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Brake Pads

timotb

Member
I just finished my 40 hours phase one testing on my RV7A and discovered problems turning right after my first passenger ride. I checked the pads and the rivet was starting to rub. I checked the other side, same story, just not quite as bad.

These pads are shot after only 40 hours hobbs?! Anyone else have this problem? Did Vans issue Parker Haniffin Cleveland brake pads with their kits circa 2010?

My experience in automotive is you can buy cheap pads that need replacing in a year or less or you can try to find better quality which should last 3 years. I think vans supplied the cheapest.

Ideas, suggestions??
 
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Did you follow the break in instructions? Did you use a lot of light braking during taxi? (Cleveland states that prolonged light braking can wear off the glaze.) without the glaze they will wear fast.
 
I find that on a new RV, and especially with a new pilot to the RV type if plane, the first set if pads goes relatively quickly. This appears to be due to the newness of a castering nose wheel and a tendency to ride the brakes. 40 hrs seems fast, but you may have more landings per hour than the typical RV in operation.

As for the brake pads themselves, I like to run the Rapco pads. But have had good experience with the Cleveland pads as well. If the wheels and brakes were new, then the pads would be Cleveland pads matching the Cleveland wheels.
 
I'm on my second set of pads in 900 hours. Your brakes are dragging, whether because of a mechanical problem or heavy feet...
 
I'm on my second set of pads in 900 hours. Your brakes are dragging, whether because of a mechanical problem or heavy feet...

Kyle is probably right. As a reference point I have 67 hours on mine and after quite a bit of short field practice I expected to see some wear. I have brake dust all inside the wheelpant but no visible wear on the pads yet.
 
I just inspected mine on my 9A after 150 hours and they have plenty of life left. Now, the original tires, that's another story!
 
As a CFI, I get to ride with a fair number of different pilots. The large majority of them ride the brakes during taxi, especially in the RV series aircraft.

When I first notice it, and ask if they are riding the brakes, they always say "No, I'm not".

But after about the third reminder, I ask them to completely remove their feet from the rudders, and, lo! and behold!, the aircraft accelerates. So then I tell them to pull the throttle back. Only then do they realize that they have been riding the brakes.

Pretty common, in my experience.

Another issue could be that your brake pedals aren't fully retracting when you release them. Might need stronger springs on the master cylinders.

My $0.02 YMMV
 
Put your feet on the tubes on the side of the pedals, that will ensure you are not riding the brakes. 40 hours does seem short.

Pete
 
Data point: My brakes lasted 200 hours, and could've gone another 25 before the rivet hit...maybe even 50. I probably average a landing every 45 minutes.

That said, I *DO* ride my brakes a bit when I taxi. Just helps with control. But I don't ride them hard...not sure how to describe it...without riding them, my taxi speed would be a little over 20 mph...I ride them enough to keep it around 17 or so.

The other thing is, I don't usually hit the brakes on landing...I let it roll out. It slows down pretty quick when you hold the stick back. ;)
 
Yes, I think you are all right....I've been riding the brakes. My idle is set a bit fast (1150). Going to turn it down. Need to have about 1500 rpm for the 30-60 seconds or the engine will quit (YIO-360-M1B). Also, Ive been practicing short field landings using minimum runway. These all explain it.

Tried to follow the "brake in" procedure. Probably didn't do it right or poorly. Called Cleveland and they suggest to rough up the pads with sandpaper in the beginning of flight testing after a complaint the brakes would not grab securely and took a lot of muscle to apply. Barely can hold the aircraft during run up at 2000rpm. Never been able to lock the brakes even if I wanted.

Just found out Matco is what vans been issuing since circa 2010. Three rivets per pad. I have Clevelands.

Thanks to everyone.....my problem is diagnosed.
 
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...I see some places are just selling the pads ($13 a piece on ebay) and you have remove and re-rivet. Don't want a cheap pad. I think they are Cleveland brakes Vans issued. Three rivets per pad. I think the part number is 066-14100. Not sure.

Remove and re-rivet is what I have always done and is very easy with the proper tool. Don't know anything about buying the pads from e-Bay though.
 
Brake pads

Aircraft Spruce sells a set of 4 plus rivets for around $30 as does Van's. I've been using them for 11 years and have never had a "quality" issue. For a short time Van's was selling liners that didn't have the built-in wear indicator, only a chamfered edge that was very hard to judge the wear.
 
Either Rapco or Cleveland pads will work fine.
If the brakes won't hold during runup, you need to re-condition them. Read the procedure on either Cleveland's or Rapco's web site. If you taxi riding your brakes you may have to regularly go thru this procedure.
 
matco vs cleveland pads

Has anyone with Cleveland 5.00x5 brakes tried retrofitting Cleveland brake linings AND plates with Matco equivalents?

I'm trying to have a complete set of brake pads with plates ready for a quick change out when necessary.

Matco has a full set for $70 see: http://www.matcomfg.com/SwiftLineKitforBE5BrakeExternalCaliper-idv-3423-12.html

Try and do the same with Cleveland and you have to buy all the parts individually from a distributor like Spruce for $235 (item numbers 11-14) see: http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/lgpages/500x5brake.php
 
My idle is set a bit fast (1150). Going to turn it down. Need to have about 1500 rpm for the 30-60 seconds or the engine will quit (YIO-360-M1B).

This is WAY too high for idle. Do you mean when you retard the throttle all the way to idle, it is at 1150? Mine will idle at around 650-700.

What do you mean you "need to have about 1500 rpm for the 30-60 seconds or the engine will quit"? Which 30-60 seconds are you talking about? Engine start? ???

Something sounds out of whack with your engine adjustments here, but more info is needed...
 
Timotb

I had the same issue when I first flew my RV8 back in 2005. The original Cleveland brake pads had no wear indicators and personally I think they were just cheap pads used to keep the wheel package price down. They lasted a little over 50 hours, and no I was not dragging the brakes and use very little brake on landing. I switched to the Rapco pads (Vans and Aircraft Spruce carry them among others) and have only had to replace them once in the next 500+ hours. Same pilot, same technique. Don't assume it's the pilot. Pads are cheap, rotors are not. Change the pads.

Chris
 
Aside from the wear variability of various mfgr pads, I suspect the big issue is the fast idle speed. At anything over 800 rpm, my Nine-A requires brakes or it will run away like a scalded dog. Once under 800 rpm, it's docile and controllable with rudder and only occasional brake for x-wind correction.
 
Yes, I am working on the idle issue. Got it down to 850 rpm. My engine is fuel injected and even when warmed up it sounds like its going to quit after the first 30-60 seconds after engine start. Talking to the fuel injection people at Precision, Peter thinks its still running lean. Need to rich the idle-mixture.

I like the suggestion above regarding using better pads (rapco?) At the moment I'm looking to buy a set of Cleveland pressure and back plates to make a ready to install pad and plate, in and out, for both wheels.

Anyone have two 063-00500 and two 064-00500 plates to sell for something reasonable?
 
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