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transition training in RV-12

E

edward7048

Well Known Member
I am looking for some one who can give transition training in a RV-12
in the middle of the U.S., #361 is about ready to fly but insurance
needs me to have some training in a RV-12.
 
You can contact John Albury at [email protected]. He is in Texas. That's pretty much the southern middle.

He does RV-12 training. Otherwise you'll have to go see Mike Seager out at the factory.
 
Transition Training

Looking for a ride or transition training in the 12. Currently fly a 9A. Am told by Vans that the 12 flys much like a 9. Live in SC - Mitch, can you help? Or is there someone closer? Thanks. Ready for engine start.

Doug Dahl
 
The 9 does indeed fly like the -12. Just a little lighter input on the stick, and a little more responsive. You'll do fine. :D
 
Geico,

Your second sentence is a bit vague. Are you saying the RV-9 is a little lighter input on the stick and a little more responsive than the RV-12? Or are you saying the opposite?

DAR Airworthiness Inspection this Saturday, May 19, 2012. First flight is imminent.

Catbird
 
Pitch change

The biggest difference between the -12 and any other low-wing airplane I've flown (and there aren't THAT many) is the pitch change when flaps are are added or retracted. Much more like a C-170's barn doors in that respect. Apparently has to do with the fact they're full-span. The other difference is that if you're above 55 knots on final you'll need a lot of runway. Transition training is HIGHLY recommended if you've been flying Brand C or P-- the 12 flies a lot like a Grumman (except for pitch changew/flap).

Wayne 143WM
 
Catbird said:
Geico,

Your second sentence is a bit vague. Are you saying the RV-9 is a little lighter input on the stick and a little more responsive than the RV-12? Or are you saying the opposite?

DAR Airworthiness Inspection this Saturday, May 19, 2012. First flight is imminent.

Catbird
Click to expand...

For me personally, the largest transition issue was learning the throttle control system used for the Rotax. It is spring loaded to go full power unless locked. That went against all my muscle memory. Learn how that puppy works during your taxi tests. My final best solution was to operate the "push/pull" with my palm around the end while my single index finger rests on the locking "turn" so that I can lock and unlock at anytime instantly without moving my finger more than a half inch. First time you take your hand off the throttle without locking it you'll get smart real quick.

Pete
 
I agree w/ peterk , that throttle is backwards to everything I am used too. After cert. I am putting a lighter spring on. Just finished W&B and have some taxi time, and the free castor nosewheel is easier to figure out than the throttle control is.
 
Peterk said:
For me personally, the largest transition issue was learning the throttle control system used for the Rotax. It is spring loaded to go full power unless locked. That went against all my muscle memory. Learn how that puppy works during your taxi tests. My final best solution was to operate the "push/pull" with my palm around the end while my single index finger rests on the locking "turn" so that I can lock and unlock at anytime instantly without moving my finger more than a half inch. First time you take your hand off the throttle without locking it you'll get smart real quick.

Pete
Click to expand...

I just want to say that it is not a Rotax "feature" this is how Vans implemented it. It is the one thing I am apprehensive about, I understand the reasoning but those locks are sometimes hard to loosen especially when your hands are cold. The Remos uses a similar lock but no throttle springs and the one I fly you have to really tighten to stop the throttle from creeping out.

Peter
 
pietermk said:
I just want to say that it is not a Rotax "feature" this is how Vans implemented it. It is the one thing I am apprehensive about, I understand the reasoning but those locks are sometimes hard to loosen especially when your hands are cold. The Remos uses a similar lock but no throttle springs and the one I fly you have to really tighten to stop the throttle from creeping out.

Peter
Click to expand...

No. It is a Rotax "feature". It is specifically addressed in the Rotax 912ULS Installation Manual. It is part of the carburetor set-up...full throttle warnings included. Van's apparently decided to leave well enough alone. I have no idea what Remos did but it is a certified SLSA and bound by Rotax to use only their certified technicians. You might ask how they got permission to change it.
 
Two different "Features"

The super strong springs are supplied by Rotax with the engine.
The throttle cable is supplied by Van's.
Joe Gores
 
Softer Springs

The suoer-strong springs that come with the RV-12 installation were made either for Van's or Rotax by McFarlane Aviation. They have a much softer set available strictly for the '12-- I forget the part number but they'll know what you're talking about. They'll still pull the throttle open in you turn loose of it, but not nearly as fast. They have the same "straight" lengths as the originals and Are "clocked" the same.

Wayne 143WM
 
yankee-flyer said:
The suoer-strong springs that come with the RV-12 installation were made either for Van's or Rotax by McFarlane Aviation. They have a much softer set available strictly for the '12-- I forget the part number but they'll know what you're talking about. They'll still pull the throttle open in you turn loose of it, but not nearly as fast. They have the same "straight" lengths as the originals and Are "clocked" the same.

Wayne 143WM
Click to expand...

McFarlane lists two different part numbers with the same description. Does anybody know which is the softer spring?

http://www.mcfarlane-aviation.com/SearchResults.aspx?ID=90604252&SearchType=Keyword&Search=rotax&
 
I'll stick with the factory spring...Rotax that is. It is only a transition issue because it's different/not dangerous...or even difficult to work with. In fact, if my throttle breaks on take off, my preference would most certainly be the spring that opens the throttle the fastest.

Pete
 
yankee-flyer said:
The suoer-strong springs that come with the RV-12 installation were made either for Van's or Rotax by McFarlane Aviation.
Click to expand...

This statement is false.

The engines are supplied to RV-12 builders by Van's, configured as built and delivered by Rotax. The installed springs are the standard part that you would get if you ordered springs using teh Rotax Illustrated Parts Cat.

The only things specifically done to the engines for installation on an RV-12 are that they get assembled with the water pump inlet housing pre-installed in the correct orientation, and a main water pump housing with outlet pipes pointing directly forward.
 
I'm in favour of sticking to the Rotax spec'ed engine, but that doesn't alter the fact that some builders don't have a problem with setting the throttle friction, and others do. My throttle creeps forward at all revs below about 4500 no matter how tight I twist the friction grip.

It's not much fun on a go-around after tightening the throttle as much as possible to keep the revs low for landing.

I wish I could change something to make this a little more user-friendly.

Cheers...Keith
 
throttle friction

Hi Keith,
I found 3 things worth doing:
Replace the springs with the softer McFarlane alternatives
Replace the leather packing washers, the original ones are probably too dry and hard
Put a little antiseize grease on the thread for the knurled knob to eliminate the possibility of galling in the aluminium thead.

Get your throttle working properly and you will be able to relax more on final.
Rod
 
This is a great set of messages, but it's too bad it got buried in a thread labeled "transition training" about looking for a CFI. I wish it could be sprung out into a thread with a better title. I only found it by accident after wondering why there were so many pages about finding an instructor.

I agree with the posters who dislike the throttle. I think it sucks. If your car operated this way, you'd have one of those "uncommanded accelerations." Humans should not have to "learn" to cope with and accept some quirk of the machine - machines should be designed and built to accomodate humans.

Bob Bogash
N737G
 
Missed you at my Kelly Johnson talk at the Museum Saturday, Anthony. You missed (another) good one.....

Roberto
N737G

P.S. Roger the past threads - have perused them before - might have even posted on them!
 
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