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Where do I find FF-00098?

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Well Known Member
According to drawing #45, the FF-00098 is the lower cowl attach plate/bracket.
I cannot find this part anywhere and I don't see any instructions on how to make it.

I understand this was a change (from the use of hinge on the lower cowl) that happened around the time my finishing kit was being packaged and delivered. So, I'm not sure if this was something left out of my kit, or if I just can't find it. My drawings do not show the use of a hinge along the bottom. So, I either need to make the part or find out where I put it.

Anyway, if I'm supposed to make the part, can someone help me find the dimensions?

Thanks,
Ryan
 
Ok, maybe I have this figured out. Perhaps someone can confirm for me?

I have a call into Van's, but here's what I'm thinking:

I'm thinking the RV7 Taildragger and M1B engine with the smooth cowl utilizes the hinges and does not utilize the FF-00098 attach bracket with screws and that's why that bracket, along with the other FF-000xx brackets, were not included with my kit.

My thought is that in the taildragger configuration (exposed belly) with the FF-00098 bracket there would be some external visible screws at the lower cowl position. However, with the hinges there would be no visible hardware for a cleaner look.

Also, I verified that I received enough of the 1/8 hinge to complete all the hinge attach points. So, I'm thinking that I will go forward with the hinge attachment method for the lower cowl.

If someone here can confirm, that would be great. Also, I'll post an update when I hear back from Van's.

Thanks,
Ryan
 
I just did this the other day. Looked hi and low for these to figure out what they are, then finally discovered them in one of the sub-kits.

Don't seem to be able to attach the image today for some reason, but if you go to my build log there's a picture of them in the entry from 11-21-20

Also, just so you know, turns out the hole spacing isn't symmetrical down there, so make sure every hole is lined up before you match drill

Also, regarding your question above, they were included in my -7 fuselage kit.
 
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Well, I went forward with the hinge fab and install today. Tomorrow, I'll stumble over the FF-00098 in a sub kit. Just my luck!

Thanks for the replies.

Ryan
 
FF-00098 Missing

Here’s a copy of my communication with Van’s on this very topic:
————
Hello!

I’m finishing my RV-7A Slider with an IO-360 M1B engine and the retrofitted new nose gear.

According to DWG 45 (R3) the lower cowl does not use the hinge arrangement on the bottom, but rather a Cowl Attach Plate (FF-00098) with nutplates.

I have not been able to find this Cowl Attach Plate. Although it is referenced on DWG 45 (R3), it does not appear on the Parts List received with the Retrofit Nosegear, nor in the Firewall Forward or Finish Kit lists.

Is this to be fabricated? If so, where would I find the pattern?

Thanks for your help!

Best regards,

Leonard Westermeyer
Builder 74595

————

Reply:

The retrofit kit is for aircraft that were assumed flying or well into the finishing kit stages. These aircraft would have used the original cowl hinge installation so the FF-00098 plates are not included. If you want to update your kit you would have to order these separately.

Sterling

————

I ended up ordering 3 of these ($5 each) and used the third one as a template to drill the cowling.

Hope this is helpful!

Leonard Westermeyer
RV-7A “almost” completed.
 
Where did you find the FF-00098 part on Van's web store? I need to re-order two of them, and cannot find them at all on the store! They're pretty simple and I could probably order some 1/16" aluminum stock to make them, but I'd rather just buy them pre-punched for me and try again.
 
Retrofit Kit

<snip>

The retrofit kit is for aircraft that were assumed flying or well into the finishing kit stages. These aircraft would have used the original cowl hinge installation so the FF-00098 plates are not included. If you want to update your kit you would have to order these separately.

Sterling

<snip>

I'm building the same model. 7A SLider, IO-360-M1B, New gear and mount. I'm totally confused. I don't understand Sterling's response. Is the retrofit kit required?
Also, I don't have a DWG45(R3). I just got a new USB drive and it's not on it either. Sending an e-mail to Vans as well but insight would be appreciated.
 
Larry, I'm doing the non-retrofit way, and I managed to get all the paper drawings and updated construction manual pages. I don't remember which kit the updated documentation came with, though. Probably came with the gear if I had to guess.

You'll need an updated DWG 45 which describes the cowling installation. This drawing shows the nose wheel cutout and metal trim, the new style screw-in cowl attach plates, etc.

You'll also need an updated DWG 46A which shows the elastomer gear itself, and how to assemble and mount it. It is significantly different from the old style nose gear.

There may be other updated drawings, but those are the two main ones. I E-mailed Vans for PDF versions of them also, for my laptop, and they were happy to provide.

Here is a gotcha, maybe I'll add it to the RV7 gotcha thread: You will get two FF-00098 cowl attach plates in whatever kit they come in. You are apparently supposed to match drill them to the firewall flange and install them un-cut. The plans (DWG 45) show a "FF-00098 drill template" that looks like a trimmed down version of FF-00098, which you use to locate the cowl attach holes. Don't cut one of your actual FF-00098 attach plates to make this template! Make the template from a piece of scrap instead. Vans should have just included three and said cut one of them to make the drill template, but hey they saved us $5 or however much those things cost.
 
So, I don't know if this is helpful, but my RV7 fuselage was delivered back in July and the build instructions that came with it mentioned these in a couple of different places:

pg 8-8 "Adding fwd Fuselage"
pg 8-10 "Riveting the Forward Side Skins"

They are depicted on the FULL SIZE drawing number 28 revision 3. in zone A10 on the fwd end of the F-772 side skin and around zone D4 in Section View A-A.

The confusion here is that the full size print is now on revision 3, which which was published 4/30/19, but both my paper preview plans and what's on the memory stick are revision 2 which is from clear back at 12/6/04, a little over 16 years ago! If you're working from that vintage, no wonder they feel the need to have a supplemental drawing for replacing the hinges down there.
 
I asked Vans Support about this a couple of weeks ago. At that time the parts were not on the web site. You have to call to order them. They will also send you a drawing to make your own if you want. I'm just going to go ahead and order the parts from Vans though.

I was a little confused about the location of the F-00098 on the lower flange. It seemed like the position wasn't shown correctly on the drawings to me. Any thoughts or pics on this would be helpful.

I have an older Fuse kit but I did buy the new gear and I also bought a set of FFW drawings. In one or the other of these drawing packages I received the updated drawing which uses this method for the lower cowling mount.
 
Cowl Attach Hinge

This was indeed very confusing when I ran across it in my build a couple months ago and hence the reason for asking the question. However, since my kit (purchased about 1.5 years ago) was supplied with the hinge already I went ahead and installed it so that I could continue with the engine mount.

I can only assume the purpose for the new FF-00098 bracket is an upgrade from the hinge method? Maybe there's a history of the hinge cracking? Or, perhaps access to pull the pin was difficult?

If you guys are aware of cracking issues or know if the bracket constitutes a significant upgrade, I will probably reconsider before I start fitting the cowl.

For now, this is what I decided to do.

Thanks,
Ryan
 

Attachments

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I have no idea why they switched from the hinge to the bracket+screws. It seems like the "new" way to attach the cowl at the bottom now, so I didn't bother with the hinges. Ended up making a new pair of FF-00098 plates. They are just 1/16" aluminum plate.
 
New

I have no idea why they switched from the hinge to the bracket+screws. It seems like the "new" way to attach the cowl at the bottom now, so I didn't bother with the hinges. Ended up making a new pair of FF-00098 plates. They are just 1/16" aluminum plate.

I have an e-mail trade going with Sterling. I don't mind a change but I wish Vans would explain and provide the parts and plans. No paper plan and my new USB doesn't have the drawing. Sterling sent it but I still don't understand the reasoning or if I'm supposed to buy the parts and install per plan or go with the previous plans. What if this thread didn't pop up. I would be trucking along oblivious. Sorry. Just venting. I'll post to the Gotchas thread when it all makes sense.
Right now I'm lost.:confused:
 
Cracking on that hinge

I was talking to Vans support about an issue on my build and we got talking about some of the gotcha's that may creep up later in the build that I need to pay attention to. We got onto the subject about attaching the cowl and when I said i'm going to use skybolts rather than hinges, the recommendation I had was to use 3 or 4 skybolts along each side at the bottom of the cowl. The person I was talking with mentioned that there is considerable vibration in that area so using more skybolts was desirable.

I suspect this might be the reason why Van's is in the process of improving things in that area and hasn't fully implemented this improvement yet with a formal bulletin. Just my guess.
 
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Apology

I need to apologize. I found the plan on the USB and in my stack. I was looking at the corner and Date Drawn.
Note 3 clearly shows a revision date 04/30/2019
I found the FF-00096, FF-00097A & FF-00097B in inventory.
I think I understand the reason for FF-00098 now.

Last note sent to Vans Support...
Which is the best way to attach the cowl at that point.
Hinges or FF-00098 and screws?
Skybolt Fasteners? I have them for the cowl.
Inquiring minds on Vans Air Force want to know.
 
Vans response

Here is Sterling's reply

"I am glad to hear you found all of these parts. As for an answer on what is the best attachment I will leave this argument up to the good people of VAF to hash out. I like hinges myself as they are simple. I only have to remove two screws and I can remove on my cowling!

The FF parts in this new revision should have a much longer service life than the hinges as the lower firewall area will commonly work through hinges due to vibration."

The FF-00098 plates have to be ordered. Hinges, screws or Skybolts. Your choice. FF-00098 may be ordered from Vans if you go with the plans.
 
This is great information and I appreciate the follow up! The next time someone puts in a search on VAF for FF-00098, they will find this!

The new brackets are not a requirement, but a recommended improvement for longer service life. Got it!

Ryan
 
Amazing, I'm just going through riveting the FW hinges on so I can leave the engine mount on with landing gear (7 TD), this also came up in a conversation with Van's and I'm switching over the FF-00098 lower attach. I received the engineering dwg (attached below) from Van's and just fabricated a pair from from some .062. I do think the R3 drawing is confusing as it looks like a sandwich of two FF-00098 albeit one shorter but in fact is a drill template to help guide you when the cowl is on. Also note that there is also a shim between it and FF-00098 (in Dwg 45 R3 section S-S), I assume this is .02 as between the hinge FW. I did not have in my kit and used some .025 as a shim figuring .005 more thickness would not be a problem when the cowl is on and finished (I can't build to .005 tolerance anyway!). Note, Van's dimension are also tight, I left the length at 11" versus 10.568" specified and fits better.
 

Attachments

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Update, I riveted on (in my icebox garage) the new FF-00098 I fabricated and hinges to the forward edge of my 7 after dropping the mount and landing gear as a whole unit. I dimpled the fuselage skin, SS FW, spacer and countersunk the hinges and FF-0098. I will use the cowl (James) when I receive it and the template to locate the screw attach holes. I ran my hinge line up higher that called for and will trim off the lugs as needed once I have the cowl, I was not confident of hanging the engine without this completely riveted.

Untitled by Dave Hock, on Flickr
 
Thank you Dave for posting the details of FF-00098!
Saved me a bunch of time and head scratching.
Will be replacing the old style hinges on my 6A with these plates instead, before bolting on the engine mount.
 
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