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GRT has a new way to do AOA ? Derived

Ironflight

VAF Moderator / Line Boy
Mentor
Back when I was building my -8, I thought quite a few times about installing an Angle of Attack indicator, but when it came time to make priority trades, it always came in just below the line. Later on, when I could have picked up a system, I didn?t want to go cutting into my wings (or wingtips) for pressure taps, or replace my pitot tube and run more plumbing?just lazy I guess! But still?.flying AOA is a really nice way to get the most out of your airplane when operating close to the edge, and I have kept my eyes open for a system that might be adaptable. And sure enough, good things DO come to those who wait!

GRT has been talking for awhile about a ?derived? AOA indication for their EFIS. Derived AOA means that it is computed using parameters from the flight computer rather than being directly sensed through a special probe or probes. While it can be argued that Derived AOA is not quite as accurate in a rapidly changing situation as sensed AOA, the difference is probably in the noise for our type of operations if the derived data algorithm is properly designed. (Derived AOA is, in fact, used in some very high speed aerospace vehicles that operate in regimes where probes would melt right off ? the Space Shuttle uses derived AOA all the way through entry until the Air Data Probes deploy about Mach 3.) Anyway?. I recently got the chance to start doing some testing of the GRT AOA system, and I must say that I am impressed!

Their system works on the HX EFIS displays, and looks much like a high end AOA indexer. It only appears (next to the airspeed tape) when AOA gets into a region of interest, such as approach, or high G loading. This is nice, as it doesn?t clutter up the display in normal cruising flight. The display gives you a filled green circle when you ae on approach AOA ? fall below it, and you get yellow Chevrons pointing up, telling you to pull, and if you get to high, you get red chevrons pointing down telling you to push. (Get high enough, and the word PUSH appears!). In addition, there is a red pitch limiter bar that appears in the center of the PFD and moves down towards the pitch lubber line as you get close to the stall. (After a couple of flights, I am very comfortable with the AOA display ? the pitch limiter and I are still working things out?.)

The system needs to be calibrated before you can use it, but this is very simple. You establish gliding flight with the power pulled back to idle and the flaps out. Pull back to a stall, recover, then slow down again, and when you get a knot or to above where you just stalled, you give the system a ?mark? by pushing a soft key, and it knows where the critical angle of attack is. You can then set the indexer up to maintain a factor above stall for approach ? I am using 1.3 Vso for now ? it allows 1.0 ? 1.4 I think.

After calibrating the system, I messed around in slow flight, and it was easy to see the system at work. Rolling into a turn and keeping the deck angle constant, the system showed an increasing AOA, just as you?d expect. Drop the nose, and you went back in to the green. Accelerating with power, the system showed decreasing AOA, and finally disappeared. A sharp pull towards an accelerated stall brought the indexer back up on the PFD, and showed the AOA increasing. I tried to get it to appear with an accelerated stall from a steep turn starting at about 130 knots, but hit 4.5 G?s without a buffet, and without a chute or G-suit, I decided I didn?t want to go further on the initial flight. Wince I got no buffet, I wasn?t surprised that I saw no high AOA indication.

Right now, this is preliminary software, but I think it shows real promise. When you consider that a good sensed AOA system can cost a bit shy of a thousand dollars, this is quite a benefit for folks with a GRT EFIS ? it will just come along with the new software when it is ready! No sensors, no plumbing, no wiring ? no sweat! The only problem I see so far with the current plan is that you sort of have to have your head ?down? to see it on the EFIS screen, at a time when you want to be head?s up. I mentioned to the guys at GRT that a cool accessory would be a little standalone display that could hook up to a serial line from the EFIS, and mount on the glare shield to display AOA ? that would be the Cat?s Meow! Even for a couple hundred bucks, it would be cheaper than a sensed system.

I am sure there is more development time to come on this, and I know that GRT doesn?t put stuff out there until they are sure it is ready and working, but it is fun to see what is coming down the line. Those folks who already fly with AOA systems know how useful they can be ? and getting one for free along with your EFIS ? that?s hard to beat!

Paul
 
Thanks for the heads up Paul. When they finally do come out with this do you think it will be just a software update or will it be a for-sale add-on? Did they indicate if this will work on all their units or just the HX?

I like the idea of having a separate display for the glare shield. A simple hole for the wire and some Velcro and it's good to go right where it should be.
 
Thanks for the heads up Paul. When they finally do come out with this do you think it will be just a software update or will it be a for-sale add-on? Did they indicate if this will work on all their units or just the HX?

Best I can tell, it seems that it will just be part of a new software drop, like all the other features they've added over the years. I don't know if this is just an HX feature or if it will be targeted to the other units (I don't know if it depends on the higher speed procesor or not).

Pics? I didn't have the recorder running wheh I was flying it the other day, so I'll have to try and do that next time. Right now, the "Winter Glop" appears to have closed in on Houston, so it'll probably be a couple of days....

Paul
 
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Flaps

Paul,

Does this system require a flap position sensor, or how does it deal with the changing camber due to flap deployment?

Pat
 
Thanks for the heads up Paul. When they finally do come out with this do you think it will be just a software update or will it be a for-sale add-on? Did they indicate if this will work on all their units or just the HX?

I like the idea of having a separate display for the glare shield. A simple hole for the wire and some Velcro and it's good to go right where it should be.

It might be quite simple to enhance the V-Speed ADS if GRT provides AoA information on a serial port. Of course "simple" means several weeks of software development and months of testing :).

ADS-vertical.jpg


fmi Vx Aviation web site

Vern
 
Still testing...

Here is an early shot of the GRT Derived AOA.

GRT%20HX%20AOA(1).gif


The calibration takes just a few minutes of flight time and just a few seconds to complete. In these screenshots the Pitch Limit bar is not shown.

We continue to get feedback from a few beta testers but results are looking very good.

Thanks for your interest!

Carlos Fernandez
Sales and Support
GRT Avionics
 
So, Carlos, is this going to work on my H1s??

Or like a few other goodies lately, only on the upgrade screens??
 
Paul,

Does this system require a flap position sensor, or how does it deal with the changing camber due to flap deployment?

Pat

I think that right now they are just working out the basic algorithms Pat - single configuration. I calibrated it with flaps down (approach configuration), which is where it would be most useful if you had to pick one or the other (flaps up or flaps down).

Paul
 
Paul,
how do you get connections like that? That is the type of work I do and would love to do it in my RV (once it is flying).
 
Maybe an Aural Warning?

If there was an aural tone output that could be wired into the intercom system that would allow you to be heads up and still get a warning to look at the display if you were approaching a warning zone.

Still a superb feature to add to an already great system.
 
If there was an aural tone output that could be wired into the intercom system that would allow you to be heads up and still get a warning to look at the display if you were approaching a warning zone.

Still a superb feature to add to an already great system.

I understand that they are looking to add audio AOA cues, and I'll be interested to see how well that works - of course, I think I'll have to finally wire up my ausio output from the EFIS, won't I...:rolleyes:

Paul
 
Audio output

Flying along a week ago, I heard a faint audio warning from traffic off my HX.
Asked Todd about it and he advised they were working on an 'external' fix for an amplified signal. Apparently the signal out was unintentionally 'unamplified'.
Id hold off wiring until they have a solution.
best,
 
simulated vs. dedicated AOA comparison

It would be very interesting to see a comparison between a dedicated AOA and the simulated AOA through the various flight regimes and different configurations of flaps.

It's quite amazing what we can do with software and computational power these days.
 
It would be very interesting to see a comparison between a dedicated AOA and the simulated AOA through the various flight regimes and different configurations of flaps.

It's quite amazing what we can do with software and computational power these days.

As soon as they let us "non-rock stars ;)" take a look at the new software, I'll be able to comment as I have a full AFS AOA installed as well.
 
Still works great!

@ ironflight, any update on this, as its now mid April.

The only update I can give you is that the beta software I have been flying is still working great, and I haven seen any problems with the AOA functions. i do see AOA indications popping up during acro flight, and they appear to be more-or-less indicating in the correct directions - although I have not had the time to do a full study to evaluate the system in that regime. I seriously doubt that would be a "design point" for the software anyway...;)

Very happy with it - and you'll have to ask GRT for a planned release date - I just fly 'em.

Paul
 
Asked GRT (Carlos?) about the release a week or two ago. The answer was 'before Sun'n Fun'.
 
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Finishing touches...

@ ironflight, any update on this, as its now mid April.

We were hoping to have the new software out before SNF but we wanted to wait and get as much in this next release as possible.
Looks like the new release for the Sport, Horizon and HX will be out just after Sun-N-Fun.

We added an additional feature to the HX that held us up a couple extra days. Stop by the booth and see what it is.

See you there!

Carlos Fernandez
GRT Avionics
 
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