated through Dec. 2021

Last edited by 9GT : 03-20-2021 at 07:58 AM.
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  #33  
Old 03-20-2021, 05:35 PM
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Paul from Flyleds Paul from Flyleds is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 190
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Hi Buck

The choice of connectors for my products has always been a considered one, and every one of them has compromises.
Price was not the first priority.

For your WigWag Module, the spring grip connector chosen was selected for its wire retaining capabilities, its lack of screws, ease of use, 16 amps current capability, and its ability to take wire up to 14AWG. The manufacturer claims the wire pull-out test passes IEC 60999-1.

I also deliberately oriented the terminal block on the PCB so that the wires lay across the face of module, rather than off the edge, to encourage the wires to be cable tied to the module to provide mechanical relief. The module is so small and lightweight that I envisaged that it would get installed into many a flying plane by simply cable tieing it out of the way behind the panel to something random such as a nearby wire bundle, securing the wires in the process.
In your case with your WigWag Module mounted to a panel (nice to see, thank you!), additional mechanical strain relief could be provided for the wires less than two inches away from the terminal block.

I did consider making the module fit into a DB15 or DB25 connector housing, however crimp pin connectors will only carry 5 amps, so you'd need to externally join 4x 20AWG wires to the one 14AWG wire to carry the same amount of current into the module, and then make another two external joins to cater for the two 10 amp loads. Messy (in my opinion), time consuming, two or three times the size and weight, another $12 cost for a crimp pin plug, requires extra solder splices, and inconvenient when compared to pushing home a single existing wire into a spring terminal block.

For the white Combo light connector I'd very much welcome your perusal of the Mouser or Digikey etc catalogue (Amazon, no thanks.) and I genuinely look forward to your suggestions for a better connector that is compact in size, will take 18AWG wire and is able to be surface mount soldered onto an aluminium PCB. The one I selected requires a minimum of 50 newtons of force (5kg from what I can work out) according to the data sheet to pull the wire from the socket.
I encourage you to add mechanical strain relief to the wires close by because I think you'll rip the connector off the board before the wires will come out!

I don't know what the third product is in your photos, but you'll note that the terminal block has a metal tab that clamps the wire into the terminal, rather than the screws making direct contact with (and very likely breaking) the wire strands.
Crimp or boot-lace ferrules are not needed for this reason according to the terminal manufacturers as shown above, but feel free to use them. I hope you've bought that $200+ crimp tool as well!
You could also use some nail polish (or the preferred aviation equivalent!) on the heads of the screws to stop them turning themselves loose.


I have to say I'm confused by your statement "To be VERY clear, these are sample photos of the type of connectors I'm referring to, not photos of my project!"
If you have an actual fault with or would like to return your Combo lights and Wigwag module, please contact either Flyboy Accessories or myself directly. Ultimately I think you'll be missing out on some great products if you do return them, but we would be happy to help you out, even 18 months after your purchase date.

If I have a design flaw with my products I'm very interested to hear from anyone about it so I can make Flyleds products the best they can be.


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  #34  
Old 03-20-2021, 06:11 PM
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vlittle vlittle is offline
 
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I’m an EE with well over 40 years designing systems, boards and semiconductors. In my experience, connectors and sockets of any kind need careful attention to detail.

If you own your aircraft long enough, eventually every connector will fail. Best to minimize them if you can.

This board, which I designed 40 years ago used to have sockets for the square hybrid devices. Our mechanical engineers engaged a major US connector manufacturer to design them. Unfortunately, the connectors failed so often that we had to eliminate them (the connectors, not the engineers). This board was purchased off ebay as a souvenir as a fully functional device.

A prize to whomever can identify this board by function.

Vern

Click image for larger version

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===========
V e r n. ====
=======
RV-9A complete
Harmon Rocket complete
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The VV in huVVer.tech
Victoria, BC (Summer)
Chandler, Az (Winter)

Last edited by vlittle : 03-20-2021 at 06:26 PM.
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  #35  
Old 03-20-2021, 06:36 PM
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BuckWynd BuckWynd is offline
 
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Location: Rockford, IL
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Hi Paul,

Thank you for your explanation of your rationale to use the push-in connectors on your product. I genuinely appreciate you taking the considerable time to do that.

I understand the need to use something that will carry the amps, accommodate the wires, and be relatively user-friendly for the end user. My comment was in response to a wire that simply pulled out of a connector under what I consider to have been minimal tension -- certainly far lass than what I apply to every one of my ring-terminal connections after I crimp them. This was caught before it had a chance to cause a problem, and it was on a product that was not flight critical. It was merely annoying. Upon further investigation, when the wire was re-installed into the connector, it seemed to be tight and secure -- but then again, it did the first time I installed it, too... so time will tell. But I'm currently satisfied enough to say it's good to go.

The Euro connector that failed, however, was on an ignition controller module that is VERY flight critical, and I was once again astonished that those are standard on that unit. That was on a different airplane, and the little 22 AWG wire simply broke underneath the screw after 100 hours of flying.

For a lighting unit, I honestly don't know, off the top of my head, what kind of connector would be better for a unit that has to carry 5+ amps per pin. If I was designing something like that myself, I'd probably further reduce the chances of an installation error by factory-soldering 18 AWG power wires to the board and providing some kind of built-in strain relief for them on the board or in a housing, and terminating them outside the housing with heavy-duty, locking automotive-style connectors of some kind. But that's just me. And my product would probably be too expensive and no one would buy it.

Sorry I ranted against the Molex Lite-Trap connectors. My first impression was "YGBSM." But I will give them the benefit of the doubt and see how things go in actual operation.

The green terminal blocks? Not a fan. Never will be, sorry.

(And for those of you saying that I should have ferrules on my bare wires, please show me in the various installation manuals where it specifies anything but bare wires.)
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Last edited by BuckWynd : 03-20-2021 at 06:50 PM.
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  #36  
Old 03-20-2021, 08:57 PM
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fl-mike fl-mike is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vlittle View Post

A prize to whomever can identify this board by function.

Vern

Attachment 9519
Iím going with PBX card.
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Venice, FL
RV-6A. Mattituck TMX O-360, FP, GRT Sport EFIS, L3 Lynx NGT-9000
N164WM
N184WM reserved (RV-8)....finishing kit in progress. Titan IOX-370
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  #37  
Old 03-20-2021, 10:10 PM
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DrillBit DrillBit is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vlittle View Post
A prize to whomever can identify this board by function.

Vern
Elementary! Obviously a flux capacitator controller for RV's. Future-proofed design too--I see up to RV24 on the board.

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P-town, CA (10 min from KLVK!)
N748PK, RV-9A
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  #38  
Old 03-20-2021, 11:54 PM
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Steve Melton Steve Melton is offline
 
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Location: Cincinnati, OH
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bpattonsoa View Post
Molex is the scourge of a wiring system, they have no excuse for existing. Radio Shack featured them, what more can you say?
I have no Molex connectors in my aircraft. None.
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RV-9A, Tip-up, Superior O-320, roller lifters, 160HP, WW 200RV, dual impulse slick mags, oil pressure = 65 psi, EGT = 1300F, flight hours = 900+ for all

Simplicity is the art in design.
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  #39  
Old 03-21-2021, 03:28 AM
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akschu akschu is offline
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Houston, Alaska
Posts: 324
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vlittle View Post
Iím an EE with well over 40 years designing systems, boards and semiconductors. In my experience, connectors and sockets of any kind need careful attention to detail.

If you own your aircraft long enough, eventually every connector will fail. Best to minimize them if you can.

This board, which I designed 40 years ago used to have sockets for the square hybrid devices. Our mechanical engineers engaged a major US connector manufacturer to design them. Unfortunately, the connectors failed so often that we had to eliminate them (the connectors, not the engineers). This board was purchased off ebay as a souvenir as a fully functional device.

A prize to whomever can identify this board by function.

Vern

Attachment 9519
It appears to be the same circuit replicated over and over, so probably no an early pc, and it appears to be a line card of some kind. I agree with the other poster itís telephony related. Iím going to guess an ISDN card.
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  #40  
Old 03-21-2021, 04:57 AM
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PaulvS PaulvS is offline
 
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Location: Western Australia
Posts: 567
Default The board

Quote:
Originally Posted by vlittle View Post
Iím an EE with well over 40 years designing systems, boards and semiconductors. In my experience, connectors and sockets of any kind need careful attention to detail.

If you own your aircraft long enough, eventually every connector will fail. Best to minimize them if you can.

This board, which I designed 40 years ago used to have sockets for the square hybrid devices. Our mechanical engineers engaged a major US connector manufacturer to design them. Unfortunately, the connectors failed so often that we had to eliminate them (the connectors, not the engineers). This board was purchased off ebay as a souvenir as a fully functional device.

A prize to whomever can identify this board by function.

Vern

Attachment 9519
The board has got 8 modules so that implies it is the heart of an ignition control system for a 1980's V8 Cadillac. Did I win the prize?
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