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Two folding bikes in an RV-9A - success!

Lycosaurus

Well Known Member
Two folding bikes in an RV-9A (w/ tilt option) - Success!

Van's offers the Bike Friday Tikit that will fit an the back of an RV (I have not seen any photos, or how easy it is to load). I believe the price is $1000 each, and not sure what accessories come with it.

We opted for a lower cost version by using a Dahon Folding bike. The ones we bought have 20" wheels, fenders and panier (baggage rack). In order for these to fit, we had to remove the baggage racks from the bikes, and install fender supports for the rear fenders. The baggage racks can be carried in the plane, and then installed back on the bikes with 4 screws and an allen key at the destination.

The bikes we bought is the Dahon Speed D7 (7 speeds). Street price is about $420 US, or about $470 CDN. The Mariner D7 is similar, with different components that are more corrosion proof (marine environment). Other models might work as well, but it gets a little more spendy. I would have liked the models that have an integrated 8 speeds in the rear hub, but more $$.

In order for the bikes to fit, we needed to also remove the handle bars from the quick release stem. There was just no way we could fit both bikes in there without doing this. If you only need to travel with one bike... no problem.

One thing I must mention, and it will be obvious from the photos below. We have a sliding canopy, with a tilt option. I opted for not installing the holding mechanism for the tilt, but rather decided on a crude, but very functional bungee cord system that holds it up. So far so good. We also installed a 1/4" plywood floor, since the bikes' wheels will be making a point contact with the thin sheet aluminum floor.

IMG_1391.jpg


The two Dahon D7 bikes. This is actually from a short trip from Ottawa to Kingston Ontario. We cycled from the airport to Downtown, and later took a ferry to Wolfe Island for more sight-seeing. I'll be posting some more photos at some point. We decided not to bring the bike baggage racks this time, as it was a short day trip.


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This is an obligatory photo of me modeling the Dahons as well (equal air time).


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View of the tilt slider before loading the bikes.




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One bike folded. Note that the handle bar unit is removed from the quick release stem. Also, the seat is removed before loading, and stored separately.




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One bike loaded and safetied with bungie cords and straps. Note that we had to be careful not to have the wheels touch the flap mechanism (round weldment behind the seats). We basically have anchor points at the rear bulkhead to pull the wheels back. Will look into making a cover for that weldment, so we can safely load the baggage area and not worry that something will get caught in there.




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First view of two bikes, along with other baggage stuffed in that area. The bikes don't look so small anymore...




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Another baggage view. Tough to get a good picture. Don't mind the Fred Flintstone seats, as we are having Abby build us something more presentable. (Believe it or not, these pillow seats are very comfortable. Would not want to be in an accident though .... feathers all over the place :D)




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To be noted, is that we have added a rear of the bulkhead baggage compartment. We have statically tested it to 180 lbs, but have limited it to 30 lbs of baggage. Typically will put the lighter stuff back there. W&B is excellent, as we can be fully loaded with fuel, 100lbs of baggage, and 30 lbs auxiliary baggage and be within W&B at less than 1750 GW.
 
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how

How did you calculate the W&B for the auxillary baggage area? Since it is aft of the baggage area. In my 9A when I have 75 lbs in the baggage area it is within W&B, but it is a much different flying airplane. I haven't had a problem but I can "feel" the difference on both take off and landing. I like the extra space you created, but 100lbs and 30 additional #s back that far seems like a lot. At what weight point is your plane out of balance aft? Both in the baggage area and the auxillary area? just wondering?
 
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Forward C of G

Our plane has a most forward empty C of G. We need a minimum 110 lbs pilot (full fuel, no passenger, no baggage) to be within maximum forward C of G.

When Dan C. had his W&B data for the different planes and configurations, I calculated the options (prop, engine, etc) that would bring us to this most forward C of G. This basic empty weight configuration allows us full range loading capabilities.

Passenger and pilot: 280 lbs
Baggage 1: 100 lbs at 122 inches (we flew with 70 lbs)
Baggage 2: 30 lbs at 150 inches (we flew with 20 lbs)

Empty weight: 1070 lbs at 76.7 inches
Ramp weight (full fuel, 280lbs pilot/pass, max baggage weights of 130 lbs) is 1696 lbs at 83.3 inches
No fuel weight (280lbs pilot/pass, max baggage weights of 130 lbs) is 1480 at 84.3 inches

Aft C of G limit for the RV-9A is 84.4 inches.

Also note that we did not fly at those max weights during our trip, as our baggage 1 is loaded to about 70 lbs (bike and luggage), and baggage 2 at about 20 lbs).

I have an o-320, carb'd, Sensenich fp prop, mags. The strobe unit and ELT are under the baggage floor.

As for the difference in flight ... I can't say I noticed it in cruise. Upon landing, it does need just a little more airspeed, but I have AOA information from my Dynon that helps. Takeoffs are a little slower and lower climb rate ... but still out-performs the Cessnas I fly by a mile, even when they are configured for minimum weight :)
 
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Good reminder

I want to do the baggage extension too..I have a prop extension with a heavy Hartzell hanging off the end so I know I can put weight a ways back.

Out of interest could you not have run the harness cables underneath the floor that you constructed back there to stop then getting fouled up in the baggage?

Frank
 
We could have run the seat belt harness below the auxiliary baggage, however the cable angle up from the baggage area (3/4" below longeron height) would be steeper than what Van's had originally designed. I decided to keep the cable angle as close to stock as possible.

The type of baggage we put in there is soft, light. and small. It is quite easy to place these items so that the seatbelt cable does not interfere.
 
Alfio,

Thank you for sharing the information and picture. When we eventually go to Niagara Falls we should bike to the Rainbow bridge.

Now it is time for me to figure out what need to be done to fit mine.

Ted
 
Alfio - nice write up, but what's up with that git on the blue bike? And who said there was a need for equal air-time? I think most will agree that Shirley's the far more photogenic one of the pair... ;-)

OK, OK, enough beating up on Alfio for one day. Really glad to see OFM is carrying you two away on some nice adventures! That's one tightly packed baggage compartment with those bikes stowed - my bet is you spent a LOT of time figuring out how to get them squeezed in there. Glad to see it worked out for you.
 
Folding Bikes

I have a RV 7A and have been drooling over the Bike Friday's. They are expensive and wondering how easy they are to use and fold. Your report is quite timely and interesting. My problem like everyone else is most airports are about 2-3 miles from all the fun. A bike seems to be the ideal answer.

When I read your post, to load the bikes, remove the baggage support. I go my plane does not have a baggage support. Then I realized the baggage support was on the bike. The problem with making something idiot proof, is idiots are so ingenious.

Van's Air Force probably needs a critique of the various folding bikes.

Steve Anderson
RV 7A Flying
Lafayette, La.
 
Thanks so much for sharing. I am very keen on getting some folding bikes for my RV. There are so many great places around here to fly and bike. Down on the Georgia coast there are numerous locations (Jekyll Island, St. Simons Island,etc) and there are innumerable locations in Florida. Our recent trip to the Outer Banks, although awesome, would have been that much sweeter if we had our own bikes to haul and ride.

I'm still looking for the oh so elusive photos of a pair of the Bike Friday bicycles that Vans sells in the back of a side by side RV. I'm curious if it would still be possible shove a couple of small duffle bags under between the flap tube and seat back with the bikes wedged in there.
 
Lycosaurus,

How exactly have your configured your "extended baggage area door"? It appears there is a small hinged flap at the bottom, and a separate panel for the top, with slots for the belt anchor cables?
 
How exactly have your configured your "extended baggage area door"? It appears there is a small hinged flap at the bottom, and a separate panel for the top, with slots for the belt anchor cables?

There is a hinged door on the rear-most bulkhead, that is slotted for accepting the seatbelt cables, and is screwed-on to the bulkhead. The hinges are horizontal on the rear bottom floor of the baggage area. The cover can be removed should I wish to carry skis or snowboard. Some work is still required for securing skis/snowboard.

The forward baggage door is the original Van's cover. I have DZUS type fittings for quick removal, as well as cutting slots in there for the seatbelt. The lower baggage bulkhead cover was cut by about 2" so that it can be at longeron height. This height cut is basically replaced by the hinged panel you see in the photos. It supports the the seatbelt cables.

The whole floor is supported by two .125" angles, the front one being supported by the vertical baggage bulkhead post. Both of these angles are bolted to the longerons. There are two 0.063" angles connecting the .125" angles, as well as additional stringers to support the baggage floor.

I have tested the structure with a weight of over 180 lbs, assuring me it could support a stress of 6 G at 30 lbs.

Here are some photos.....

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IMG_0979.jpg
 
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... I'm curious if it would still be possible shove a couple of small duffle bags under between the flap tube and seat back with the bikes wedged in there.

Jamie,

Even with the way our bikes are positioned, you can stuff some bags and knapsack behind the seatback area before loading the bikes. There's still some room between the bikes too.

Tikits and Bromptons seem like really nice bikes... but never seen one in the flesh.

We're hoping to visit many airports and towns this way. We also bought a shoulder bag for them, that will hopefully allow us to use public transportation, and allow us to sneak them into our hotel room. We may give camping a try next year, and see how light we can pack.
 
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I'm wondering if I can get any bikes into my baggage area since I have a slider rather than a tip up canopy. Thoughts?
 
The pictures show a slider, with forward tipping option

I'm wondering if I can get any bikes into my baggage area since I have a slider rather than a tip up canopy. Thoughts?

You'll note that I also have a slider. I modified the slider so it tips forward to have better access to the baggage area.

I'm not sure if you can get these bicycles into a tip-up (i.e. non slider) rv.
 
jbrandv, can you get those into the slider without removing the seatbacks? I.e. between the seat back brace and the canopy?
 
Folding bikes in a slider

Yes, they fit nicely and you don't even have to lean the seats forward! I did however break the antenna on my emergency transponder that I put in the baggage area, but that was my fault. :D
 
Folding Bikes: Inspiration

Your post was timely as I was on the verge of ordering a Bike Friday but the cost seemed just a bit high. I looked at the Dahon bikes and for half you can get the Speed P8. I love bikes and bought an expensive racing bike that is 40 years old. But I will try this, as most of my touring initially will be solo and I can put it in the passenger seat with no problems.

This is a link to the bike I purchased. I like the red color and hope no one expects me to wear a clown suit when I ride it. I guess building an experimental airplane, you get use to people wondering about my sanity.

http://brandscycle.com/product/09-dahon-speed-p8-09-14009.htm
 
JbrandV, Is there a chance you can post some photos of the two bikes installed in the baggage area, and perhaps one photo of you riding or standing beside one? This seems like the answer I've been looking for.

Alternately, you can email me privately at [email protected]

Garry Stout
 
Same for a tip up

We got two of these to fit on our RV-9 with a slider top. They fit great and leave room for some luggage. Plus they are only ~$165 and you can get a nice bag to protect your interior aluminum. They only have 16" wheels but they still ride fine.

http://www.citizenbike.com/catalog.asp?product_category_id=1&product_id=10

Will these go in a standard tip up?..Either under the hoop or by folding the seat back down and sliding them under the bar?

Thanks

frank
 
Ok

I ordered 2 16" Citizen folding bikes.

The max height happens to be the same as a 5 gallon gas can (with spout) that i know will slide from behind the seat into the baggage area..Seems highly likely these things will fit into a tip up 2 seater.

Now just have to modify the baggage area to get the storage back..Another project..:)

Frank
 
Following Alfio's example I ordered two Dahon Speed P8 foldering bikes (20' wheels). After finished tip-up/slider mod, I loaded both bikes in my baggage compartment. I was able to load them side ways. It eliminates the potential interference of tires to the flap torque tube.

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Thanks Alfio for the tips.
 
Got 1 16" citizenTokyo

The Wifes of course..the second one will be here tomorrow.

A little bit heavy but pretty darned compact..I have visions of extending the baggage area back a bit so the bikes will line up front to back..Hope to install them by folding down the seat back and passing them under the crossbar.

The bikes are a bit low geared..OK for round town but need a bit more speed for the open road 5 mile into town trips.

Currently looking for a smaller rear cog..otherwise they ride great..:)

Frank
 
Citizen Tokyos

The two bikes I bought do fit front to back, albeit they do not pass under the rear cross brace

They do go over the top easily though.

I managed to find a freewheel (cogs at the back) with an 11 tooth smallest cog..this up gears them by 27% and makes them much more ridable between airport and town.

11 tooth freewheels are hard to find but I did find a reliable supply in Canada for about $25 each..A worthwhile upgrade I think

Frank
 
yet another bike

I just got a 16" Kent compact delivered to my door for $175.00 - 25 lbs.-folds to 27x24x15 - 6spd ... I'm quit impressed with it,fits easily in my 9A w/tip-up . I just bought one to check the quality and fitability(is that a word)??!! I'm thinking two will fit in nicely & will order second one soon !
search "Kent Compact folding bike" @ ebay stores
 
I just got a 16" Kent compact delivered to my door for $175.00 - 25 lbs.-folds to 27x24x15 - 6spd ... I'm quit impressed with it,fits easily in my 9A w/tip-up . I just bought one to check the quality and fitability(is that a word)??!! I'm thinking two will fit in nicely & will order second one soon !
search "Kent Compact folding bike" @ ebay stores

Good deal..I can't see what gearing it has on the back but you may find its to low geared if it has a 14tooth sprocket on the back like my Tokyo did..Let me know as I have a source for an 11tooth freewheel if thats what yours takes.

Shimano no longer make 11 tooth freewheels so they are hard to come buy.

Frank
 
Ritchey Breakaway

I would like to see if anyone has tried a Ritchey Breakaway in an RV?

The dimensions of a folded bike are 9"x26"x29. That is in a case.

http://www.ritcheylogic.com/dyn_category.php?k=97991[/URL]
 
Get "Yiked" !

Did you nitice that the weight of the Yike-bike is only approx. 10 kg. But that includes,..... yes as they specify it......... the air in the tires...!!!! :D

Regards, Tonny.
 
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