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NavMonster.com Going Back Online ....

DeltaRomeo

DeltaRomeo

doug reeves: unfluencer
Staff member
http://beta.navmonster.com/

"Good news! You spoke (in volumes!) and we've listened. We got all the lawyers and programmers together from both sides, and after some good discussions, an agreement has been reached. No more patent infringement worries.

Since the site is already down, we're taking the opportunity to change a few things around. But NavMonster should be back, stronger than ever, on the first of the new year.

Thanks for all the well wishes and words of encouragement. Happy New Year, and safe flying."

Marc Alexander
[email protected]
Dec 31, 2010
 
Searching the text for meaning

DeltaRomeo said:
http://beta.navmonster.com/

"Good news! You spoke (in volumes!) and we've listened. We got all the lawyers and programmers together from both sides, and after some good discussions, an agreement has been reached. No more patent infringement worries.

Since the site is already down, we're taking the opportunity to change a few things around. But NavMonster should be back, stronger than ever, on the first of the new year.

Thanks for all the well wishes and words of encouragement. Happy New Year, and safe flying."

Marc Alexander
[email protected]
Dec 31, 2010
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Good news indeed. I really like NavMonster.

This seems to say pretty clearly that FlightPrep was part of the discussion. It also seems to say that they don't think that NavMonster was infringing. It could therefore be read to say that NavMonster went off prematurely. Whether or not FlightPrep initiated the conversation, the result sounds good. Is nobody re-thinking the "evil FlightPrep" assumption even a little?

Would Microsoft or Paul Allen, to take recent examples, have done the same? Anyone boycotting them?
 
hevansrv7a said:
Would Microsoft or Paul Allen, to take recent examples, have done the same? Anyone boycotting them?
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I chose to avoid Microsoft products whenever possible decades ago because I didn't care for their business practices. As a software engineer this probably didn't help my career. Thank goodness that other technologies have prevailed.
 
hevansrv7a said:
This seems to say pretty clearly that FlightPrep was part of the discussion. It also seems to say that they don't think that NavMonster was infringing. It could therefore be read to say that NavMonster went off prematurely. Whether or not FlightPrep initiated the conversation, the result sounds good. Is nobody re-thinking the "evil FlightPrep" assumption even a little?
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I think you are reading a lot into this email. More likely, they talked to their own lawyer and he told FlightPrep to pound sand. Or they caved and worked a deal.

And yep - I still think FlightPrep is evil :)

...Paul Allen, to take recent examples, have done the same? Anyone boycotting them?
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As much as I can. Interval Research was a laughing stock back when it existed in the valley - and now it is a home to patent trolls. Paul Allen is not doing good.
 
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eric_marsh said:
I chose to avoid Microsoft products whenever possible decades ago because I didn't care for their business practices. As a software engineer this probably didn't help my career. Thank goodness that other technologies have prevailed.
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Just to even things out...............I like Microsoft stuff....

L.Adamson ---- RV6A
 
I love NavMonster...how wonderful! Here's hoping Dave Parsons and RF works out something as well. That would probably be a better test of the "evil" in FlightPrep since Dave used actual sectionals in his program. But here's hoping! As for Paul Allen, he can't he even run a sports franchise...but then I gave up on those guys long ago and went to Mac and I'm not turning back.
 
It is amazing what happens when people talk to each other. I bust my attorneys chops all the time because they will not pick up the phone and call the other side. When they do, we get things done. Egos are a hard thing to manage.
..... I use both Microsoft and Apple. Hate Microsoft.... Love my Mac.
 
DeltaRomeo said:
We got all the lawyers and programmers together from both sides, and after some good discussions, an agreement has been reached.
Click to expand...

Seems to me that the details of the agreement are going to tell the story of what happened.

Could be anything from "pound sand" to "here is the non disclosure agreement, and we will pay x% royalties"

Not enough data to draw a conclusion as I see it.
 
I sure hope it isn't just a ploy to show some kind of "good faith" to strengthen their position against Dave. That is what it smells like to me anyway.
 
I just hope it all works out. And to show how far behind I am, I don't like Microsoft and am not too keen on Apple, but my Amiga only does dial-up...

Bob
 
Something just doesn't smell right. "Reaching an agreement" leads me believe they cracked a deal with Flightprep and puts them in the same camp as the ****'s at Skyvector who bit this poison apple first.

Just an assumption on my part; and we all know what assumptions do.

That messaging just doesn't feel right.
 
Phil said:
Something just doesn't smell right. "Reaching an agreement" leads me believe they cracked a deal with Flightprep and puts them in the same camp as the ****'s at Skyvector who bit this poison apple first.

Just an assumption on my part; and we all know what assumptions do.

That messaging just doesn't feel right.
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Well... I emailed them for clarification. :)
 
Phil said:
Something just doesn't smell right. "Reaching an agreement" leads me believe they cracked a deal with Flightprep and puts them in the same camp as the ****'s at Skyvector who bit this poison apple first.

Just an assumption on my part; and we all know what assumptions do.

That messaging just doesn't feel right.
Click to expand...

Phil,
I gotta agree...it doesn't pass the smell test. I had the same reaction you did when I read the release.

Rick,
Let us know what they say...
 
I still wouldn't buy anything from FlightPrep or anyone that would sell any product by them.
 
Apple or Microsoft?

A long time ago I helped start a desktop publishing company. I was a big fan of Mac... The owner told me "You can buy anything you want as long as it's not Mac." I suggested that Mac would be the best choice for the job, to which he replied "Mac is ok for desktop publishing, but the rest of the world uses Microsoft." So we went with Microsoft... The best advice EVER! Having to constantly fix problems with Microsoft products paid for my RV :)
 
Has anybody heard anything from Marc? I've emailed him a few times with no response. The total lack of communication sounds like he signed the confidentiality agreement with them.
 
I had never used NavMonster, but checked it out today. When you click on Map they don't draw a line between the two airports.. so I guess that would mean they don't infringe... easy (and crappy) way to work around the problem..
 
It now defaults you to the weather page after entering route information, and that is different behavior than before...and in my opinion a usability improvement. The rest of it, including the map page which does draw a line, works the same as before. At least as far as I can remember about how it worked before the flightprep hoopla.
 
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I make my living using Microsoft .Net developer tools, but my primary computer is a Mac. Without Ms I would not have the ability to build/own my RV.
 
Marc's presentation of the weather page, bar none (IMO), is the best around. I'm VERY glad the site's back up. If you haven't tried it yet, go to the home page, enter your depature airport and destination and any waypoints enroute, then click the weather tab. The presentation of the combined Metars and TAFs, and the Winds Aloft along the way, along with the ease of accessing the Progs, Airmets, etc. is fantastic.

Personally I don't care if he draws a line or not (and I sincerely hope someone soon invalidates FlightPreps ridiculous patent for this).... I'm very thankful to have my favorite weather planning site back!!!!!
 
Davepar said:
Has anybody heard anything from Marc? I've emailed him a few times with no response. The total lack of communication sounds like he signed the confidentiality agreement with them.
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Nothing here... I emailed the address listed on the placeholder page and then used the contact form when the site was back up.

I imagine lots of folks are asking...
 
Steve, try weathermeister.com

My recollection is that it is even better. Since this may be my first time on navmonster, did it ever show restricted areas/MOAs, etc on a sectional type map
 
Phil said:
Something just doesn't smell right. "Reaching an agreement" leads me believe they cracked a deal with Flightprep and puts them in the same camp as the ****'s at Skyvector who bit this poison apple first.

Just an assumption on my part; and we all know what assumptions do.

That messaging just doesn't feel right.
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I think you might be right! Especially since Sectional Charts on NavMonster are linked to the SkyVector site... who are licenced by Flightprep. The way I see it... If you support NavMonster, you support SkyVector, which means you're ultimately supporting Flightprep:confused:
 
give Marc a chance

Guys please,
I live in the neighborhood with Marc and know him. Please be patient and stop jumping to conclusions.

First, he has a real day job like rest of us and navmonster is something he did just to try and make planning easier (probably for himself then he shared it). He makes NO money to speak of from it. Enough to pay for the host servers and buy him a few cups of coffee. Look at his advertisers, there are hardly none! (I'm sure Doug Reeves can attest to this) And every time you go there to get quick winds aloft, what do you pay? $0

Just like the other sites involved, he has had lots of people wanting to help and get his site back up. Some of the help might be lawers or company CEO's with lawyers on staff who offered to help "talk" for him. I think as long as they "talked" he can put the site back up for safety. Now countless pilots can use it again.

NOTHING that i know of has been agreed on or changed. I don't speak for Marc, but i have spoken to him and he keeps saying that he must keep quiet on this right now. Trust me, he wants to defend himself and say a lot, but right now WE the users and GA population need to be speaking out. And not at Marc, but at flightprep. Has everyone who commented on this forum topic signed the "www.boycottflightprep.com" petition? There are only 1100 signatures and there are WAY more visitors to this site.

I hope everyone here stops jumping to conclusions. There is a lot of guessing going on. There are even "false statements" coming from the alphabet club. I know because i got one and shared it with someone else who got a different answer from them. ( a big alphabet name).

So, please take it easy on Marc. He told me he is getting a ton of email and responses on this matter. 95% of it great, but i saw one negative email toward him that was just mean and not called for.

Remember it is a FREE service he puts out there. Use it if you want or leave it alone.

This is just my own opinions and not Marc's. I wanted to defend him here.
Jeff Harrell
austin tx
 
Blue Lion said:
I think you might be right! Especially since Sectional Charts on NavMonster are linked to the SkyVector site... who are licenced by Flightprep. The way I see it... If you support NavMonster, you support SkyVector, which means you're ultimately supporting Flightprep:confused:
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Sure you're right. SkyVector validated FlightPrep so anything that furthers the survival of SkyVector is a win for FlightPrep. Duh! I'm thinking the lawyers in the room decided that we wouldn't see through this manipulation. I think these lawyers should be identified so I don't accidentally ever hire one!
 
@Rivethead, I think you're confusing copyright with trademark. Monster is an online job search website that goes after anyone that uses monster in their name. Probably haven't got around to navmonster yet.
 
Snowflake said:
@Rivethead, I think you're confusing copyright with trademark. Monster is an online job search website that goes after anyone that uses monster in their name. Probably haven't got around to navmonster yet.
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What about Monster Cable? This abuse of patent and copyright law needs to be fixed. I hear they are putting patents on DNA sequences. Is there anthing more fundamental to who were are than our DNA? I wonder if I can patent the cardio-vascular system. I will charge a license fee for breathing.

Anyways, this FlightPrep stuff hits close to home. I am really hoping this outrage doesn't die down and the behaviour affects their bottom line in a very negative way.
 
milestogo said:
Anyways, this FlightPrep stuff hits close to home. I am really hoping this outrage doesn't die down and the behaviour affects their bottom line in a very negative way.
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The problem is: even if the pilot community boycotts FlightPrep, if website operators pay the extortion it can be a net win $ wise for these patent trolls.
 
Hard for to believe this will die and will not affect FlightPrep's bottom line. It most likely is already. You can visit just about ANY aviation related forum and there is a FlightPrep/RunwayFinder thread. There is overwhelming support for Dave Parsons at RunwayFinder and an overwhelming condemnation of FlightPrep. Take a look on the AOPA forums, look at any of the type forums like the Cessna 180 forum, etc. On the social media, Twitter, Facebook etc., the opinions are the same.

We should continue to ensure all are aware. And ensure all they can help RunwayFinder with a donation. The GA population is a small group with a long memory.
 
Stronger?

"...NavMonster should be back, stronger than ever,..."

Didn't anyone notice that there are no routing lines drawn on a map anymore?
Don't get me wrong, i LOVE the weather decoding but I also depended on being able to see TFR in glorious detail.

If the only issue in avoiding patent troubles is drawing the "Line", any chance there could still be a map displayed without the route shown but with the TFRs on it?
 
I think the default page just changed. If you click, map a few buttons to the right, I think you get the same map with a line as before.

FWIW, I like the change...first thing I did pre-FPBS was click on the now defaulted page.

-Jim
 
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