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How to set these?

G

Girraf

Well Known Member
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Anyone have any suggestions for how to set these? Clearance is extremely tight for my tungsten bar and a 4" no hole yoke. Anyone use pull rivets here? These are the final rivets for my vertical stab and I set it aside a few weeks ago thinking I would have an epiphany at some point but I haven't come up with any grand ideas yet.

i-CXXbNw8-L.jpg


i-6QZdJGC-L.jpg
 
Grind a relief in the bucking bar.
And gauge your -4 shop heads. Look a little under driven, but could be the angle.
 
Back Rivet with an extended off set ATS 2470-12D,lots of masking tape so you don't mark things up.
 
fl-mike said:
Grind a relief in the bucking bar.
And gauge your -4 shop heads. Look a little under driven, but could be the angle.
Click to expand...

It?s a camera trick. All those -4 rivets were gauged and are good to go. In fact I found the called out rivets to be longer than necessary. The shop heads are actually too wide to fit inside the gauge (yep using the correct gauge!) but they could be squished a little more if a larger diameter was acceptable.

Hasn?t considered back riveting. I?ll have to investigate that further.
 
Tom023 said:
Check the EAA.org video section for ?Indirect Riveting?
Click to expand...

Just checked out that video. I still need to fab up the steel tool that has the female 3/32 dimple in it which could double as that indirect rivet plate. I?ll try again on the no hole 4? yoke but I think this indirect method might be the way to go.
 
Have you bucked with the angled end of the tungsten bar yet? It should do that but practice and understand the dynamics before trying this.
 
Not sure what tungsten bar you have but you should be able to get to them with it. They won't be centered on the bar but you will have to learn how to adjust for that eventually so might as well be now.

I have custom ground/modified many steel bucking bars but no way am I grinding on my tungsten bar. The one I have helped me build the majority of my 7 and the emp parts of my 10 and works great in almost all situations without modification.

Mine looks something like this:
AcPI9Q7m.jpg

NCigv0Ym.jpg


The 4" no hole should also work OK with these. Use a 3/8" dia flat set on the ram to make sure you get all of the manufactured head under the set. The flat spot on the yoke is large and should be fairly forgiving.
 
Brantel said:
Not sure what tungsten bar you have but you should be able to get to them with it. They won't be centered on the bar but you will have to learn how to adjust for that eventually so might as well be now.

I have custom ground/modified many steel bucking bars but no way am I grinding on my tungsten bar. The one I have helped me build the majority of my 7 and the emp parts of my 10 and works great in almost all situations without modification.

Mine looks something like this:
AcPI9Q7m.jpg

NCigv0Ym.jpg


The 4" no hole should also work OK with these. Use a 3/8" dia flat set on the ram to make sure you get all of the manufactured head under the set. The flat spot on the yoke is large and should be fairly forgiving.
Click to expand...

I have that same bar. Seemed to be the most popular style among builders so I followed suit. I took a look at the geometry and using the angle face should work well.

Appreciate all the suggestions
 
Girraf said:
It’s a camera trick. All those -4 rivets were gauged and are good to go. In fact I found the called out rivets to be longer than necessary. The shop heads are actually too wide to fit inside the gauge (yep using the correct gauge!) but they could be squished a little more if a larger diameter was acceptable.

Hasn’t considered back riveting. I’ll have to investigate that further.
Click to expand...

Yes, but the plans show the manufactured head on the side shown in the pics. Your rivets go the other way. :)

That alone would give a little more room for getting at the -3 rivets.
 
az_gila said:
Yes, but the plans show the manufactured head on the side shown in the pics. Your rivets go the other way. :)

That alone would give a little more room for getting at the -3 rivets.
Click to expand...

Only statement I can find on the drawing that speaks to a particular direction the rivet needs to be installed are the flush head rivets. For all the others, I followered the general rule of putting the manufactured head on the thin material (which in hindsight maybe I should have reversed that for this bracket area)
 
Girraf said:
Only statement I can find on the drawing that speaks to a particular direction the rivet needs to be installed are the flush head rivets. For all the others, I followered the general rule of putting the manufactured head on the thin material (which in hindsight maybe I should have reversed that for this bracket area)
Click to expand...

Ya in the future account for thinnest material, ease of drilling if ever required, and clearance, then make your selection on which way the rivet should go.

I got these rivets with the no hole yolk, don't be afraid to grind them. If I had a dollar for every time I ground down a yolk I'd have like 4 dollars... :D
 
Girraf said:
Only statement I can find on the drawing that speaks to a particular direction the rivet needs to be installed are the flush head rivets. For all the others, I followered the general rule of putting the manufactured head on the thin material (which in hindsight maybe I should have reversed that for this bracket area)
Click to expand...

In general, a picture is still worth a 1000 words.

Detail picture "D" on sheet 5 (also called out on sheet 3) of the -7 plans shows the rivets installed the other way.

Remember "general rules" are overridden by specific manufacturer's instructions, aka the plans. :)
 
az_gila said:
In general, a picture is still worth a 1000 words.

Detail picture "D" on sheet 5 (also called out on sheet 3) of the -7 plans shows the rivets installed the other way.

Remember "general rules" are overridden by specific manufacturer's instructions, aka the plans. :)
Click to expand...

I definitely missed that on the horizontal stabilizer, but I didn?t run into issues there. My tight spot is on the vertical stab center rudder bracket, which is why I didn?t catch that detail since it?s on the elevator drawing and hadn?t made it to that sheet quite yet. Chalk one up to ?read ahead? I suppose but it?s difficult to foresee what will be important sometimes until you start handling parts.

I did manage to use the angle surface of my tungsten to set those 4 rivets. They?re not the best looking shop heads because I couldnt get the bar perfectly perpendicular but I think they?ll be acceptable.
 
I think that little angle on our tungsten bucking bars are of of the most useful, yet forgotten about faces.
 
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